Indyref 2 (2)

[Kirk]

20 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

They will have to out run my husband as this is going to supplement his pension. 

😅 junkies usually have their trusty bikes, i hope he is prepared 

[Squirrelhumper]

20 minutes ago, aaid said:

State of this.   
 

 

Think I can spot Malcolm.

[exile]

10 hours ago, Squirrelhumper said:

Salmond living on lala land if he thinks this'll boost Alba vote share.

I don't see what Alba have to gain at all. Any new leader likely to be a fresh start.

Those who hate Nicola Sturgeon because of Alex Salmond, who to they hate now? 

[ParisInAKilt]

9 minutes ago, exile said:

I don't see what Alba have to gain at all. Any new leader likely to be a fresh start.

Those who hate Nicola Sturgeon because of Alex Salmond, who to they hate now? 

Themselves? 

[ParisInAKilt]

7 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

You now don't need to imagine what would happen if she was ousted as you are going to witness it in real time

Independence is now dead as far as i can see - well in my lifetime anyway

The crawing of Alba and Unionists is sickening - even "on the fence" Henry McLeish is back to being a full blown Unionist that he always was

It doesn't matter who is installed as leader and what strategy for Independence is proposed - it will fail

If it’s dead now then it was never really alive.

Maybe I’m naive but I think a yes vote could win if there was a similar campaign like last time, hard to see how that comes about though. 

[Squirrelhumper]

14 minutes ago, exile said:

I don't see what Alba have to gain at all. Any new leader likely to be a fresh start.

Those who hate Nicola Sturgeon because of Alex Salmond, who to they hate now? 

In the case of Wings, he'll continue to hate scotland. 

Edited February 15, 2023 by Squirrelhumper

[Ally Bongo]

20 minutes ago, exile said:

I don't see what Alba have to gain at all. Any new leader likely to be a fresh start.

Those who hate Nicola Sturgeon because of Alex Salmond, who to they hate now? 

Angus Robertson

[exile]

15 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

Angus Robertson

He is probably as likely to have as broad appeal as anyone, meaning, people to be actually won over to independence.

Hard to see Mr Salmond or Alba winning any new people over to independence. 

Edited February 15, 2023 by exile

[Ally Bongo]

21 minutes ago, exile said:

He is probably as likely to have as broad appeal as anyone, meaning, people to be actually won over to independence.

Hard to see Mr Salmond or Alba winning any new people over to independence. 

Yes but Wings and Alba hate him possibly more than they hate Sturgeon due to "getting Alex Salmond"

I think it is between Kate Forbes (unsure if she will stand) and Angus Robertson (been his plan for a while)

Phillipa Whitford is a wild card

I would really need to know where they stand on achieving Independence and more to the point who wants to kick the can down the road

[Orraloon]

1 hour ago, Squirrelhumper said:

Think I can spot Malcolm.

😂😂😂

[AlfieMoon]

27 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

Yes but Wings and Alba hate him possibly more than they hate Sturgeon due to "getting Alex Salmond"

I think it is between Kate Forbes (unsure if she will stand) and Angus Robertson (been his plan for a while)

Phillipa Whitford is a wild card

I would really need to know where they stand on achieving Independence and more to the point who wants to kick the can down the road

I’d be happy with Robertson if the loony fringe can be contained. Him with Forbes as deputy allowing her to grow and share the spotlight. 
 

 

[Toepoke]

Thought the ITN news coverage from Edinburgh was good. Bradby and Peston were actually quite reverential. Clearly a significant political moment.

[scotlad]

4 hours ago, Kirk said:

Yeah that's exactly it, people will moan at first but get used to it. When I first went to canada it took me a while to get used to it and defos moaned too. But Eventually you get on with it. You will also notice junkies etc cleaning the streets as they will get money for the cans etc they pick up.

I noticed that in Copenhagen too when I was there a few years ago. At first I thought they were collecting bottles in the hope of finding some discarded Tuborg to drink until I saw them returning the empty bottles to off sales.

2 hours ago, aaid said:

State of this.   
 

 

Sad bastards. 😂

[Ally Bongo]

10 minutes ago, AlfieMoon said:

I’d be happy with Robertson if the loony fringe can be contained. Him with Forbes as deputy allowing her to grow and share the spotlight. 
 

 

Seeing some of the comments on twitter would depress the fuck out of you - even more than i already am.

Have never really been a Salmond/Sturgeon/SNP fanboy - biased sure - and i loved Nicola at the beginning until Brexit but i am a bit gutted about today

Many dont want Robertson as he is part of the Murrell clique and has a past that they dont want to talk about

Many dont want Forbes as she is a Staunch Presbyterian even though im sure she has already said her personal beliefs about Gay marriage and GRA were just that and would not come before the party 

The SNP might actually be fucked

[Ally Bongo]

3 hours ago, aaid said:

State of this.   
 

 

I bet almost all of those 50 cunts would be worse off if it wasn't for Nicola Sturgeon and SNP Policies

Fucking scumbags

[brant grebner]

So from godawful social media and here the gist of the big Yes problem is

"the SNP need to apologise to ALBA for betraying Scotland and destroying the declaration of Arbroath"
and
"the SNP need to elect Alex Salmond for getting him the gaol or else"
and
"All the SNP want to do is rape kids and sex change them"  is the standard viewpoint of an Albist

while
"ALBA and Wings took out Sturgeon and they hate all Scotland"
and
"We could elect a leader that would unite much of the disparate Yes movement, but fuck that. That's what ALBA want" 
and
"ALBA are responsible for the death of a transwoman in Liverpool and probably Emmett Till too" is the SNP borg view

The entire Yes movement on all sides has degenerated in to a bunch of cretinous spoiled brats since Brexit.

It's naebdy' fault. It's been caused by social media.

Social media has created massive mental illness and drives it even more.

Personally, I got banned off Twitter for posting something ghastly about Donald Trump years ago and it was the best thing

I got my account back under Musk and went through it.

It was truly offensive and a lot of the things I'd said I no longer agree with or really find amusing.

I deleted it and have no desire to use it or any other social media

It is genuinely toxic.

Look at how people refer to each other on this thread - awbdy is a "cunt" n it's no the Scottish way of unsing "cunt"

Online antagonism has been exacerbated by it, and people rarely approach any subject in a manner beyond flippant.

Now, awbdy wants independence.

There's about 6 cunts in Alba.
Three of them have no got any teeth in their gubs.
There's a baldy wan n a releasy Megrahi wan.

That's about it.

Oh aye, there's the touchy feely fella n his wee Jasmina bit on the side thit used tae be a Tory or a Lib Dem but now self identifies as an Albist

They didnae "take out Sturgeon".

Nae cunt listens to them.

The Evening Standard is a London paper that ran a poll 3 days ago showing 42 per cent wanted her to stand down

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/nicola-sturgeon-scotland-westminster-prime-minister-first-minister-b1059691.html

It's part of a concerted UK attack - the Tory "war on woke"

"Woke" [for want of any better expression] was a trap and the SNP fell in it because nae cunt did any safe guarding on the 100K "Yes" supporters that signed up when David Cameron was gleefully announcing English Votes for English Laws.

It's a lazy short hand way to explain the well-intentioned but utterly asinine secular American social media religion/atheist belief system that has replaced institutional religion in the West.

People don't believe in God and they like to put their real names on social media and we all love to be part of a tribe so to identify as a good person you stick wee emojis next to your name to show the causes you support in a vacuous way, and you put your pronouns so someone doesn't offend you in a conversation you're not part of by accidentally calling you "she" without checking when your name is Barbara and your profile picture is you giving birth.

Politicians love it because you can espouse it on social media and then get an immediate dopamine boost when all your wee followers like it and retweet it in their wee bubbles n it blows up n ye get aw excited in a way that a soundbite never could, and politicians are all narcissists with a fucked up root chakra that makes their pervert switch never go off so they're aye having a tug on a bus when you're liking their latest dogshit twitter haiku.

Alan Bissett made a prediction years ago about how a No Vote would go.

He got it wrong because he didn't factor in "Woke"

"Woke" was the SNP mitigation strategy to dealing with Tory austerity when they ran out of old Labour policies to nick, they went to Finland for the Baby Box then Trump hit.

We all fell for it - Trump the evil man who would start every war. Didnae happen, but Trump Derangement Syndrome had already kicked in in America and the SNP headed there at the worst possible time to cherry pick policy ideas.

It started to become obvious during the Brexit campaigns that The SNP were using US Democrat slogans and gradually the SNP became more and more vacuous.

The final straw for me came when Sturgeon accepted "now is not the time", after that it was arguing in real life with other Yes supporters, but continued to vote SNP albeit grudingly.

Wouldn't touch the Greens because they've been open about the fact that they're 50/50 on independence and if you offered them localism they'd take that over independence.

Alba are going nowhere but I may vote for them on the list depending on who the next SNP leader is.

For all the had wringing and finger pointing and Yes infighting [which really serves no fucking purpose other than allowing the British Empire to keep up as their nuclear arms dump while they ratchet up the WW3 rhetoric and likelihood], remember this - Sturgeon was given the golden opportunity of Yes at consistently above 50 per cent, 125K membership and had to fight a Tory party eating itself and forcing upon us Brexit, Austerity, Covid and the entire PMships of Boris Johnson, Theresa May and Liz Truss.

She never went to a single AUOB march and she tweeted more about Emma Raducanu than independence in 2021

As for the notion that she was playing it carefully but slowly or "time is on her side", Scotland's National Strategy for Economic Transformation - Delivery Plans October 2022 for 2030

https://archive.is/bhJb6

"Almost half of inward migration to Scotland comes from the rest of the UK (rUK) and the NSET highlights that a 25% increase in people relocating from the rest of the UK to Scotland would double net migration and add 100,000 people to Scotland's labour pool over the course of this strategy."

SNP strategy is add that to the already 50K plus PA white settlers currently buying up all the houses in Scotland

Time wisnae on her side. When Theresa May said "now is not the time" it was the time

But, we do still have time as long as the new SNP leader is not the candidate that the UK media push.

Pick the wrong one and Scotland really is gone.

Remember who the enemy is FFS

[Caledonian Craig]

The poor unionist bastards just do not get it.

The push/desire for independence was not done as support for Salmond or Sturgeon. Both have led and left and the independence movement will go on rattling their political parties and political idols. The desire for independence dors not diminish because of the departure of a political leader. Cupid stunts.

[vanderark14]

9 hours ago, Hertsscot said:

The only people I've personally heard gloating today were 3 men, all over the age of 70. If anybody really thinks Scotland would have been better served with Sarwar, Ross, Harvey or Cole-Hamilton then they're really living in cloud cuckoo land. If anybody thinks Scotland is better served under Sunak or Starmer or whatever non-entity is currently Lib Dem leader then they're also living in cloud cuckoo land!

I know a few up in the north east who are happy at this news. They are in two categories, died in the wool huns who vote based on the football club they support and the other category is people who believe sturgeon was trying to destroy the oil industry 

Edited February 16, 2023 by vanderark14

[TDYER63]

4 hours ago, brant grebner said:

So from godawful social media and here the gist of the big Yes problem is

"the SNP need to apologise to ALBA for betraying Scotland and destroying the declaration of Arbroath"
and
"the SNP need to elect Alex Salmond for getting him the gaol or else"
and
"All the SNP want to do is rape kids and sex change them"  is the standard viewpoint of an Albist

while
"ALBA and Wings took out Sturgeon and they hate all Scotland"
and
"We could elect a leader that would unite much of the disparate Yes movement, but fuck that. That's what ALBA want" 
and
"ALBA are responsible for the death of a transwoman in Liverpool and probably Emmett Till too" is the SNP borg view

The entire Yes movement on all sides has degenerated in to a bunch of cretinous spoiled brats since Brexit.

It's naebdy' fault. It's been caused by social media.

Social media has created massive mental illness and drives it even more.

Personally, I got banned off Twitter for posting something ghastly about Donald Trump years ago and it was the best thing

I got my account back under Musk and went through it.

It was truly offensive and a lot of the things I'd said I no longer agree with or really find amusing.

I deleted it and have no desire to use it or any other social media

It is genuinely toxic.

Look at how people refer to each other on this thread - awbdy is a "cunt" n it's no the Scottish way of unsing "cunt"

Online antagonism has been exacerbated by it, and people rarely approach any subject in a manner beyond flippant.

Now, awbdy wants independence.

There's about 6 cunts in Alba.
Three of them have no got any teeth in their gubs.
There's a baldy wan n a releasy Megrahi wan.

That's about it.

Oh aye, there's the touchy feely fella n his wee Jasmina bit on the side thit used tae be a Tory or a Lib Dem but now self identifies as an Albist

They didnae "take out Sturgeon".

Nae cunt listens to them.

The Evening Standard is a London paper that ran a poll 3 days ago showing 42 per cent wanted her to stand down

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/nicola-sturgeon-scotland-westminster-prime-minister-first-minister-b1059691.html

It's part of a concerted UK attack - the Tory "war on woke"

"Woke" [for want of any better expression] was a trap and the SNP fell in it because nae cunt did any safe guarding on the 100K "Yes" supporters that signed up when David Cameron was gleefully announcing English Votes for English Laws.

It's a lazy short hand way to explain the well-intentioned but utterly asinine secular American social media religion/atheist belief system that has replaced institutional religion in the West.

People don't believe in God and they like to put their real names on social media and we all love to be part of a tribe so to identify as a good person you stick wee emojis next to your name to show the causes you support in a vacuous way, and you put your pronouns so someone doesn't offend you in a conversation you're not part of by accidentally calling you "she" without checking when your name is Barbara and your profile picture is you giving birth.

Politicians love it because you can espouse it on social media and then get an immediate dopamine boost when all your wee followers like it and retweet it in their wee bubbles n it blows up n ye get aw excited in a way that a soundbite never could, and politicians are all narcissists with a fucked up root chakra that makes their pervert switch never go off so they're aye having a tug on a bus when you're liking their latest dogshit twitter haiku.

Alan Bissett made a prediction years ago about how a No Vote would go.

He got it wrong because he didn't factor in "Woke"

"Woke" was the SNP mitigation strategy to dealing with Tory austerity when they ran out of old Labour policies to nick, they went to Finland for the Baby Box then Trump hit.

We all fell for it - Trump the evil man who would start every war. Didnae happen, but Trump Derangement Syndrome had already kicked in in America and the SNP headed there at the worst possible time to cherry pick policy ideas.

It started to become obvious during the Brexit campaigns that The SNP were using US Democrat slogans and gradually the SNP became more and more vacuous.

The final straw for me came when Sturgeon accepted "now is not the time", after that it was arguing in real life with other Yes supporters, but continued to vote SNP albeit grudingly.

Wouldn't touch the Greens because they've been open about the fact that they're 50/50 on independence and if you offered them localism they'd take that over independence.

Alba are going nowhere but I may vote for them on the list depending on who the next SNP leader is.

For all the had wringing and finger pointing and Yes infighting [which really serves no fucking purpose other than allowing the British Empire to keep up as their nuclear arms dump while they ratchet up the WW3 rhetoric and likelihood], remember this - Sturgeon was given the golden opportunity of Yes at consistently above 50 per cent, 125K membership and had to fight a Tory party eating itself and forcing upon us Brexit, Austerity, Covid and the entire PMships of Boris Johnson, Theresa May and Liz Truss.

She never went to a single AUOB march and she tweeted more about Emma Raducanu than independence in 2021

As for the notion that she was playing it carefully but slowly or "time is on her side", Scotland's National Strategy for Economic Transformation - Delivery Plans October 2022 for 2030

https://archive.is/bhJb6

"Almost half of inward migration to Scotland comes from the rest of the UK (rUK) and the NSET highlights that a 25% increase in people relocating from the rest of the UK to Scotland would double net migration and add 100,000 people to Scotland's labour pool over the course of this strategy."

SNP strategy is add that to the already 50K plus PA white settlers currently buying up all the houses in Scotland

Time wisnae on her side. When Theresa May said "now is not the time" it was the time

But, we do still have time as long as the new SNP leader is not the candidate that the UK media push.

Pick the wrong one and Scotland really is gone.

Remember who the enemy is FFS

If its any consolation for your you haven’t lost your sense of humour in your social media sabbatical thats for sure. 
I didn’t know whether to laugh, applaud or cry reading that. Its hard to argue with a lot of it. 

[TDYER63]

The first few polls following this news will be interesting. If there is a bounce from the recent Ashcroft poll I would say there is still a good base for independence or NS was putting people off. If it languishes then the momentum may have gone and/or people may not be confident that another FM has the ability to take us there. 

[exile]

Whoever gets the job, independence is currently snookered. As in blocked, unreachable, not in play. That was Nicola Sturgeon's problem and now it will be someone else's. It needs some ingenuity; for whoever is to deliver independence. By ingenuity I mean someone who can more than just run a devolved country. Whether that'll be the next person, I don't know. But if it is the next person, then changing leader won't be bad for independence. 

 

[exile]

By ingenuity I include new ways of finding or manoeuvering solutions that didn't appear to exist within the existing framework. I start to thinking of Joanna. Cherry, if she has it. I know she has several reasons against her, and I am not saying I particular 'like' her. But since this morning I start to think she has something to her, that whoever wins needs to have. (Being egotistical and 'not a team player' are not fatal flaws here). Didn't she help or lead the proroguing affair and score a rare hit against the UK Govt?

You might say the leader can't be leader from Westminster but I would say why not? Things need shaking up.

Whoever they are, having the leader in WM could keep the leader's eye very much on the independence ball. The leader could be having a pop at the UK PM every week. Generate noise, generate news. Attack what the UK Govt is doing to Scotland. Someone else can lead devo from Holyrood and run the trains and schools, someone else can swat away the Rosses and Sarwars, It does not to be the independence leader's job to do that.  

The movement needs all the talents. Have someone good at PR running Holyrood, and have a hellraiser in Westminster. 

And it would halve the flak. One to tackle the London media, one to tackle the Scottish media.

A double act doesn't work too badly in NI. Michelle for devo, Mary Lou for fighting London rule.

[aaid]

9 minutes ago, exile said:

By ingenuity I include new ways of finding or manoeuvering solutions that didn't appear to exist within the existing framework. I start to thinking of Joanna. Cherry, if she has it. I know she has several reasons against her, and I am not saying I particular 'like' her. But since this morning I start to think she has something to her, that whoever wins needs to have. (Being egotistical and 'not a team player' are not fatal flaws here). Didn't she help or lead the proroguing affair and score a rare hit against the UK Govt?

You might say the leader can't be leader from Westminster but I would say why not? Things need shaking up.

Whoever they are, having the leader in WM could keep the leader's eye very much on the independence ball. The leader could be having a pop at the UK PM every week. Generate noise, generate news. Attack what the UK Govt is doing to Scotland. Someone else can lead devo from Holyrood and run the trains and schools, someone else can swat away the Rosses and Sarwars, It does not to be the independence leader's job to do that.  

The movement needs all the talents. Have someone good at PR running Holyrood, and have a hellraiser in Westminster. 

And it would halve the flak. One to tackle the London media, one to tackle the Scottish media.

A double act doesn't work too badly in NI. Michelle for devo, Mary Lou for fighting London rule.

That must be the most stupid post that I’ve read on here in a long time, did it actually sound like it made sense when you wrote it.  

The only people who would agree with that are those who think that running the country is some awkward thing that is only designed to hamper the fight for independence.  The two are indivisible. 

Finally, you are way off on your analogy with SF and Michelle O’Neill.  SF believe in a United Ireland and are abstentious towards WM.  They believe that the Dail should be sovereign and not WM, the SNP believe that Holyrood should be sovereign.   Mary Lou McDonald’s job is not to end London rule it is to try and become Taoiseach.   That summary betrays a knowledge of Irish politics through an Anglo-centric lens. 

[hampden_loon2878]

9 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

Yes but Wings and Alba hate him possibly more than they hate Sturgeon due to "getting Alex Salmond"

I think it is between Kate Forbes (unsure if she will stand) and Angus Robertson (been his plan for a while)

Phillipa Whitford is a wild card

I would really need to know where they stand on achieving Independence and more to the point who wants to kick the can down the road

if angus robertson is the new leader, independence and the SNP is finished, well and truely dead, we need a leader that unites the party, takes a deep breath and stables the ship

[hampden_loon2878]

1. cherry, no to tainted

2. robertson, equally divisive

3. forbes, to young and new baby?

4. Flyn, who i would like but at westminster

5.Jim fairlie, no one has mentioned but he would be good as a deputy

6.Swinney, tried and diddnt work

7. Whitford, really not sure and at Westminster

8. fergus ewing, steady but boring