Scottish players in action 21/22

[Diamond Scot]

3 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

In that case he would turn down the full squad?

Not really as its about risk / reward. Nobody is saying he is injured. He is saying he is better served using the international break to recover from knocks and niggles which in turn allow him to keep playing every week for his club. He would rather do that than play U21 football which is at a lower level than he plays normally.

Theres much more to be gained by playing for the full squad than the U21s which is actually just a developmental level.

Theres no doubt he is making a decision but its his decision to make. If he goes on to play for a top 5 club in a major league week in week out and Clarke elects not to select him because of his stance on U21 football then so be it. I cant see Clarke doing that though.

We do this all the time with players. Question their commitment etc. I remember Tierney getting the same but look how thats turned out. Vice Captain for Arsenal and a regular in our most successful international team for decades. Id much rather that outcome than him playing a bunch of U21s or friendlys earlier ib his career.

As ive said before its different for every player. There is no right or wrong way at that age.

[Diamond Scot]

Just now, Squirrelhumper said:

Ok then. 

James Milner, 60+ caps for England at youth level before he got his first full cap and 61 full caps after that. Still playing at the highest level at 36. 

Xavi, 58 caps at youth level then 133 full caps and over 500 first team games for Barca. 

Iniesta - 45 caps at youth level for Spain, 2 for Catalonia, 600 first team appearances (and counting) and 131 caps with Spain. 

Pique - 40 caps at youth level for Spain, 102 at full level, 450 top level appearances and still playing at 35

Jordan Henderson - 29 youth caps for England, 68 full caps (and counting) and over 400 first team appearances. 

Messi  - 23 youth caps for Argentina, 158 full caps (and counting) and over 550 top flight appearances. 

You can pick an example to suit any argument. 

Some of the best players in the world there who never thought it was beneath them to play at youth level, nor did it hold them back. 

As ive said, im not saying its not possible. Every player is different as is every situation.

I dont see why people cant just let the kid make his own career decisions without slating him. He is 19, playing abroad in a top league. Thats braver than almost any player in recent history. If he gets to 22 or 23 and still isnt making himself available then fair enough but its only an U21 game. 

If they are so important to all of us why are the attendences so low compared to full international. Die hard tamb supporters csnt be bothered going to these games but its ok to criticise Hickey.

[Caledonian Craig]

29 minutes ago, Diamond Scot said:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-9303439/amp/Aaron-Hickey-battled-Covid-19-joining-Bologba-star-loving-life-Italy.html

Theres actually a few interviews where he says he wants to play for Scotland.

Im not saying its not possible for some young players to play week in week out and play at International level. Every player is different. Also, im not sure how often Owen played for the U21s and he also suffered horrible muscle injuries quite young so maybe not the best example to suggest Hickey should be doing the same.

Id like him to play but im not going to be overly critical if he doesnt. 

I admire your faith/belief in his reasoning.

Right lets say you are right then when does he deem himself physically right for international football given that he is already almost into his 20s?

And lets also take into account that we are two wins away from our first World Cup Finals appearance in 24 years. Knocking back a chance to impress Gemmill and Clarke would propel him possibly into a World Cup Finals squad - the biggest accolade a player can get. Yet he, seemingly, has other priorities.

Edited March 10, 2022 by Caledonian Craig

[Diamond Scot]

25 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

I admire your faith/belief in his reasoning.

Right lets say you are right then when does he deem himself physically right for international football given that he is already almost into his 20s?

And lets also take into account that we are two wins away from our first World Cup Finals appearance in 24 years. Knocking back a chance to impress Gemmill and Clarke would propel him possibly into a World Cup Finals squad - the biggest accolade a player can get. Yet he, seemingly, has other priorities.

Do you consider U21 and full international to be the same? Ive no doubt he would accept a call up for the full squad. Some will no doubt take issue with that which I understand but lets not misrepresent his position. 

He has stated he has ambitions to play for Scotland and supports them. He has made himself unavailable for U21 games as he feels the time is better served recovering for his club games which in the long run increases his chances of fulfilling his potential and presumably playing reguarly for Scotland.

Theres a huge difference in my opinion between his stance and somebody like Ryan Fraser for example.

I respect other supporters view on the topic. I personally just feel the kid has earned the right to make his own choices about his future. Ultimately its him who stands to lose out if it goes wrong one way or another.

[Squirrelhumper]

2 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

Not really as its about risk / reward. Nobody is saying he is injured. He is saying he is better served using the international break to recover from knocks and niggles which in turn allow him to keep playing every week for his club. He would rather do that than play U21 football which is at a lower level than he plays normally.

 

He's either needing a rest or he's not. 

So what if he is called up to play Poland this month - worth the risk for him or that not worth the effort either?

[Third Lanark]

I always thought we Scots were much prouder to actually be Scottish than many other nations. So to hear about someone having doubts is depressing. Can you imagine any English player not being bothered if they play for Eng. or not?

[ceudmilefailte]

1 hour ago, Squirrelhumper said:

He's either needing a rest or he's not. 

So what if he is called up to play Poland this month - worth the risk for him or that not worth the effort either?

He would learn a lot more in training from some of the best players in Europe and a top class coach than he would being involved with Gemmil and a pile of players that probably won't make it. So yes worth the risk.

His club would probably agree.

 

Edited March 10, 2022 by ceudmilefailte

[mccaughey85]

Hickeys attitude might not be great regarding the u21s but if he shows good commitment to the senior squad then that will be enough for me. Hes playing at a level that should automatically get him in the senior squad so hopefully clarke calls him up.

[mccaughey85]

1 hour ago, Third Lanark said:

I always thought we Scots were much prouder to actually be Scottish than many other nations. So to hear about someone having doubts is depressing. Can you imagine any English player not being bothered if they play for Eng. or not?

Lol i think the indy ref in 2014 proved that not to be the case.

[Diamond Scot]

1 hour ago, Squirrelhumper said:

He's either needing a rest or he's not. 

So what if he is called up to play Poland this month - worth the risk for him or that not worth the effort either?

So all football games are equal in your mind?

Why do players take injections for cup finals but not for other games etc.

He is a young player who is playing alot of football at a very high level. He clearly feels that he would rather give his body some time to rest rather than play in a developmental game at a lower standard to that he plays at every week.

Do you go to every Scotland game? U21s, U19s, U17s etc. For the purpose of my point im assuming not. Does that make you less committed as a Scotland fan? 

[vanderark14]

Stuart Armstrong scores for Southampton 

[Scots_Wha_Hae]

McGinn wasted on the right of the three in a 4-3-1-2. Barely involved.

[ceudmilefailte]

26 minutes ago, Scots_Wha_Hae said:

McGinn wasted on the right of the three in a 4-3-1-2. Barely involved.

4 tackles 93% success pass rate and Villa are winning 1-0, footballs a team game.

Edited March 10, 2022 by ceudmilefailte

[duncan II]

1 hour ago, Scots_Wha_Hae said:

McGinn wasted on the right of the three in a 4-3-1-2. Barely involved.

McGinn was excellent. No idea what game you watched.

[Third Lanark]

17 minutes ago, duncan II said:

McGinn was excellent. No idea what game you watched.

I'm getting worried about him; scores for us for fun but doesn't seem to score for his club.

[Blantyre_Braveheart]

Jack gave away a pen but had quite a good game. He makes a massive difference to the Rangers midfield in Europe.

[ceudmilefailte]

1 hour ago, Third Lanark said:

I'm getting worried about him; scores for us for fun but doesn't seem to score for his club.

Plays far deeper at club level,still manages a goal or two. 

[ProudScot]

9 hours ago, Blantyre_Braveheart said:

Jack gave away a pen but had quite a good game. He makes a massive difference to the Rangers midfield in Europe.

What a result from Rangers again.

Jack looked good and probably one of McGregors best games of his career.

Shame there’s not a couple more Scots in the Rangers lineup. 

[ProudScot]

11 hours ago, vanderark14 said:

Stuart Armstrong scores for Southampton 

He’s having quite a good season now

[Orraloon]

9 hours ago, Third Lanark said:

I'm getting worried about him; scores for us for fun but doesn't seem to score for his club.

Why does that worry you? Better than the other way round.

[Scots_Wha_Hae]

10 hours ago, duncan II said:

McGinn was excellent. No idea what game you watched.

He became much more involved later in the game, particularly when Ings went off for Sanson and they went to a midfield 5. He was able to push much further forward which is his natural game.

I didn’t say he was bad btw, I said he was barely involved.

[Caledonian Craig]

11 hours ago, Third Lanark said:

I'm getting worried about him; scores for us for fun but doesn't seem to score for his club.

Why is that a cause for worry exactly? As you say scores for us for fun - that is all that matters. It is, after all, what he does for Scotland that is all that bothers us. Besides by all accounts had a cracking game and is a rich vein of form for Villa.

[Tartan blood]

10 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Why is that a cause for worry exactly? As you say scores for us for fun - that is all that matters. It is, after all, what he does for Scotland that is all that bothers us. Besides by all accounts had a cracking game and is a rich vein of form for Villa.

I think McGinn is literally the last person we should be worried about. By his own admission, he is in the form of his life, and a diehard Scotland fan that will never drop out of a squad. 

Plus, scoring isn't his main job. Not even for Scotland. It's always a bonus when he scores for us, not an expectation. He'll go down as a Scotland great. Only 8 caps away from being in the hall of fame, as well as one of our top scorers. 

[Caledonian Craig]

3 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

I think McGinn is literally the last person we should be worried about. By his own admission, he is in the form of his life, and a diehard Scotland fan that will never drop out of a squad. 

Plus, scoring isn't his main job. Not even for Scotland. It's always a bonus when he scores for us, not an expectation. He'll go down as a Scotland great. Only 8 caps away from being in the hall of fame, as well as one of our top scorers. 

Totally agree.

He will top 50 caps for us and there is a very good chance he will end up in amongst the top ten highest Scotland goalscorers of all-time. That says it all. And lets not forget his assists and link up play alongside the workload he puts in. He really covers all bases.

[Tartan blood]

27 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Totally agree.

He will top 50 caps for us and there is a very good chance he will end up in amongst the top ten highest Scotland goalscorers of all-time. That says it all. And lets not forget his assists and link up play alongside the workload he puts in. He really covers all bases.

If he retired tomorrow he'd already be considered a legend. But I reckon he'll be up at the top end of the all time caps chart next to Andy Robertson and Craig Gordon by the time he hangs up his boots.

Craig Gordon is only 1 cap away from being in the top 10 caps of all time, in case anyone is wondeirng.

Edited March 11, 2022 by Tartan blood