Scottish players in action 21/22

[thesaint]

1 hour ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Of course the hope is there that Livramento, Anderson and Barnes will get excited of the thought of playing in the Euros and jump at the chance and opt for Scotland on those grounds alone realising first choices aren't going to come calling anytime soon.

The hope is?Really??😗

[Caledonian Craig]

One thing fans are not considering here when wanting Livramento, Anderson and Barnes called up is it goes against the grain of what Clarke has built up.

It has been mentioned many times about the club spirit built up and how close knit the squad is and how they will run through walls for him. Well calling up the likrs of Anderson, Livramento and Barnes destroys that. Calling them up is all well and good but it then puts established players such as Robertson, McGregor, Gilmour et al places in jeopardy. Guaranteed Livramento, Anderson and Barnes will expect to walk into our side. What happens then? Disharmony and players feeling put out and less chances for the likes of Lewis Ferguson etc. That club spirit will disintegrate quickly I reckon.

[Caledonian Craig]

15 minutes ago, thesaint said:

The hope is?Really??😗

Well it is for some. 😉

[thesaint]

2 hours ago, ProudScot said:

Yeah it’s grim throughout the league. 

Hearts had 3 Scots starting v Rangers. Aberdeen had 4 Scots starting yesterday. You’d say probably only Shankland out of those 7 Scots would get in the Rangers squad.

Big shame there’s no quota required, be some boost to the national team if every club had to start 5-6 Scottish players 

Agree it's shit but plenty seem to be quite happy about the idea of the national team being filled with non Scots(livramento,Anderson and Barnes etc ).If we don't even insist on Scots in the national team then what chance is there for the club teams.

[Caledonian Craig]

I think a reason for lack of Scots in top SPL clubs is more down to the best plying their trade elsewhere. A fair few in the EPL and Championship or below. Even a growing number abroad in Italy, Austria, Portugal, Saudi Arabia and Canada.

[Rich NATA]

1 hour ago, Caledonian Craig said:

One thing fans are not considering here when wanting Livramento, Anderson and Barnes called up is it goes against the grain of what Clarke has built up.

It has been mentioned many times about the club spirit built up and how close knit the squad is and how they will run through walls for him. Well calling up the likrs of Anderson, Livramento and Barnes destroys that. Calling them up is all well and good but it then puts established players such as Robertson, McGregor, Gilmour et al places in jeopardy. Guaranteed Livramento, Anderson and Barnes will expect to walk into our side. What happens then? Disharmony and players feeling put out and less chances for the likes of Lewis Ferguson etc. That club spirit will disintegrate quickly I reckon.

I agree with you, but we brought in Gunn.

That was a kick in the baws to the boys who had waited their chance behind Marshall and Gordon.

[Squirrelhumper]

20 minutes ago, Rich NATA said:

I agree with you, but we brought in Gunn.

That was a kick in the baws to the boys who had waited their chance behind Marshall and Gordon.

Kelly and Clark are nowhere near good enough. That's their main issue.

[Caledonian Craig]

44 minutes ago, Rich NATA said:

I agree with you, but we brought in Gunn.

That was a kick in the baws to the boys who had waited their chance behind Marshall and Gordon.

That is one player not three all of whom have not been exactly pushing themselves for selection for us and who would quite likely displace long time regulars in our team and squad. 

[Tartan Chris]

3 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Of course the hope is there that Livramento, Anderson and Barnes will get excited of the thought of playing in the Euros and jump at the chance and opt for Scotland on those grounds alone realising first choices aren't going to come calling anytime soon.

Going by Clarke's comments only realistic one is Harvey Barnes. He's at the age now where it's very unlikely England will look at him but he's still pretty good and been a decent scorer from out wide at prem level for quite a few seasons so would boost the squad nicely.

Anderson pulling out very quickly said it all. I assume he's injured currently as hasn't been involved with Newcastle for a few weeks.

Livramento will be part of under 21s and be part of England cycle from 2024 onwards so I think he's made his choice already.

[Tartan Chris]

2 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

One thing fans are not considering here when wanting Livramento, Anderson and Barnes called up is it goes against the grain of what Clarke has built up.

It has been mentioned many times about the club spirit built up and how close knit the squad is and how they will run through walls for him. Well calling up the likrs of Anderson, Livramento and Barnes destroys that. Calling them up is all well and good but it then puts established players such as Robertson, McGregor, Gilmour et al places in jeopardy. Guaranteed Livramento, Anderson and Barnes will expect to walk into our side. What happens then? Disharmony and players feeling put out and less chances for the likes of Lewis Ferguson etc. That club spirit will disintegrate quickly I reckon.

All they need to do is show commitment just like Che Adams has done.

It's easy to commit three months before start of a major tournament. Everyone then wants to see the same commitment for those away qualifiers in Israel and Armenia, Che has certainly proven that despite initial scepticism. 

Very negative reaction when Gunn finally declared aswell but amazing what a few clean sheets can do for perception....

The existing squad just want more good players to play with and Harvey Barnes certainly fits into that category.

Edited November 5, 2023 by Tartan Chris

[Caledonian Craig]

6 minutes ago, Tartan Chris said:

All they need to do is show commitment just like Che Adams has done.

It's easy to commit three months before start of a major tournament. Everyone then wants to see the same commitment for those away qualifiers in Israel and Armenia, Che has certainly proven that despite initial scepticism. 

Very negative reaction when Gunn finally declared aswell but amazing what a few clean sheets can do for perception....

The existing squad just want more good players to play with and Harvey Barnes certainly fits into that category.

I was speaking of best/worst (depending on viewpoint) scenario. Trying to shoehorn all three into the team/squad would displace team/squad regulars who have grafted hard to get us where we are. That would be certain to get backs up especially given media reports of Anderson's off-hand remarks whether true or not.

[theabsentee]

2 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

I was speaking of best/worst (depending on viewpoint) scenario. Trying to shoehorn all three into the team/squad would displace team/squad regulars who have grafted hard to get us where we are. That would be certain to get backs up especially given media reports of Anderson's off-hand remarks whether true or not.

Fair enough but think it's unlikely in these 3 players cases that we even get 1.  Like previously said though Gunn was immediately excepted from our back up keepers so it should be the same with a outfield player. 

   Even though I fully support the grandparent rule & we should take advantage of it like every other nation does I wouldn't want to see a overhaul of the strong team spirited squad we have now but 1 new fully committed qualifier from the potentials would improve our quality/depth & ultimately what its all about getting results.

  

[er yir macaroon]

9 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

I was speaking of best/worst (depending on viewpoint) scenario. Trying to shoehorn all three into the team/squad would displace team/squad regulars who have grafted hard to get us where we are. That would be certain to get backs up especially given media reports of Anderson's off-hand remarks whether true or not.

Footballers are grown men and know all about competition for places. I don’t think for a minute Clarke would let players walk into a side. If they show in training that they are clearly better than the competition then that is a different matter. Players can accept that. It’s a bit like when people complain when a 26 year old that always turns up for squads is overlooked for an 18 year old who is better and goes straight into the first 11 in his first squad. Harsh, but that’s the nature of the game. 

[syecosse]

Michael Mellon 19 scored again at the weekend, as Morecombe shocked Lincoln away, 11th goal this season, Burnley fans debating if he should be recalled, apparently his all round play and development physically( as well as those goals) is what has impressed fans this season.

[mccaughey85]

8 minutes ago, syecosse said:

Michael Mellon 19 scored again at the weekend, as Morecombe shocked Lincoln away, 11th goal this season, Burnley fans debating if he should be recalled, apparently his all round play and development physically( as well as those goals) is what has impressed fans this season.

Looks promising. Maybe see him play championship football next season for Burnley or some other team. Hes clearly too good for league 2 especially considering he's only 19.

[adamntg]

When’s the squad out, anyone know?

[ProudScot]

49 minutes ago, adamntg said:

When’s the squad out, anyone know?

Game in 10 days you’d have expected a squad today at latest really eh!

[Super_Scotlandfan]

Livramento is quality and will likely get England or Portugal caps.

If he chooses us at this stage it would be a big coup. And would obviously show he has full commitment to us. 
 

But looks like he’ll be heavily involved in England under 21s, could win a trophy followed by an England squad place when Walker and Trippier retire. 

[ghorne67]

19 hours ago, todd said:

Anyone else irked by folk saying "Between the sticks"?  It's in goal or goalkeeper ffs. It's like those douches that call snow the white stuff or refer to hot temperatures as 'The Mercury hitting...'

Almost as bad as using the word 'douches' 

[mccaughey85]

57 minutes ago, Super_Scotlandfan said:

Livramento is quality and will likely get England or Portugal caps.

If he chooses us at this stage it would be a big coup. And would obviously show he has full commitment to us. 
 

But looks like he’ll be heavily involved in England under 21s, could win a trophy followed by an England squad place when Walker and Trippier retire. 

Do England not have 4 or 4 young right backs who could be ahead of him? Guys like Trent Arnold and Reece James. I think Portugal will get him especially if he wants to be guaranteed starter.

[Caledonian Craig]

5 hours ago, er yir macaroon said:

Footballers are grown men and know all about competition for places. I don’t think for a minute Clarke would let players walk into a side. If they show in training that they are clearly better than the competition then that is a different matter. Players can accept that. It’s a bit like when people complain when a 26 year old that always turns up for squads is overlooked for an 18 year old who is better and goes straight into the first 11 in his first squad. Harsh, but that’s the nature of the game. 

In an instant where an up and coming Scot displaces them then yes they'd accept it as competition. However, that clearly would not be the case here would it. This would be mavericks supposedly chased for a call-up but resisted it for obvious reasons. That would piss off anybody on the verge of a major tournament and damage squad equilibrium. One such selection may be brushed off but three? Not a chance as with 23 man squads only for the Euros for sure regulars would be elbowed out.

[todd]

48 minutes ago, ghorne67 said:

Almost as bad as using the word 'douches' 

Really?  How so?

[GHfaeGTA]

22 hours ago, theabsentee said:

Me too . Probably my highlights of what's been a pretty quiet weekend for Scots players are Stewart being fit & even more so Doak being fit enough to get directly back on the first team bench without having to play any reserve team football helps confirm how highly he is rated by Liverpool I reckon. 

Highly rated quite clearly but also means he is not actually getting many minutes in competitive games. Maybe better out on loan? 

[Hertsscot]

3 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

In an instant where an up and coming Scot displaces them then yes they'd accept it as competition. However, that clearly would not be the case here would it. This would be mavericks supposedly chased for a call-up but resisted it for obvious reasons. That would piss off anybody on the verge of a major tournament and damage squad equilibrium. One such selection may be brushed off but three? Not a chance as with 23 man squads only for the Euros for sure regulars would be elbowed out.

I think I may have reignited this little debate, apologies. My comment, given injury problems with our fullbacks, was that Livramento was a wild card. Ramsay is presumably injured, Patterson is 3rd choice RB at Everton, Ralston 2nd choice at Celtic, Ashby hasn't been a regular starter at Swansea. Livramento has come back from injury and is now beginning to feature more regularly for Newcastle. He is the best RB currently available for us, whether he chooses us, is up to him but we are forgiving, I never held it against Goram or McCall that they were in England u21 squads, I'm just grateful that they committed to us.

You are right though, three Anglos who have played for England and 'defecting' at the same time, booting out regulars, probably wouldn't be great for squad morale. I can't see that happening but given our injury problems to our regular fullbacks (and seeing that KT is injured quite a lot of the time) there is a case for asking Livramento the question. 

For the record I don't think Ralston is anywhere near as good as Livramento but I don't think either him or Patterson would let us down if they played in the upcoming matches. They've both been solid for us in the past.

Edited November 6, 2023 by Hertsscot

[Caledonian Craig]

1 hour ago, Hertsscot said:

I think I may have reignited this little debate, apologies. My comment, given injury problems with our fullbacks, was that Livramento was a wild card. Ramsay is presumably injured, Patterson is 3rd choice RB at Everton, Ralston 2nd choice at Celtic, Ashby hasn't been a regular starter at Swansea. Livramento has come back from injury and is now beginning to feature more regularly for Newcastle. He is the best RB currently available for us, whether he chooses us, is up to him but we are forgiving, I never held it against Goram or McCall that they were in England u21 squads, I'm just grateful that they committed to us.

You are right though, three Anglos who have played for England and 'defecting' at the same time, booting out regulars, probably wouldn't be great for squad morale. I can't see that happening but given our injury problems to our regular fullbacks (and seeing that KT is injured quite a lot of the time) there is a case for asking Livramento the question. 

For the record I don't think Ralston is anywhere near as good as Livramento but I don't think either him or Patterson would let us down if they played in the upcoming matches. They've both been solid for us in the past.

There is no reason to risk squad equilibrium therefore for a double header which now holds no jeopardy. Options open to us now like Patterson and Taylor backed up by Ralston and perhaps Johnston or Josh Doig will be just fine for challenges such as Georgia away and Norway at home. Lets remember it is quite possible Norway will be without Haaland and Odegaard who are both injured at present.