Fairbairn Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 With these performances I’m not sure I want us to qualify. We’d get scudded in the competition proper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Beem Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 These players need a shrink, not another manager. They should bring in the lecturer from Good Will Hunting or Dr Jennifer Melfi to work along side Clarke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanderer Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 Far to early..... He came in at the 11th hour with a nightmare run of games ahead of him (Belgium (a) - Russia (h) - Belgium (h) - Russia (a)) and the amount of call off's he has had (especially in defense) and unable to get Griffiths to use up front, has been really unlucky. How he has a run of 3 (potentially) winnable games with no pressure, and hopefully injuries ease and players are available again, then he can be judged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbroath1320 Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 Vogts failed to qualify for a major tournament, Smith failed, McLeish failed, Burley failed, Levein failed, Strachan failed - it's time to start looking beyond the manager and at player development. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daviebee Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 2 hours ago, Dalgety Bay TA said: Ehh? OK, I’m going to take Robertson out here as he is an obvious starter but what 8 centre backs, not available, and 4 better right backs are we missing please? Sorry - should've been clearer. I was referring to the centre-backs specifically. Obviously we've no right-backs. Lost both our first-choice defensive midfielders as well. Doesn't explain why so-called professional fitba players go utterly to pieces when they lose a goal of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalgety Bay TA Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 2 minutes ago, daviebee said: Sorry - should've been clearer. I was referring to the centre-backs specifically. Obviously we've no right-backs. Lost both our first-choice defensive midfielders as well. Doesn't explain why so-called professional fitba players go utterly to pieces when they lose a goal of course. I agree, the loss of a goal destroys this team as a unit nowadays. I just think most of our available defenders are much of a muchness, no better or worse than each other by any notable degree. I also think bar Ryan Jack, who hasn't even been properly tested at this level, that we have a real defensive ball winning midfield player. When you have a below average defence and no one in front of them to try and shield or protect them you are always going to lose goals. And thats back to your point, when we lose goals we fall to bits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teecee- Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 9 hours ago, daviebee said: We have the makings of a decent midfield. Not a top class one, just decent. However, when they've got to worry about what's happening behind them as well as having nothing to aim at in front of them, well... Have to disagree with us having a decent midfield. Who has inspired you in the last five games? I can think of nobody. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daviebee Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 2 minutes ago, teecee- said: Have to disagree with us having a decent midfield. Who has inspired you in the last five games? I can think of nobody. As I said, we have the MAKINGS of one, we obviously don't have it at the moment. McGinn, McTominay, McGregor, McLean, Christie, Armstrong, Fraser aren't bad players. They might not be great ones but some combo from there should be good enough to compete at international level. The problem is mainly what's behind them and what's in front of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwhitelaw Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 19 minutes ago, daviebee said: As I said, we have the MAKINGS of one, we obviously don't have it at the moment. McGinn, McTominay, McGregor, McLean, Christie, Armstrong, Fraser aren't bad players. They might not be great ones but some combo from there should be good enough to compete at international level. The problem is mainly what's behind them and what's in front of them. We do have a decent midfield!! On paper at least anyway, 7 of our midfield squad play in one of the top leagues in Europe! So far we've just not been able to find a way to make a decent unit out of them. My only concern so far with Clarke's tactics is that this backs to the wall defending and lumping it up to a lone striker that can't actually hold up the ball (Burke, McBurnie) is completely taking the midfield out of the equation. Clarke obviously needs time to get things right but he also needs to show he's going to use that time wisely! O'Neill spent his initial 3 years working with promising young NI players and eventually it came good. I know he's been hampered by injuries but players like Mulgrew should not be in the side again, he's done! These next 3 games are about getting our promising U21s in the A squad and seeing what they can do. Gilmour especially! If they're good enough it won't do their career prospects any harm. D Fletcher got his debut before he'd kicked a ball for the Man U first team and look how that turned out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 1 hour ago, Arbroath1320 said: Vogts failed to qualify for a major tournament, Smith failed, McLeish failed, Burley failed, Levein failed, Strachan failed - it's time to start looking beyond the manager and at player development. Yeh this is true but we should still be getting better results than what we are with the players we have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 1 hour ago, Jim Beem said: These players need a shrink, not another manager. They should bring in the lecturer from Good Will Hunting or Dr Jennifer Melfi to work along side Clarke. That's not a joke; we need a good sports psychologist as all the top nations have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfingers Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 Sacking him would be worse I reckon. We need to keep him for these play offs. It's not like there's a whole list of folk dying for the scotland job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamntg Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 30 minutes ago, Third Lanark said: That's not a joke; we need a good sports psychologist as all the top nations have. Do we not have one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McTeeko Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 1 minute ago, adamntg said: Do we not have one? We certainly have a sports scientist - that clown who kept us on UK time when playing away to Kazakhstan to ‘keep the body-clock balanced’ or some nonsense pish 😏 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KirkieRobRoy Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 Anna Signeul said, when she took over the women's team, that her big task was to 'develop a winning mentality'. Since they've been on the up ever since, perhaps Stevie should bring in whoever she brought in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjm007 Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 He will be given until we lose the playoffs but the signs aren’t good at all. The form Killie are now in after a bumpy start puts the rationale behind giving him the job in context too. SC is hardly exuding confidence and belief either - he looks haunted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairbairn Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 1 hour ago, kwhitelaw said: My only concern so far with Clarke's tactics is that this backs to the wall defending and lumping it up to a lone striker that can't actually hold up the ball (Burke, McBurnie) is completely taking the midfield out of the equation. I was thinking about this last night. At what point do you realise that if you don't have players that fit your system you need to change the system?! We've been playing the lone striker up front for God knows how long despite not really having anyone suited to the role probably since Miller retired, if even then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newt Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 12 hours ago, ceudmilefailte said: As soon as we didn't get Michael O'Neill we should have said sorry Gordon we didn't mean it. After McLeish we should have begged him to come back. As for Clarke we are stuck with him until the end of his contract. “Give the new man 3 or 4 games and then insert name here ” ......... must go” .....That’s Burley, Strachan, McLeish, Levein ......can’t all be bad” i wrote this in April...........not exactly Nostradamus but you get the jist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaggycoo Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 10 minutes ago, Fairbairn said: I was thinking about this last night. At what point do you realise that if you don't have players that fit your system you need to change the system?! We've been playing the lone striker up front for God knows how long despite not really having anyone suited to the role probably since Miller retired, if even then. Tbf Fletcher was very good in the role of winning the ball, or making a nuisance of himself, and holding up for the midfield to move forward. Granted I've seen oil tankers move quicker over 3 yards but at least he put a shift in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyD Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 Too early to be talking about sacking him. McLeish was awful from the off but still got a dozen games. Clarke has had less than half that. There's worrying signs for me tho. For me we lost last night largely due to Clarke. He's been going an for man in the games so far, and against Russia in Russia, going 1 for 1 marking Dzyuba at set pieces seems kinda crazy to me. If you asked someone with no football knowledge how they'd set up to defend a corner, they'd put two men on Dzyuba. But Clarke went man for man and sad day for Mulgrew. He got outmuscled by a 6'6" brick shit-house. But for me he shouldn't have been left to do that alone. The stoney faced distant stare after we conceded wasn't encouraging either. Surely that's the moment that your players need something from you, but Clarke just seemed to be staring into the abyss. Made me wonder if he's actually enjoying the reality of being Scotland manger, he's said a few times now about how different it is to club management and bemoaned how little time he has with the players. Thinking back, Strachan left a couple of match day fixtures empty and just had training camps for a few international breaks. Maybe that's something that Clarke would benefit from doing? There's been a couple of other odd choices too tho. Why start a slow players like Snoddy in a wide position last night to play on the break? Surely you want a player with pace for the counterattacks to be more likely to result in a chance. Why play 2 slower wide men against Belgium when again we're playing on the break for 90 minutes? Why sub Forrest for McLean in the 1st Russia match, destroying our shape as we had no wide right replacement on the pitch. Then 'fix' it 15 minutes later with another sub. Seems obvious it would wreck our shape.. and it didnt take 15 minutes to see 'whatever we were trying' wasn't working. So for me there's worries.. but let's wait and see what happens against Cyprus and the Kazakhs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASTA Mick Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 I was hoping for bit of a new manager bounce with Clarke coming in but he's had some tough fixtures to start with. I will reserve judgement until after the play-offs. He could really do with 3 wins now to start building some momentum. The game in Cyprus could be pivotal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 26 minutes ago, PASTA Mick said: I was hoping for bit of a new manager bounce with Clarke coming in but he's had some tough fixtures to start with. I will reserve judgement until after the play-offs. He could really do with 3 wins now to start building some momentum. The game in Cyprus could be pivotal. This is how I feel, these three games are winnable and we need to see some improvement before we start these play off games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwhitelaw Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 47 minutes ago, andyD said: Too early to be talking about sacking him. McLeish was awful from the off but still got a dozen games. Clarke has had less than half that. There's worrying signs for me tho. For me we lost last night largely due to Clarke. He's been going an for man in the games so far, and against Russia in Russia, going 1 for 1 marking Dzyuba at set pieces seems kinda crazy to me. If you asked someone with no football knowledge how they'd set up to defend a corner, they'd put two men on Dzyuba. But Clarke went man for man and sad day for Mulgrew. He got outmuscled by a 6'6" brick shit-house. But for me he shouldn't have been left to do that alone. The stoney faced distant stare after we conceded wasn't encouraging either. Surely that's the moment that your players need something from you, but Clarke just seemed to be staring into the abyss. Made me wonder if he's actually enjoying the reality of being Scotland manger, he's said a few times now about how different it is to club management and bemoaned how little time he has with the players. Thinking back, Strachan left a couple of match day fixtures empty and just had training camps for a few international breaks. Maybe that's something that Clarke would benefit from doing? There's been a couple of other odd choices too tho. Why start a slow players like Snoddy in a wide position last night to play on the break? Surely you want a player with pace for the counterattacks to be more likely to result in a chance. Why play 2 slower wide men against Belgium when again we're playing on the break for 90 minutes? Why sub Forrest for McLean in the 1st Russia match, destroying our shape as we had no wide right replacement on the pitch. Then 'fix' it 15 minutes later with another sub. Seems obvious it would wreck our shape.. and it didnt take 15 minutes to see 'whatever we were trying' wasn't working. So for me there's worries.. but let's wait and see what happens against Cyprus and the Kazakhs. That isn't an option now with the introduction of the nations league and us being in a 6 team group. All international breaks for the foreseeable future require us to play a competitive game. Can't argue much with everything else you've said though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyD Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 4 minutes ago, kwhitelaw said: That isn't an option now with the introduction of the nations league and us being in a 6 team group. All international breaks for the foreseeable future require us to play a competitive game. Can't argue much with everything else you've said though Could we do something at the end of the season? A 5 day training camp or something just doing light stuff. Working on system, positions, transitions, set pieces. No heavy training, mostly theory on the pitch. Feels like it'd be of value to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCTA Posted October 11, 2019 Share Posted October 11, 2019 2 minutes ago, andyD said: Could we do something at the end of the season? A 5 day training camp or something just doing light stuff. Working on system, positions, transitions, set pieces. No heavy training, mostly theory on the pitch. Feels like it'd be of value to me. You think one single player would turn up to that? 😳 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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