Freeedom Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 And you're saying that "the problem of Islam is endemic to the Middle East". How many countries in the Middle East use Sharia law? A bit more understanding of Islam would not go amiss, because somehow outlawing it across the globe, which seems to be what you're after, isn't going to happen - and, of course, if it did it would make matters worse. It is, and it doesn't matter how many countries use Sharia law the strict traditions of islam are inherent within the cultures of the middle east. Some countries like Saudi Arabia are more extreme than others but as I said it is a huge problem in the world today, particularly when these traditions are brought into our part of the world. I'm not suggesting outlawing it across the globe that would be insane. The suggestions I made are things that we should be doing in our country to stop the spread of the disease. There is nothing we can do about how people practice their lives in the middle east, they are a couple of centuries behind us in development and it is up to them to figure out what is right and wrong. And eventually in good time I think they will. But we shouldn't accept those things happening here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freeedom Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 (edited) So do you class Turkey, Bosnia, Macedonia, Indonesia, evil countries? No because the people of those countries are capable of being good, and in good time i hope that they will all become more secular societies. Evil is inherent in the nature of Islam with what it teaches and what it proposes as being moral. Edited January 11, 2015 by Freeedom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Pretty hard when secular democratic heads of state get over-thrown by western coups and puppet islamists get put in. Here's a scholar discussing the situation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzusSqcotDw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hertsscot Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 You're doing it right now, "Not every muslim". I think we know that and nobody is suggesting that it is every muslim but it is still a huge problem that people keep brushing under the carpet with the statements like "not every muslim" and "Islam is not evil". Sorry I disagree with your comments, I think most people are well aware that there is a problem with Islam being used to justify terrorism but that's not the only problem. There's also a massive problem with people in the West, through ignorance or self-interest, demonising Islam and all Muslims - some of the stuff happening in Germany before these attacks is very worrying as is continued support closer to home for organisations like EDL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kps022000 Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 It is, and it doesn't matter how many countries use Sharia law the strict traditions of islam are inherent within the cultures of the middle east. Some countries like Saudi Arabia are more extreme than others but as I said it is a huge problem in the world today, particularly when these traditions are brought into our part of the world. I'm not suggesting outlawing it across the globe that would be insane. The suggestions I made are things that we should be doing in our country to stop the spread of the disease. There is nothing we can do about how people practice their lives in the middle east, they are a couple of centuries behind us in development and it is up to them to figure out what is right and wrong. And eventually in good time I think they will. But we shouldn't accept those things happening here. Progressive countries like the USA that still executes criminals? Or tortures people for information? Or kills 100s of thousands of innocents over false claims? I agree that some areas of Islamic led countries are in need of transformation but to try and paint the west as developed and the Middle East as centuries behind is ludicrous. Yes we are not stoning people in the streets but female equality in society, balance of power, multicultural integration, transfer of wealth, we are only decades ahead if that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freeedom Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Sorry I disagree with your comments, I think most people are well aware that there is a problem with Islam being used to justify terrorism but that's not the only problem. There's also a massive problem with people in the West, through ignorance or self-interest, demonising Islam and all Muslims - some of the stuff happening in Germany before these attacks is very worrying as is continued support closer to home for organisations like EDL. How can you disagree with my comments then say "I think most people are well aware that there is a problem with Islam being used to justify terrorism' because that's one of the point's I'm making ? What exactly do you disagree with ? In addition i am not denying that far right extremist groups that attack muslims are ok either, they have arisen as a reaction to crimes committed in the name of Islam and i can understand why they are angry, however they are very misguided. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freeedom Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Progressive countries like the USA that still executes criminals? Or tortures people for information? Or kills 100s of thousands of innocents over false claims? I agree that some areas of Islamic led countries are in need of transformation but to try and paint the west as developed and the Middle East as centuries behind is ludicrous. Yes we are not stoning people in the streets but female equality in society, balance of power, multicultural integration, transfer of wealth, we are only decades ahead if that. Another misrepresentation of my comments. I am not defending the United states for executing criminals or torturing people, as far as i am concerned those policies are as backwards as some of the things that happen in the middle east. But let's not pretend here that most countries in the middle east are in anyway as progressive as the United states as a country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumnio Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Pretty hard when secular democratic heads of state get over-thrown by western coups and puppet islamists get put in. Here's a scholar discussing the situation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzusSqcotDw Well said that bloke. Pity the two hosts were thicker than the average yank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kps022000 Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Another misrepresentation of my comments. I am not defending the United states for executing criminals or torturing people, as far as i am concerned those policies are as backwards as some of the things that happen in the middle east. But let's not pretend here that most countries in the middle east are in anyway as progressive as the United states as a country. I am not, I am arguing that progressiveness is not a singular issue. You cannot take one issue in isolation and then use it as a measure of progressiveness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonnyTJS Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Another misrepresentation of my comments. I am not defending the United states for executing criminals or torturing people, as far as i am concerned those policies are as backwards as some of the things that happen in the middle east. But let's not pretend here that most countries in the middle east are in anyway as progressive as the United states as a country. Well, you do seem to leave your comments wide open to misinterpretation. Listen to yourself, 'Freeedom': You cite a flogging in Jeddah, and then say that "it doesn't matter how many countries use Sharia law" - it's only because of Sharia law that that flogging occurred! Sharia is the legal system of very few countries. You say that people in the countries in kps022000's list are "capable of being good" as if no Arab, Pakistani or Iranian has that capability - I'm sure it's not what you meant, but read what you wrote and it's there. You state that the USA is more progressive than most countries in the Middle East despite its use of torture and execution. Many Muslims that I know would suggest that rampant misogynist pornography, drug abuse and crime levels are the result of the 'progressive' nature of the USA and that they could do without it, ta very much. How much experience do you have of Islam? You showed earlier that you can't distinguish between the Koran and the Hadiths. Branding Islam as 'Evil' is a crap way of changing hearts and minds. Islam, like Judaism and Christianity, is a religion of nomadic sheep-herders. As the youngest belief system of the three (or youngest version of the same belief system) its founder - by definition a bit of a fundamentalist himself - realized that scope for interpretation weakened the fundamental tenets, and so ensured that interpretation was compromised by stressing the direct deistic nature of the Book. This can make it a pretty tough deal for liberal humanists. The way to deal with it, I reckon, is respect, understanding, application of the law of the land, and not being bigoted tossers. The way to fück it up is to brand entire peoples are evil and big-up a nation in which fundamentalist faith issues also hold a worrying sway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freeedom Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 http://www.news.com.au/world/africa/islamic-extremist-attack-in-nigeria-named-the-deadliest-massacre-in-history/story-fnh81gzi-1227180726580I'll just leave this here...Donny, i'll reply to your "points" later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonnyTJS Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 http://www.news.com.au/world/africa/islamic-extremist-attack-in-nigeria-named-the-deadliest-massacre-in-history/story-fnh81gzi-1227180726580 I'll just leave this here... Donny, i'll reply to your "points" later Fair dos, but if you're bringing the horrors in that link into the mix, make sure you swot up on the Lord's Resistance Army as well - this is one fücked up continent... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunchy Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Reading some of the comments of here is like listening to the Tory's. Dig out the biggest brush they can fine and paint everyone in that group the same colour When you take Christianity, Islam and judaism its like 3 people looking at the same mountain but each from a different side. Maybe if the fundamentalists in each of these faiths remembered that things would be better. I also think if we looked at the similarity's instead of the differences there would be better understandings between faiths Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bannannan Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Next world war so called Muslims against so called Christians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Laud Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Have a look at this.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJEvlKKm6og Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brassrubber Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Nurse get the straight jackets ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hertsscot Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 How can you disagree with my comments then say "I think most people are well aware that there is a problem with Islam being used to justify terrorism' because that's one of the point's I'm making ? What exactly do you disagree with ? In addition i am not denying that far right extremist groups that attack muslims are ok either, they have arisen as a reaction to crimes committed in the name of Islam and i can understand why they are angry, however they are very misguided. I'm losing track here of which comments I'm supposed to be disagreeing with! The only point I'm making is it is all too easy in the West to make sweeping judgments about all Muslims on the basis of the actions of some and I feel your comments about islam fail to distinguish before its many different manifestations, forgive me if I wasn't reading clearly but that's how your comments came across to me. Generalisations and stereotypes feed right wing groups and lead to a spiral of violence and a simplistic dichotomy that says West =good, Muslims = bad. I'm not an apologist for Islam and liek yourself would be very critical of many aspects of it and how it is lived out by many of its adherents but I also recognise that the non Muslim West is not perfect, that our history of colonialism, uncritical support of Israel, support of undemocratic regimes has fanned the flames of radical Islam. I also think we need to recognise that there is not an inevitable clash of cultures as in many places for many years peoples of different faiths have managed to live peacefully side by side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thplinth Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 It was the equality of their offensiveness that made it acceptable. It's satire, it's meant to offend someone. Oh I see it' satire so that makes it ok. Yes I see that now... sort of exactly like with that Dieudonne guy's comedy show recently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 (edited) Oh I see it' satire so that makes it ok. Yes I see that now... sort of exactly like with that Dieudonne guy's comedy show recently. No it's anti-semitism, when it's done to muslims it's satire. That's why the magazine had to fire the cartoonist who was doing the Jewish cartoons. Edited January 12, 2015 by phart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 (edited) "An American terrorism commentator has apologised for describing Birmingham as a "Muslim-only city" where non-Muslims "don't go in" during an interview on Fox News. Steven Emerson told the channel that in London "Muslim religious police" beat "anyone who doesn't dress according to Muslim, religious Muslim attire". He later issued an apology for his "terrible error". http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-30773297 This guy is considered by some to be the foremost "journalistic" expert on terrorism and advices congress and some interesting associates. Edited January 12, 2015 by phart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andymac Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 And then compounds his error by using the phrase 'beautiful city of Birmingham' in his apology. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mariokempes56 Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 And then compounds his error by using the phrase 'beautiful city of Birmingham' in his apology. Agreed - that was disgusting.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brummie Hibs Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 "An American terrorism commentator has apologised for describing Birmingham as a "Muslim-only city" where non-Muslims "don't go in" during an interview on Fox News. Steven Emerson told the channel that in London "Muslim religious police" beat "anyone who doesn't dress according to Muslim, religious Muslim attire". He later issued an apology for his "terrible error". http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-30773297 This guy is considered by some to be the foremost "journalistic" expert on terrorism and advices congress and some interesting associates. We have this just up the road from where I live: http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/on-patrol-with-north-londons-orthodox-jewish-patrol-group Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goozay Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 We have this just up the road from where I live: http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/on-patrol-with-north-londons-orthodox-jewish-patrol-group Not really the same thing though is it? Stamford Hill/Springfield isn't a "Jewish-Only" area and that patrol group aren't beating up folk wearing gear that's not kosher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 Not really the same thing though is it? Stamford Hill/Springfield isn't a "Jewish-Only" area and that patrol group aren't beating up folk wearing gear that's not kosher. Well one exists and the other is a fiction so not the same at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.thumb.jpg.5eeaf0fbe501ba3c868c32fd77caef1f.jpg)
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.