The Elite versus the "Riff Raff"

[stitch]

If people or what you call the elite are complaining about not having first shot at the cheaper tickets, why have they never complained about the sale of home tickets?

There is a different price between stands and not everyone gets in the stand they want. These tickets go on sale to everyone at the same time, so a person on high points could miss out on the cheaper stand tickets if all the low pointers got in first.

As a lot of people have said the only thing you are guaranteed with your points is a ticket if your point total is high enough, not the right to the cheaper tickets.

The blame is definitely not the SFAs  (I don't think I have said that before as it usually is) but totally down to uefa.

[N4Footsoldier]

19 hours ago, LoganRoy said:

It made me happy knowing a 30 pointer didn't get any Fans First tickets 😄

For the record, I managed to get Fans First for the Germany game thankfully 😀

As for praying on vulnerable lassies and getting hooked, you are definitely thinking of somebody else.

[Malcolm]

I think Uefa have under priced the tickets.  The correct price is the price it takes to meet demand to fill the stadium and not a seat more. 
 

i suspect uefa could have added 50% to the ticket price and still sold out.

 

[LoganRoy]

2 hours ago, N4Footsoldier said:

For the record, I managed to get Fans First for the Germany game thankfully 😀

As for praying on vulnerable lassies and getting hooked, you are definitely thinking of somebody else.

Sorry, definitely wasn't you.  Apologies for the confusion.  

[N4Footsoldier]

5 minutes ago, LoganRoy said:

Sorry, definitely wasn't you.  Apologies for the confusion.  

No worries, hope the Fans First tickets were kind to you 😀

[LoganRoy]

33 minutes ago, N4Footsoldier said:

No worries, hope the Fans First tickets were kind to you 😀

They were indeed.  Best €110 I'll ever spend. 

[aaid]

People are forgetting that the opening game of the World Cup and European Championships is considered by FIFA and UEFA as a marquee game.   I’ve never understood why that’s the case but it is.   In this championships, the ticket prices are the same as the semi-finals.

It was exactly the same in France for the Brazil game.   I can’t remember the price of my ticket but given it was behind the goal in the bottom tier I’m assuming it was one of the cheaper ones.   I saw a friend of mine put his ticket up which was 500 FFR, or about £70 at current rates on exchange.   I’m pretty sure that wasn’t the most expensive ones.  For some reason 1000 FFR rings a bell. 

[Orraloon]

42 minutes ago, aaid said:

People are forgetting that the opening game of the World Cup and European Championships is considered by FIFA and UEFA as a marquee game.   I’ve never understood why that’s the case but it is.   In this championships, the ticket prices are the same as the semi-finals.

It was exactly the same in France for the Brazil game.   I can’t remember the price of my ticket but given it was behind the goal in the bottom tier I’m assuming it was one of the cheaper ones.   I saw a friend of mine put his ticket up which was 500 FFR, or about £70 at current rates on exchange.   I’m pretty sure that wasn’t the most expensive ones.  For some reason 1000 FFR rings a bell. 

I paid about £95 for a ticket through the SFA. 

For Scotland games in 1982, I paid 300 pesetas, which about £1.50, for NZ and USSR. We had to buy our Brasil tickets off a tout for £15, about ten times face value. Fukin rip off bastard. I heard later on, that the guy got a good doing off some Scotland fans, but I've no idea if that was true or not.

[Diamond Scot]

3 hours ago, Malcolm said:

I think Uefa have under priced the tickets.  The correct price is the price it takes to meet demand to fill the stadium and not a seat more. 
 

i suspect uefa could have added 50% to the ticket price and still sold out.

 

What a wild take on pricing for entertainment. Especially for a sport that is generally associated with working class.

Uefa's remit is to grow the game not just to make maximum profit. And even if maximum profit was the objective, such a pricing structure would be short sighted. 

[Toepoke]

4 hours ago, Malcolm said:

I think Uefa have under priced the tickets.  The correct price is the price it takes to meet demand to fill the stadium and not a seat more. 
 

i suspect uefa could have added 50% to the ticket price and still sold out.

 

Tory troll alert!

 

[macwomble]

On 12/9/2023 at 7:56 PM, Rich NATA said:

That's right, you go and upset all the people on here who were less fortunate than yoursel 😄

Ya sick fuck 😄😄😄

Obviously a few raw nerves it was tongue in cheek! And I didn’t get all Fan First tickets! 

[Malcolm]

3 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

What a wild take on pricing for entertainment. Especially for a sport that is generally associated with working class.

Uefa's remit is to grow the game not just to make maximum profit. And even if maximum profit was the objective, such a pricing structure would be short sighted. 

 

2 hours ago, Toepoke said:

Tory troll alert!

 

 

we all know what uefa are all about and it’s not for the good of football.  they are a hundred percent about making money.

same goes for fifa - you wouldn’t be having world cups in Qatar and Russia.

Chancers like sepp blatter 😂

Everything has changed for 40 years ago when we were qualifying before.
 

 

 

[Shaundy]

2 hours ago, Toepoke said:

Tory troll alert!

 

I fear he’s an actual Tory. 
I have been riffraff since I jumped the turnstile in 78 v them . 
I give credit to the elite with hundreds of games under their belt and those with dozens of points having consistent the last couple of years. 
I am an ssc member atm . Only done dozens of games over decades. Intend to be in Munich, Koln and Stuttgart. Not a clue about a ticket atm either. 

[wanderer]

End of the day UEFA were selling the tickets, not the SSC..... The SSC could only work on the basis of how they were distributed.

Could they have done this better so that fans who travel do get access first to the Fans First tickets?..... maybe, but I have not heard of any seasonal Scotland fan who has attended games over and over for the last decade and beyond missing out, and at worst its maybe been Two Fans first tickets, and one Cat 3 ticket for one of the games....

Not heard of any loyal fans who have been forced to pay the Cat 1 prices for any of the games, certainly not seen anyone who is unhappy with what they ended up getting.

I would say "blame" is mostly with UEFA as they set the prices and the quantities, and SSC at the worst could have maybe implicated a slightly better distribution method that accounted for regular travelers, but in grand scheme of things this is not all that major of an issue.

Now the anxiety caused by the SSC mess up with sending codes out to people they should not have, that is a totally different matter.

Edited December 11, 2023 by wanderer

[N4Footsoldier]

On 12/9/2023 at 9:07 PM, From_Dundee_to_Ancoats said:

Great post and actually refreshing.

At end of the day this is the way they have  allocating them can't change it.

In club  football for my circumstances,for finals if you meet the criteria. Your guaranteed a final ticket. You then apply for the price category you want. If you don't get it you could end up with an expensive one.

But  you get the option to apply due to attending all cup games and buying home cup matches. They don't take aways etc unless oversubscribed.

This is what the ssc have done effectively.

Maybe they should of run a ballot first off but its not feasible.

The stuff i have seen on Facebook this week has been uterly ridiculous.

I can see both sides of the argument I agree with and I'm on 20 points.

Do I think people make sacrifices to attend games yes. I know people who hammer overtime, don't go on summer holidays, as thr football trips are their life. Doesn't mean they are rich.this im speaking of experience in. I dont go out,im currently doinf as much overtime as i can, i dont buy takeaways, i spend all my money on football. Club and country but that's my choice.

So some of the sniping on social media saying if  they go all the aways they can afford the expensive tickets is ridiculous. It seems nowadays the first response to say Is oh tory behaviour and try and make it political just to justify going to alot of aways. I took out a loan to go to the 2008 european cup final. Paid it off years ago but was something at time i felt i had to do.

In same breath  not just scotland matches wise,people are happy to whack £40 on domino's every weekend, go out on piss all time but then say can't afford stuff. People prioritise for these trips.

I agree some people have families and can't prioritise trips. I get that. Coming from a family who i grew up idolisingy my  old man because he took me to every game. When I got older and heard from my mum,how he left us with no food,because he had lost a bag with all the rent money whilst on a euro away it makes you realise about priorities.

At same time the sniping from people who do go and the self entitlement has got really bad in our support. Saying well you only go home games and 1 away we are better than you and deserve cheaper tickets for example :

Ironically there are people who go every away game but don't go to home games so to say people who only go to home games aren't loyal is ridiculous. In the  same breath I know people who travel up from Plymouth for home games which are effectively an away match for them.

The fan club as great as everyone is,when together as one is awful at times. People think they are a bigger scotland fan because they wear a feather on their head,  people think they are better because they wear a football shirt to the game. Someone dares to wear a bucket hat well its like they've gone down the road in a gimp suit.

At end of the day there's different ways to show you are a scotland fan without being a prick.

I know someone in club football who has missed 1 game home game  in 40 years including home,away euro and pre season.  Does he shout about it no, does he let everyone know no he doesn't.

This week has shown different levels of loyalty.  Lower level points buzzing to get tickets yet spending €400 euros for first game, 150 for second and 150 on third. Something that maybe 12+pointers wouldn't of done  in first place moaning they don't have priority.

At end of day. I hope after this initial ridiculous Facebook reaction, everyone comes together again as we usually do and be scotland again because my god is it going to be one big party In Germany (Holland first if rumours are true)
 

Great input mate.

Basically the message that loyalty is a spectrum and dependent on people's own personal circumstances, especially when weighting up greater priorities. No one is better than anyone else for making sacrifices to go to games etc so long as that loyalty is rewarded appropriately from the SSC.

Me and my mates have been discussing after going to almost every away trip since 2017/18, there will come a time when it slightly levels off once we start to see the same trips pop up several times, which is coinciding with everyone's timeframe to settle down a bit. The whole culture of normalised alcoholism of the Scotland trips, while hilarious at the time, really can't be sustainable. 

[Bzzzz]

29 minutes ago, N4Footsoldier said:

Great input mate.

Basically the message that loyalty is a spectrum and dependent on people's own personal circumstances, especially when weighting up greater priorities. No one is better than anyone else for making sacrifices to go to games etc so long as that loyalty is rewarded appropriately from the SSC.

Me and my mates have been discussing after going to almost every away trip since 2017/18, there will come a time when it slightly levels off once we start to see the same trips pop up several times, which is coinciding with everyone's timeframe to settle down a bit. The whole culture of normalised alcoholism of the Scotland trips, while hilarious at the time, really can't be sustainable. 

This is true fella but these things evolve into different experiences, repeat visits to cities you've been to in yer 20s are VERY different in yer 40s, as are the cities tbf. I've been travelling to games for a couple of years now and each one is different and that's what makes it so much fun. 

[rOsCo2]

I think we all agree that UEFA pricing, particularly for the opening game, is nuts. Considering how much revenue comes from TV, Sponsors and Corporate it is sicking.

However to play Devils advocate...

I would rather that the expensive tickets were made available to SSC members than the open market. I don't know the numbers for France 98, but I suspect the allocated tickets were considerably less than 10k especially for the opening game (I had 1.8k in my head but can't find any reference to that). We have 6.5k tickets under €200 for a "marque" [sic] game.

Looking at the other two games, some were quoting that historically we would get between 12-16% of the ground capacity. Even if you take the upper limit of that for Stuttgart and Cologne it is less than 10K.

Personally I don't think it would be that hard for UEFA to delay public sales of tickets to allow the qualified nations a much larger share but then I could envisage there would be a few less attractive games with empty seats.

[wanderer]

17 hours ago, aaid said:

People are forgetting that the opening game of the World Cup and European Championships is considered by FIFA and UEFA as a marquee game.   I’ve never understood why that’s the case but it is.   In this championships, the ticket prices are the same as the semi-finals.

It was exactly the same in France for the Brazil game.   I can’t remember the price of my ticket but given it was behind the goal in the bottom tier I’m assuming it was one of the cheaper ones.   I saw a friend of mine put his ticket up which was 500 FFR, or about £70 at current rates on exchange.   I’m pretty sure that wasn’t the most expensive ones.  For some reason 1000 FFR rings a bell. 

The opening ceremony, you do get a bit more for your money, as its more than just show up for kick off and then the game.... as there will probably be at least a hour of entertainment before that, where there will probably be some Popstar who has not had a hit since 2003 there to sing the tournament song, and then the opening ceremony itself (doubtful it will be anything like Paris though, which was something to behold when you were in the ground).

[N4Footsoldier]

10 minutes ago, rOsCo2 said:

 

Personally I don't think it would be that hard for UEFA to delay public sales of tickets to allow the qualified nations a much larger share but then I could envisage there would be a few less attractive games with empty seats.

I think part of that will be driven from numbers of corporate tickets to be allocated to sponsors which will be baked into each of their commercial contracts. Everyone would want the games to be 50/50 fans of each team, but that's not how football is run nowadays unfortunately.

[ceudmilefailte]

19 hours ago, Malcolm said:

I think Uefa have under priced the tickets.  The correct price is the price it takes to meet demand to fill the stadium and not a seat more. 
 

i suspect uefa could have added 50% to the ticket price and still sold out.

 

Could have charged more than 50% for our games and a 100 % for England games, guess the had to keep parity with other matches.

[aaid]

1 hour ago, wanderer said:

The opening ceremony, you do get a bit more for your money, as its more than just show up for kick off and then the game.... as there will probably be at least a hour of entertainment before that, where there will probably be some Popstar who has not had a hit since 2003 there to sing the tournament song, and then the opening ceremony itself (doubtful it will be anything like Paris though, which was something to behold when you were in the ground).

I wouldn't know as I only got in 5 minutes before kick off having been stuck outside for an hour in the most ridiculous queue you've ever seen 

[deso1]

18 hours ago, Malcolm said:

 

 

we all know what uefa are all about and it’s not for the good of football.  they are a hundred percent about making money.

same goes for fifa - you wouldn’t be having world cups in Qatar and Russia.

Chancers like sepp blatter 😂

Everything has changed for 40 years ago when we were qualifying before.
 

 

 

Same goes for the sfa, and all the folk saying it has nothing to do with them, are naive to say the least.

[Ally Bongo]

4 hours ago, aaid said:

I wouldn't know as I only got in 5 minutes before kick off having been stuck outside for an hour in the most ridiculous queue you've ever seen 

Ditto - and i was outside at least 2 hours before KO although one of my photos taken from my seat does show some of it

The only thing of the opening ceremony/game apart from the goals that stick with me is a whole main stand given to press and dignitaries 

It was shite in the main

 

[N4Footsoldier]

On 12/9/2023 at 8:39 PM, aaid said:

Points harvesters was the biggest myth going.  In the 2000s and 2010s when Scotland were pish, absolutely rank, and couldn’t qualify for love nor money.  What exactly were people actually buying tickets with no intention of going, what tickets did they think they’d be missing out on.

Unsure about times gone by but I'm convinced harvesting is pretty rife nowadays. When I started going away with zero points for a couple of big games you could basically ask around and pick up a spare within half an hour in the away end from someone who's mate couldn't make it. Unless games go to 100% pick up, everyone who wants a ticket generally will get their hands on one, usually in the away end.

Home games are a harvesters dream nowadays as you get points and can buy packages in bulk, as someone said before many people who go to all away games actually don't go to many home games, but they can still pick up the points at the point of purchase and sell on for face value later.

I know another guy who is on well over 20 points and has been to 2 away games in the last 18 months. There is also a weird secondary market for people who go to most away games but refuse to pay SSC for memberships and/or any other petty anti-SFA protocol that happens out there.

I can kind of respect the need people feel to harvest, as missing one game these days can mean hundreds if not thousands of people overtaking you on the ladder, which affects your ability to buy tickets later for smaller allocation if you are going to be borderline, especially if the 100% pick up trend continues under the new found popularity of the SSC memberships.

[aaid]

36 minutes ago, N4Footsoldier said:

Unsure about times gone by but I'm convinced harvesting is pretty rife nowadays. When I started going away with zero points for a couple of big games you could basically ask around and pick up a spare within half an hour in the away end from someone who's mate couldn't make it. Unless games go to 100% pick up, everyone who wants a ticket generally will get their hands on one, usually in the away end.

Home games are a harvesters dream nowadays as you get points and can buy packages in bulk, as someone said before many people who go to all away games actually don't go to many home games, but they can still pick up the points at the point of purchase and sell on for face value later.

I know another guy who is on well over 20 points and has been to 2 away games in the last 18 months. There is also a weird secondary market for people who go to most away games but refuse to pay SSC for memberships and/or any other petty anti-SFA protocol that happens out there.

I can kind of respect the need people feel to harvest, as missing one game these days can mean hundreds if not thousands of people overtaking you on the ladder, which affects your ability to buy tickets later for smaller allocation if you are going to be borderline, especially if the 100% pick up trend continues under the new found popularity of the SSC memberships.

Just to be clear, I was talking about the period before the SSC started to give out points for home games.  They were warned in advance that it would be impossible to police.   In those days, I’d buy the full package of tickets in advance - with a discount - and because I live in the SE of England, I’d generally miss one or two games.   
 

This is one of the reasons why I packed it in.  The SSC went through a period of not really caring who got the tickets, I’ve no idea if that’s changed.  

Edited December 12, 2023 by aaid