Coronavirus

[Squirrelhumper]

Just now, vanderark14 said:

There are many like him, I have switched of some group notifications because there are some very well educated people constantly moaning about sturgeon at every opportunity

i moan about her a fair bit as she's not beyond criticism and i think a lot of folk don't want to/are unwilling to question her policies on a variety of areas but she is by far the best leader in Scotland and any idea that she is controlling the media is so far removed from reality that it is mind blowing! 

If anything, i think she need to be far more aggressive with the push for independence. 

[vanderark14]

[hampden_loon2878]

1 hour ago, Caledonian Craig said:

FFS He was in charge in 2014 and we lost the IndyRef. Wake up and smell the coffee not Salmond's arse that you keep sniffing around.

And you said something very interesting earlier 'Theres nea cunt worth voting for' so you see even you are discounting Salmond's Alba Party.

yes he was in charge and tbh got closer than anyone ever dreamed he would, he left the party in such a strong position, the 2015 election was down to him, the alba party will get my vote in the council elections. It will be more a protest vote than anything, they have a fair share of roasters in the party however not near so bad as the current crop at the snp..

[Caledonian Craig]

6 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

yes he was in charge and tbh got closer than anyone ever dreamed he would, he left the party in such a strong position, the 2015 election was down to him, the alba party will get my vote in the council elections. It will be more a protest vote than anything, they have a fair share of roasters in the party however not near so bad as the current crop at the snp..

The petrifying thought here is that in polls over the last few years people vote Boris Johnson more favourably in Scotland than Alex Salmond. That suggests to me we got so close to independence despite Salmond not because of him. It is time to move on from him. What you are doing is akin to a BoJo supporter in say five years' time calling for him to be back as PM. Busted flushes are exactly that.

 

Edited January 13, 2022 by Caledonian Craig

[vanderark14]

9 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

i moan about her a fair bit as she's not beyond criticism and i think a lot of folk don't want to/are unwilling to question her policies on a variety of areas but she is by far the best leader in Scotland and any idea that she is controlling the media is so far removed from reality that it is mind blowing! 

If anything, i think she need to be far more aggressive with the push for independence. 

 I completely agree with this mate. Nobody is beyond criticism but some of the stuff I have seen is beyond ignorance

[Caledonian Craig]

26 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

 

If anything, i think she need to be far more aggressive with the push for independence. 

Sorry that would be political suicide for the Yes movement.

Push aggressively for independence during a global pandemic? Sorry but that would be an insane thing to do. Why? Well for Yes to get across the line in IndyRef2 it needs to persuade the majority of don't know/undecided voters. These are generally the hardest to persuade as they are fence sitters petrified of committing to anything. If the Yes movement were to aggressively start pushing NOW for independence then Better Together 2 are given unlimited free ammo from the Yes movement. I can see it now with Better Together saying they are putting independence before the health and well-being of the public and those waiverers will be lost just on that alone. Political suicide.

We have to sit tight and when the infection rate has fallen right off then look to ramp things up.

[aaid]

2 hours ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

the worst thing that can happen for independence right now is that boris steps down. Labour doing well in the polls down south will muddy the waters slightly. How this effects things in scotland, i have no idea. the northeast will still be a snp/tory fight, however i can see labour coming back in the central belt. Theres nea cunt worth voting for

A few things.

First of all, this is an English problem, everyone knows by know that it is the SG and not the UKG who make the rules around Scotland where COVID is concerned and know that it was Nicola Sturgeon telling people in Scotland not to have parties and not Boris Johnson.  Even people who don’t think the SG should be the ones making the rules know this.

Next, the political landscape in Scotland hasn’t aligned with England since the 1950s.  In England, it is essentially a two party system with the Tories and Labour being on top for a period and then flipping over.   Up until a decade ago, in Scotland it was Labour and everyone else, now it is the SNP and everyone else.   With the country split on the constitution and the current party make up that doesn’t look like changing anytime soon.

Labour are not coming back in Scotland any time soon.  The only possible upside to them from this is that some Tory voting Unionists *might* vote for them but in terms of the overall dynamic in Scotland that makes no difference.  I think you underestimate the strength of antipathy that former lifelong Labour voters who have moved over to the SNP have towards their former party.  Labour should be looking over their shoulder at the Greens overtaking them,  the last full Scottish poll done in November had Labour on 15% for the list and the Greens on 12%.

[aaid]

45 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

i moan about her a fair bit as she's not beyond criticism and i think a lot of folk don't want to/are unwilling to question her policies on a variety of areas but she is by far the best leader in Scotland and any idea that she is controlling the media is so far removed from reality that it is mind blowing! 

If anything, i think she need to be far more aggressive with the push for independence. 

Depends what you mean by aggressive but the pressure and the campaign needs to ramp up this year.  The problem is I don’t think you can legitimately or successfully do that until there’s at least a sense of “normality” and a sense that were on the way out of the pandemic and I don’t think we’re quite at that stage right now.  

[hampden_loon2878]

18 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Sorry that would be political suicide for the Yes movement.

Push aggressively for independence during a global pandemic? Sorry but that would be an insane thing to do. Why? Well for Yes to get across the line in IndyRef2 it needs to persuade the majority of don't know/undecided voters. These are generally the hardest to persuade as they are fence sitters petrified of committing to anything. If the Yes movement were to aggressively start pushing NOW for independence then Better Together 2 are given unlimited free ammo from the Yes movement. I can see it now with Better Together saying they are putting independence before the health and well-being of the public and those waiverers will be lost just on that alone. Political suicide.

We have to sit tight and when the infection rate has fallen right off then look to ramp things up.

I will always be a supporter of self determination however i have not the will to vocally support the snp in their current state, thay are just as bad as the rest unfortunately,, 

[chaff]

1 hour ago, Squirrelhumper said:

This guy seems mentally unwell. 

He's a Tory, of course he is 😂

[hampden_loon2878]

8 minutes ago, aaid said:

A few things.

First of all, this is an English problem, everyone knows by know that it is the SG and not the UKG who make the rules around Scotland where COVID is concerned and know that it was Nicola Sturgeon telling people in Scotland not to have parties and not Boris Johnson.  Even people who don’t think the SG should be the ones making the rules know this.

Next, the political landscape in Scotland hasn’t aligned with England since the 1950s.  In England, it is essentially a two party system with the Tories and Labour being on top for a period and then flipping over.   Up until a decade ago, in Scotland it was Labour and everyone else, now it is the SNP and everyone else.   With the country split on the constitution and the current party make up that doesn’t look like changing anytime soon.

Labour are not coming back in Scotland any time soon.  The only possible upside to them from this is that some Tory voting Unionists *might* vote for them but in terms of the overall dynamic in Scotland that makes no difference.  I think you underestimate the strength of antipathy that former lifelong Labour voters who have moved over to the SNP have towards their former party.  Labour should be looking over their shoulder at the Greens overtaking them,  the last full Scottish poll done in November had Labour on 15% for the list and the Greens on 12%.

There will be a lot of folk who protest vote in may, where that vote goes i really don’t know, i just gave a feeling Labour will pick up protest votes from snp and tory voters, maybe no. I really hope boris stays around for another year at least. 

[Caledonian Craig]

2 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

I will always be a supporter of self determination however i have not the will to vocally support the snp in their current state, thay are just as bad as the rest unfortunately,, 

You seem to be hugely confused. Perhaps you need to take some time out from all this.

Self-determination/independence is just that right now. Do you support Westminster rule? Yes or No. In 2014 and now it had Jack shit to do about the SNP under Salmond or under Sturgeon since they are temporary whereas independence is permanent.

[Orraloon]

58 minutes ago, vanderark14 said:

🤣 That's brilliant. 😂

[aaid]

11 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

There will be a lot of folk who protest vote in may, where that vote goes i really don’t know, i just gave a feeling Labour will pick up protest votes from snp and tory voters, maybe no. I really hope boris stays around for another year at least. 

I can see Labour picking up some votes from the Tories as a “protest”vote.  I can’t for the life of me see why anyone who is an SNP voter would vote for Labour in those circumstances particularly as there are other options for a pro-Indy person unhappy with other aspects of SNP policy.   Maybe you can say why you think that?

These are council elections and while people will be inclined to vote by party, local issues come into play a lot more than in general elections.

Under STV, the whole concept of a protest vote doesn’t really apply anyway.

[bonzo]

1 hour ago, vanderark14 said:

😆👍stealing that.

[Squirrelhumper]

2 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Sorry that would be political suicide for the Yes movement.

 

I thought that long before the pandemic. 

[Squirrelhumper]

2 hours ago, chaff said:

He's a Tory, of course he is 😂

Would never have guessed!

[Squirrelhumper]

1 hour ago, aaid said:

I can see Labour picking up some votes from the Tories as a “protest”vote.  I can’t for the life of me see why anyone who is an SNP voter would vote for Labour in those circumstances particularly as there are other options for a pro-Indy person unhappy with other aspects of SNP policy.   Maybe you can say why you think that?

 

I can see folk just not voting, rather than voting elsewhere. 

I've said this previously but i've various family members who are teachers, all are SNP/Yes voters but in May none of them voted as they were utterly scunnered with the direction of education under the SG. 

SNP have a massively majority, i'm, not sure that is healthy than for anything other than pushing indy (which they aren't overly doing) and as a result has less pressure on them to keep up standards in other areas. 

So i can see some folk just not voting instead of voting elsewhere. Given the state of the streets/back courts in Glasgow just now with litter and neglect then you could see why some folk might just not vote SNP at all as the council aren't even attempting to address it.

If i vote it'll be SNP out of habit and fact i don't want an unionist council. Would prefer somebody other than Aiken though! 

[aaid]

12 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

I can see folk just not voting, rather than voting elsewhere. 

I've said this previously but i've various family members who are teachers, all are SNP/Yes voters but in May none of them voted as they were utterly scunnered with the direction of education under the SG. 

SNP have a massively majority, i'm, not sure that is healthy than for anything other than pushing indy (which they aren't overly doing) and as a result has less pressure on them to keep up standards in other areas. 

So i can see some folk just not voting instead of voting elsewhere. Given the state of the streets/back courts in Glasgow just now with litter and neglect then you could see why some folk might just not vote SNP at all as the council aren't even attempting to address it.

If i vote it'll be SNP out of habit and fact i don't want an unionist council. Would prefer somebody other than Aiken though! 

Not voting might be more likely than switching votes, especially if people have long memories about the decades that Labour were in power in Glasgow.

[hampden_loon2878]

2 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

You seem to be hugely confused. Perhaps you need to take some time out from all this.

Self-determination/independence is just that right now. Do you support Westminster rule? Yes or No. In 2014 and now it had Jack shit to do about the SNP under Salmond or under Sturgeon since they are temporary whereas independence is permanent.

haha fuck me, its not me that's confused pal

[Squirrelhumper]

33 minutes ago, aaid said:

Not voting might be more likely than switching votes, especially if people have long memories about the decades that Labour were in power in Glasgow.

I think that's the mindset of quite a few of my mates. Will never vote for anyone else but feel let down by SNP for a variety of reasons. 

[Orraloon]

15 hours ago, ParisInAKilt said:

Almost optimistic, cautiously so 😬

I think he might be in danger of overstating the protection that could be gained from previous infection by common cold coronaviruses. It's a very small study and much more data is required. The level of protection seems to be (so far anyway) much less than that gained from vaccination.

Another thing that he doesn't mention is that only about 10 to 20 % of common colds are caused by coronaviruses. So you need to have had about 5 or 6 doses of cold to have a good chance of having one that was caused by a coronavirus.

[Lamia]

7 hours ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

sturgeon isn't filling everyone with confidence though is she?

Your views are the stereotypical north east "old guard" who live in the bubble with their Salmond tinted specs. Without even asking I can identify people in this group because of their similar characteristics. You think your views are in some way widespread/mainstream but you are part of a very bitter fringe group that in the end of the day are simply agitators who's only contribution is like to be negative and corrosive rather than being any real positive productive force.

[Ally Bongo]

3 minutes ago, Lamia said:

Your views are the stereotypical north east "old guard" who live in the bubble with their Salmond tinted specs. Without even asking I can identify people in this group because of their similar characteristics. You think your views are in some way widespread/mainstream but you are part of a very bitter fringe group that in the end of the day are simply agitators who's only contribution is like to be negative and corrosive rather than being any real positive productive force.

👌

[Squirrelhumper]

3 minutes ago, Lamia said:

Your views are the stereotypical north east "old guard" who live in the bubble with their Salmond tinted specs. Without even asking I can identify people in this group because of their similar characteristics. You think your views are in some way widespread/mainstream but you are part of a very bitter fringe group that in the end of the day are simply agitators who's only contribution is like to be negative and corrosive rather than being any real positive productive force.

i live about 500 yards from the BBC Studios in Glasgow and the wee group of folk i saw having protests there with Alba flags etc all fit the same characteristics. 

That Denise Findlay on twitter being exhibit number 1- some real odd, odd views.