SNP leadership election

[Freeedom]

2 hours ago, aaid said:

For what, having a different opinion and not being afraid to voice it?   Quite the little authoritarian aren’t you, a common trait of the far left I find. 

I wasn't being serious, I do find the way you post extremely obnoxious though, with your over the top tribalism and the constant insults you make when you disagree with someone 

I hope you are a better person offline 

 

[phart]

Just for the record I agree with aaid in the sense that Forbes was lauded for not being "tactical" when answering about her views on things. Fast-forward we have mental gymnastics cause folk are trying to preserve their own narratives and also the narrative of Forbes being honest.

The problem is the last two narratives are logically incompatible. Aaid pointing this out is causing cognitive dissonance and that gets projected into anger etc, so you have one side of the partisan crowd (aaid is partisan on the other side) trying to resolve this dissonance by trying to not think about it using various techniques like, ban him, mock him, marginalise him etc.

Anyway enough armchair psychologist from me.

 

[aaid]

14 minutes ago, phart said:

Just for the record I agree with aaid in the sense that Forbes was lauded for not being "tactical" when answering about her views on things. Fast-forward we have mental gymnastics cause folk are trying to preserve their own narratives and also the narrative of Forbes being honest.

The problem is the last two narratives are logically incompatible. Aaid pointing this out is causing cognitive dissonance and that gets projected into anger etc, so you have one side of the partisan crowd (aaid is partisan on the other side) trying to resolve this dissonance by trying to not think about it using various techniques like, ban him, mock him, marginalise him etc.

Anyway enough armchair psychologist from me.

 

At least someone can see what’s going on. 

[Freeedom]

😂😂😂

[Redz]

15 hours ago, aaid said:

I might have lost the room but I’m very aware that this particular room is by no means representative.

Perhaps not however, your tone has definitely shifted towards the aggressive (Frantic / Defensive) side NS resigned

I just don't find it as influential as has how you had been previously

Just an observation, that's all 👍

[Redz]

15 hours ago, aaid said:

Jamie Hepburn

Thanks - I was sure that formed some part of his pitch

Will he be any good at it?

[scotlad]

On 3/29/2023 at 9:22 AM, TDYER63 said:

 

Completely agree with both. 

Much as I dont want her in the cabinet as I dont want her tainted by association, he has made a humungous mistake not offering her a top job. 

One of his many faults is he's a vindictive wee git.  He's shown that side of himself before when he was justice secretary with his original draft of the hate crime bill, and I think he's shown it again here. 

He could easily have kept Forbes in her previous role - a role she has shown herself to be more than capable of executing - but he chose to get back at her instead.  Whether that was to appease the Greens (which would also point to a degree of weakness in his character, in letting Harvie and Slater pull his strings) or because she'd had a few digs at him during the leadership campaign and he wants to show who's boss only he'll know.  Either way, since he's replaced her with someone I wouldn't trust to correctly calculate her share of a restaurant bill let alone deliver a budget I don't reckon he has the wellbeing of the country as his top priority.

[scotlad]

18 hours ago, Alibi said:

What a dull, unimaginative status quo cabinet.  FFS, are they actually trying to lose power?  I see there are more women that men so who's going to self ID as a man in order to level it up?

 

It seems that "gender balance" is a bit old hat now.  In fact, the concept appears to have been consigned to a 1984-style memory hole, although, it would likely have been retrieved if he'd named a majority male cabinet. 

20 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

• Shona Robison, the new deputy first minister, will take on the finance portfolio, including responsibility for the Scottish Budget
• Michael Matheson becomes the Cabinet Secretary for NHS Recovery, Health and Social Care
• Jenny Gilruth joins Cabinet for the first time as Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills
• Màiri McAllan joins Cabinet for the first time as Cabinet Secretary for Net Zero and Just Transition
• Neil Gray joins Cabinet for the first time as Cabinet Secretary for Wellbeing Economy, Fair Work and Energy
• Mairi Gougeon remains Cabinet Secretary for Rural Affairs, Land Reform and Islands
• Angus Robertson remains Cabinet Secretary for Constitution, External Affairs and Culture
• Shirley-Anne Somerville becomes Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice
• Angela Constance returns to Cabinet as the new Cabinet Secretary for Justice and Home Affairs

Michael Matheson is a solid but unspectacular cabinet secretary but less face it, Health isn't a brief where anyone will shine.  Jenny Gilruth has at least been promoted to an area where she has some real-world experience and the two Mairis seem bright enough.  Those are the positives.

One the other hand, why aren't areas like transport and housing considered important enough to be cabinet-level jobs?  And does anyone have any ideas about what the "social justice" brief might involve, or, indeed, what Angus Robertson does all day??

[aaid]

22 minutes ago, Redz said:

Thanks - I was sure that formed some part of his pitch

Will he be any good at it?

He’s an experienced guy, been a minister since 2014, you can either take the view that time will tell or you could spit venom because Ash Regan didn’t get it. 

[aaid]

3 minutes ago, scotlad said:

, or, indeed, what Angus Robertson does all day??

Plots against Alex Salmond?

[aaid]

21 minutes ago, aaid said:

He’s an experienced guy, been a minister since 2014, you can either take the view that time will tell or you could spit venom because Ash Regan didn’t get it. 

Or you could be like Douglas Ross and complain about anyone doing it. 

[Redz]

26 minutes ago, aaid said:

He’s an experienced guy, been a minister since 2014, you can either take the view that time will tell or you could spit venom because Ash Regan didn’t get it. 

Personally I'm not fussed who does it, as long as they're (Party & Individual) serious about it and hit hard when required

[Ally Bongo]

58 minutes ago, aaid said:

Plots against Alex Salmond?

He has already done that

It will be the next targets he is plotting against - Cherry, Forbes etc

[aaid]

32 minutes ago, Redz said:

Personally I'm not fussed who does it, as long as they're (Party & Individual) serious about it and hit hard when required

It will be interesting to see what the role actually consists of, not sure if he’s supposed to be a front man or a guy behind the scenes who is organising everything.  I’m not sure that a front man is what’s needed, that really should be the FM. 

[aaid]

Just now, Ally Bongo said:

He has already done that

It will be the next targets he is plotting against - Cherry, Forbes etc

Cherry is more than capable of doing that herself.  She’s looking for the political equivalent of suicide by cop and to be thrown out of the party.  Best to leave her on the Westminster backbenches and not give her what she wants.  If the party can thole John Mason at Holyrood, they can thole her. 

[Malcolm]

what exactly is minister for net zero and just transition - is that a mixture of climate change and the GRR!?

 

[weekevie04]

I wish him well, but I have a horrible feeling he won't be liked by the general public. Let's come back in a few months/year and see how his polling is ; but no matter what you think of Sturgeon or Salmond - he's miles behind them in wits, smarts or even just competence. I've never liked him on debates either, he falls for the traps every time and gets stuck in the mud. Who knows maybe he's more savy?

The cabinet doesn't exactly look like its bursting with talent either.

We'll see ; but its quite hard to be optimistic about the direction of Scottish independence under the current SNP leadership and unfortunately, Scotland has a lot of fairweather fans when it comes to the fitba team and independence - and I can see soft Yessers will end up disengaged from politics.

I didn't particularly like the vitriol towards Kate Forbes and the snide from some in the SNP who I thought were bigger and better than that. I'm quite happy I left the party in 2020.

Independence is a long way away. The UK government can just keep doing what they are doing aka ''Not now,'' and the SNP will mump but do nothing, and the general population will just suck it all up.

The SNP quite rightly deserve flack for being no further forward in having a second referendum. Yes, the UK govt etc were always going to rubber the requests but the SNP should be a lot more radical than they have. Even as someone who's quite passionate about independence, its very hard to even think about just now - considering it's not going to happen for a long time.

 

[PapofGlencoe]

caught a glimpse of FMQs today and thought Yousaf came across quite well, to be honest.

but agree with the sentiment that unless a  proper campaign or plan is in place (and soon), we're as well as dumping the other indyref thread for a decade or so.   Even people that support it, have lost the impetus.  Without it i really don't see what they're fighting on at the next GE.  A tartany version of Labour basically in the eyes of many but with no ability to form a government.  

[Alibi]

On 3/29/2023 at 4:55 PM, aaid said:

Who do you think is missing that should be there?

Kate Forbes should have been offered finance without a doubt.  Ivan McKee I think resigned but I'd have kept him in place.  Ash Regan would be a better bet as independence minister but no way Yousaf would allow her in that post as she might actually push for independence.

My impression of the cabinet is that it's just the same old faces who have done nothing to get us to independence despite the open goal of Brexit.  We need a freshened up party and I don't think we have that.  and as for Yousaf himself, that photo of him and his (male) family members holding some sort of prayer meeting in Bute House seems somewhere between unwise and provocative - can you imagine if Kate Forbes had pulled a stunt like that>  if he wants to pray, fine, but it's not something that should be done in such a public manner.  It just looks as if they are all posing for a photo opportunity.  Religion and politics should be kept separate.

[scotlad]

4 hours ago, Alibi said:

Kate Forbes should have been offered finance without a doubt.  Ivan McKee I think resigned but I'd have kept him in place.  Ash Regan would be a better bet as independence minister but no way Yousaf would allow her in that post as she might actually push for independence.

My impression of the cabinet is that it's just the same old faces who have done nothing to get us to independence despite the open goal of Brexit.  We need a freshened up party and I don't think we have that.  and as for Yousaf himself, that photo of him and his (male) family members holding some sort of prayer meeting in Bute House seems somewhere between unwise and provocative - can you imagine if Kate Forbes had pulled a stunt like that>  if he wants to pray, fine, but it's not something that should be done in such a public manner.  It just looks as if they are all posing for a photo opportunity.  Religion and politics should be kept separate.

That's one of the differences between them. Kate Forbes makes no secret of her religious faith but she doesn't play on it. Humza Yousaf does.

The kind of people who vilified Forbes over her remarks about gay marriage have been whooping with delight over that picture since he put it out, despite the fact that the faith being practiced by the men in the picture says ostensibly the same thing about same sex marriage as that practiced by Forbes. 

To my mind the "but he doesn't legislate based on his faith" excuse doesn't quite hold water either, considering he's the same person who wanted to extend his hate crime legislation to include things said in the home.  I'm sure nothing "hateful" was being uttered at the time that picture was taken but I wonder what the reaction would be in the Yousaf household if one of his daughters, when she's older, announces that she wants to marry another girl, or even, for that matter, someone outside her faith.

[hampden_loon2878]

7 hours ago, scotlad said:

That's one of the differences between them. Kate Forbes makes no secret of her religious faith but she doesn't play on it. Humza Yousaf does.

The kind of people who vilified Forbes over her remarks about gay marriage have been whooping with delight over that picture since he put it out, despite the fact that the faith being practiced by the men in the picture says ostensibly the same thing about same sex marriage as that practiced by Forbes. 

To my mind the "but he doesn't legislate based on his faith" excuse doesn't quite hold water either, considering he's the same person who wanted to extend his hate crime legislation to include things said in the home.  I'm sure nothing "hateful" was being uttered at the time that picture was taken but I wonder what the reaction would be in the Yousaf household if one of his daughters, when she's older, announces that she wants to marry another girl, or even, for that matter, someone outside her faith.

agree with all of that

[aaid]

7 hours ago, scotlad said:

That's one of the differences between them. Kate Forbes makes no secret of her religious faith but she doesn't play on it. Humza Yousaf does.

The kind of people who vilified Forbes over her remarks about gay marriage have been whooping with delight over that picture since he put it out, despite the fact that the faith being practiced by the men in the picture says ostensibly the same thing about same sex marriage as that practiced by Forbes. 

To my mind the "but he doesn't legislate based on his faith" excuse doesn't quite hold water either, considering he's the same person who wanted to extend his hate crime legislation to include things said in the home.  I'm sure nothing "hateful" was being uttered at the time that picture was taken but I wonder what the reaction would be in the Yousaf household if one of his daughters, when she's older, announces that she wants to marry another girl, or even, for that matter, someone outside her faith.

Humza Yousaf has been married twice, his first wife was called Gail Lythgoe which probably gives you a clue as to her heritage.  They were married for seven years.  His current wife has also been married before.  The teenage daughter is his step-daughter. 

I’m guessing that they probably don’t have any issues with people marrying outside their faith.  

As for gay marriage, who can tell with him until that situation occurs but the indications and his history suggest he’d have no problems, unlike Kate Forbes who is clear in her view that marriage is between one man and one woman. 

[Caledonian Craig]

For me, it is clear, Yousaf has an impossible task. The unionist media are onto him like a pack of wolves throwing all the slurs they can in his direction and with division within the SNP and several SNP members disenchanted or leaving the party then what chance does he have? None.

[TDYER63]

Sadly not a lot to disagree with in this , though I imagine someone will 🙂

https://news.sky.com/story/amp/precedent-suggests-winner-takes-all-interpretation-of-humza-yousafs-52-48-victory-will-only-be-start-of-difficulties-12845848

 

[aaid]

3 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

Sadly not a lot to disagree with in this , though I imagine someone will 🙂

https://news.sky.com/story/amp/precedent-suggests-winner-takes-all-interpretation-of-humza-yousafs-52-48-victory-will-only-be-start-of-difficulties-12845848

 

At least Adam Boulton’s got his name right this time.