Scottish player transfers

[csinclair]

Oli Burke has returned to Millwall on loan

[thesaint]

44 minutes ago, csinclair said:

Oli Burke has returned to Millwall on loan

How many times has he moved in his career. A bit like Tony Watt. See he is supposedly on the move again. 

[Scots_Wha_Hae]

Not strictly relevant but Harry Soutar is moving to Leicester for £15m. We are about to find out how big a mistake it was of our youth managers to ignore him.

[csinclair]

29 minutes ago, Scots_Wha_Hae said:

Not strictly relevant but Harry Soutar is moving to Leicester for £15m. We are about to find out how big a mistake it was of our youth managers to ignore him.

I still think that at the time he wasn't getting picked, he wasn't playing well enough to be picked and definitely wasn't showing signs that he was a future EPL player

[ProudScot]

20 minutes ago, csinclair said:

I still think that at the time he wasn't getting picked, he wasn't playing well enough to be picked and definitely wasn't showing signs that he was a future EPL player

He was 17 and getting game time In the SPL in addition to being about 6’7.

Im fairly sure he should have been in the under 19/21 squad. 

[ProudScot]

Harrison Ashby signs for Newcastle

[Diamond Scot]

44 minutes ago, ProudScot said:

Harrison Ashby signs for Newcastle

Good move for him. Trippier will be the first choice right back but Newcastle are a club on the up so you would imagine that they will be involved in loads of competitions so plenty of scope for Ashby to get game time. If he can establish himself as a back up for Trippier then thats a good sign for us.

[Scots_Wha_Hae]

2 hours ago, ProudScot said:

He was 17 and getting game time In the SPL in addition to being about 6’7.

Im fairly sure he should have been in the under 19/21 squad. 

Yup, the team he wasn't getting picked for was Scotland U19 - I think he got a few caps and then was dropped entirely. The coach at the time (Gemmill or Sbragia IIRC) didn't call him up or even speak to him. He waited a few years and then Australia approached him for their U23 squad.

There's obviously a strong argument that he should have waited if he really was committed, but equally the SFA allowed a situation where he had a decision to make to arise. That's poor management and potentially a big loss all for the price of the odd phone call.

[theabsentee]

1 hour ago, Diamond Scot said:

Good move for him. Trippier will be the first choice right back but Newcastle are a club on the up so you would imagine that they will be involved in loads of competitions so plenty of scope for Ashby to get game time. If he can establish himself as a back up for Trippier then thats a good sign for us.

Yeh exactly, when a club riding high with their money want him, it's shows Eddie Howe & his coaching team must think he has great potential.

[theabsentee]

2 hours ago, ProudScot said:

He was 17 and getting game time In the SPL in addition to being about 6’7.

Im fairly sure he should have been in the under 19/21 squad. 

Bloody frustrating isn't it knowing that a few fans knew his potential but the people getting paid to know either didn't or couldn't be bothered to find out! 😡

[thesaint]

3 minutes ago, theabsentee said:

Yeh exactly, when a club riding high with their money want him, it's shows Eddie Howe & his coaching team must think he has great potential.

Don't really know that much about him. Is he fully commited to us or is there a chance that with him signing for Newcastle he might fancy a shot at getting capped for england? I honestly haven't heard that much about him so don't know how he feels or has said about commiting to Scotland. 

[mccaughey85]

7 minutes ago, thesaint said:

Don't really know that much about him. Is he fully commited to us or is there a chance that with him signing for Newcastle he might fancy a shot at getting capped for england? I honestly haven't heard that much about him so don't know how he feels or has said about commiting to Scotland. 

Hes 21 and barely played any games. Hes a long way from getting a call up from england. Not sure hes ever going to make it with us either unless he really begins to impress and get gametime at newcastle.

[scotlad]

9 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

Hes 21 and barely played any games. Hes a long way from getting a call up from england. Not sure hes ever going to make it with us either unless he really begins to impress and get gametime at newcastle.

Seems a bit of an odd move going from West Ham, who are near the bottom of the table, to Newcastle, who are near the top, when he has barely even played for West Ham.  If he can't get into a poor West Ham side, why would a good Newcastle side want him?  Maybe I'm over-simplifying things a bit there.  Good luck to him anyway.

[Och Aye]

He's a good attacking player. Needs work defensively. Out injured a lot, hopefully that's just unlucky rather than recurring. Hammers have put a sell on clause in, which would suggest they do rate him. The current full backs aren't having a great time of it at the moment so think his chance wouldn't have been far away. Refused to extend his contract which was running out in the summer I believe.

Edited January 31, 2023 by Och Aye

[mccaughey85]

3 minutes ago, scotlad said:

Seems a bit of an odd move going from West Ham, who are near the bottom of the table, to Newcastle, who are near the top, when he has barely even played for West Ham.  If he can't get into a poor West Ham side, why would a good Newcastle side want him?  Maybe I'm over-simplifying things a bit there.  Good luck to him anyway.

Yeh its a little odd but maybe newcastle have seen some potential in him that west ham are squandering. Either way he needs to start playing games where ever that is.

[thesaint]

1 hour ago, mccaughey85 said:

Hes 21 and barely played any games. Hes a long way from getting a call up from england. Not sure hes ever going to make it with us either unless he really begins to impress and get gametime at newcastle.

Seems an odd one as somebody else mentioned he can't force his way into a poor west ham side and yet newcastle have paid £3 million for him. I suppose that is pocket money to them now. 

[theabsentee]

8 minutes ago, thesaint said:

Seems an odd one as somebody else mentioned he can't force his way into a poor west ham side and yet newcastle have paid £3 million for him. I suppose that is pocket money to them now. 

Don't think it's so odd, he was in the first team squad at West Ham but like someone else said he had a couple of injuries & I guess he knew if Newcastle's interest for as good while so wouldn't sign a new contract. Moyes as a consequence didn't select him or perhaps didn't want to play a youngster in a struggling team.

  On your commitment question, that's a good one, only time will tell. Lets hope if subject to them being good enough him & his new team Anderson will both stick with us 

[Kirk]

11 hours ago, Scots_Wha_Hae said:

Not strictly relevant but Harry Soutar is moving to Leicester for £15m. We are about to find out how big a mistake it was of our youth managers to ignore him.

aye we made a cunt of it again

[Caledonian Craig]

I think Souttar's defection would never have happened 25 or 30 years ago when we were still regularly qualifying for tournaments. He would have been much more likely to remain patient plus Australia were not regular qualifiers at that time.

[scotlad]

10 hours ago, Scots_Wha_Hae said:

Yup, the team he wasn't getting picked for was Scotland U19 - I think he got a few caps and then was dropped entirely. The coach at the time (Gemmill or Sbragia IIRC) didn't call him up or even speak to him. He waited a few years and then Australia approached him for their U23 squad.

There's obviously a strong argument that he should have waited if he really was committed, but equally the SFA allowed a situation where he had a decision to make to arise. That's poor management and potentially a big loss all for the price of the odd phone call.

He won 3 caps for the U19s, according to Wikipedia. He waited less than two years before going to play for the Australian U23s. At that point in time his senior experience consisted of a few games on loan at Ross County (where he was regarded as a bit of a bomb scare, IIRC) and smattering of League One appearances for Fleetwood. Mostly he had played for Stoke's U23 side.

The fact an EPL club (as Stoke were at the time) had seen fit to recruit him should have been a clue for a Gemmill and co. but at the time Gemmill had David Bates and Ryan Porteous playing regularly in Bundesliga 2 and the SPFL respectively; George Johnstone was highly thought of at the Liverpool U23s and Ross McCrorie appeared on the fringes of Rangers first team. In that sense I can understand why he might have overlooked Souttar.

It's not realistic to expect a coach to massage every player's ego who isn't picked just on the off-chance he might decide to play for another country. Souttar looks like being a loss (he may even turn out to be our biggest ever loss) but I don't think it's fair to lay all the blame at the SFA's door.

[scotlad]

8 hours ago, theabsentee said:

Don't think it's so odd, he was in the first team squad at West Ham but like someone else said he had a couple of injuries & I guess he knew if Newcastle's interest for as good while so wouldn't sign a new contract. Moyes as a consequence didn't select him or perhaps didn't want to play a youngster in a struggling team.

  On your commitment question, that's a good one, only time will tell. Lets hope if subject to them being good enough him & his new team Anderson will both stick with us 

England are up to their oxters in RBs just now, he'd have to be the next Cafu if he seriously expects to get picked ahead of what they already have.

[syecosse]

Liam Smith left Man city to join Swansea, Apparently fell behind other similar players at City.

 

Keeper news Archie Mair joined Notts County on loan till the end of the year.

[theabsentee]

45 minutes ago, syecosse said:

Liam Smith left Man city to join Swansea, Apparently fell behind other similar players at City.

 

Keeper news Archie Mair joined Notts County on loan till the end of the year.

 Lets see if Smith can get anywhere near the Swansea first team.

    I lose track of which clubs are in the English lower leagues, to me Mair to Notts county sounds a better move than another young Norwich Scottish youth Thomas Dickson Peters to Grimsby , though it's Grimsby who are playing at a higher level.  Notts County must be the sleeping giant of English non League football.

 Anyway good luck to all these young lads.

[Scots_Wha_Hae]

14 hours ago, scotlad said:

He won 3 caps for the U19s, according to Wikipedia. He waited less than two years before going to play for the Australian U23s. At that point in time his senior experience consisted of a few games on loan at Ross County (where he was regarded as a bit of a bomb scare, IIRC) and smattering of League One appearances for Fleetwood. Mostly he had played for Stoke's U23 side.

The fact an EPL club (as Stoke were at the time) had seen fit to recruit him should have been a clue for a Gemmill and co. but at the time Gemmill had David Bates and Ryan Porteous playing regularly in Bundesliga 2 and the SPFL respectively; George Johnstone was highly thought of at the Liverpool U23s and Ross McCrorie appeared on the fringes of Rangers first team. In that sense I can understand why he might have overlooked Souttar.

It's not realistic to expect a coach to massage every player's ego who isn't picked just on the off-chance he might decide to play for another country. Souttar looks like being a loss (he may even turn out to be our biggest ever loss) but I don't think it's fair to lay all the blame at the SFA's door.

In 16/17 Souttar played 10 times in PL2 following his move to Stoke. In the same season McCrorie played 9 times in the (Scottish) Championship, Porteous played regularly in (Scottish) League 2, Bates played in the SPL and Johnston was playing at EPL U18 level.

In 17/18 Souttar played 9 games in the Scottish Prem as well as making his senior debut for Stoke and playing regularly in PL2. In the same season McCrorie played regularly in the Scottish Prem, Porteous played 6 games in the Scottish Prem, Bates played 12 games in the Scottish Prem and Johnston played 13 times in PL2. 

I don't see anything in that to suggest that his senior experience was significantly less than the others. If anything George Johnston is the clear outlier there. 

[stocky]

Where is George Johnston now.🤔?