The Elite versus the "Riff Raff"

[wanderer]

Harvesting has been there, but never found it to be on the levels people think it is......

There was a period around the Euro 2008 campaign where we started getting some really silly low amount of tickets, but these were then off set some games we got well over what was required, and this did send people into a panic.

Every time the SSC have done 100% pick up's, and there has been quite a few examples over the decades, there has never been talk of 100's of unclaimed for tickets (I had a chat with someone at the SSC years ago, and they said in times like this its never more than a dozen chancers, and when they have followed up its been excuses like missed flights or something).... so its been impossible to harvest your way to a creditable amount of points, but more sneaking A point here or there over the years.

Edited December 12, 2023 by wanderer

[ceudmilefailte]

43 minutes ago, wanderer said:

Harvesting has been there, but never found it to be on the levels people think it is......

There was a period around the Euro 2008 campaign where we started getting some really silly low amount of tickets, but these were then off set some games we got well over what was required, and this did send people into a panic.

Every time the SSC have done 100% pick up's, and there has been quite a few examples over the decades, there has never been talk of 100's of unclaimed for tickets (I had a chat with someone at the SSC years ago, and they said in times like this its never more than a dozen chancers, and when they have followed up its been excuses like missed flights or something).... so its been impossible to harvest your way to a creditable amount of points, but more sneaking A point here or there over the years.

I think there might be a lot flights missed for the Northern Ireland friendly. 

The nations league might be similar, it was great fun when we were playing to get a play off spot and promotion. Not sure playing Europe's elite will have the same attraction. 

[Squirrelhumper]

On 12/11/2023 at 9:53 AM, Bzzzz said:

This is true fella but these things evolve into different experiences, repeat visits to cities you've been to in yer 20s are VERY different in yer 40s, as are the cities tbf. I've been travelling to games for a couple of years now and each one is different and that's what makes it so much fun. 

I'd agree on that. 

At some games a few years back there were only a few of us on aways regularly but now back to the dozen or so, now that some guys kids are a wee bit older, once others have settled down etc and have bought houses etc and aren't saving for that and have more spare cash etc again.  Added to that, there's a lot of the younger boys on my Killie bus that are following Scotland everywhere now makes it more enjoyable. 

[Goozay]

23 hours ago, ceudmilefailte said:

I think there might be a lot flights missed for the Northern Ireland friendly. 

The nations league might be similar, it was great fun when we were playing to get a play off spot and promotion. Not sure playing Europe's elite will have the same attraction. 

The attendance at the Northern Ireland friendly will be interesting: unattractive opponents versus still on a high from qualifying.

I think the take-up for the Nations League will depend on the draw. If we get some "glamour" ties with some big names that do well at the Euros in the summer then take-up will be healthy both home and away.  If we get Israel again, not so much.

[ceudmilefailte]

16 minutes ago, Goozay said:

The attendance at the Northern Ireland friendly will be interesting: unattractive opponents versus still on a high from qualifying.

I think the take-up for the Nations League will depend on the draw. If we get some "glamour" ties with some big names that do well at the Euros in the summer then take-up will be healthy both home and away.  If we get Israel again, not so much.

Hadn't taken into account that we might do well at the euros😉

[Orraloon]

39 minutes ago, Goozay said:

The attendance at the Northern Ireland friendly will be interesting: unattractive opponents versus still on a high from qualifying.

I think the take-up for the Nations League will depend on the draw. If we get some "glamour" ties with some big names that do well at the Euros in the summer then take-up will be healthy both home and away.  If we get Israel again, not so much.

I don't think we can draw Israel as they will be in the same pot as us. Netherlands, Denmark and Poland would do nicely.

[Squirrelhumper]

18 hours ago, Goozay said:

The attendance at the Northern Ireland friendly will be interesting: unattractive opponents versus still on a high from qualifying.

I think the take-up for the Nations League will depend on the draw. If we get some "glamour" ties with some big names that do well at the Euros in the summer then take-up will be healthy both home and away.  If we get Israel again, not so much.

Never really understood this. You are there to watch Scotland, not the opposition. 

[Goozay]

2 hours ago, Squirrelhumper said:

Never really understood this. You are there to watch Scotland, not the opposition. 

That's part of what makes you Elite 🤴

[ceudmilefailte]

3 hours ago, Squirrelhumper said:

Never really understood this. You are there to watch Scotland, not the opposition. 

Depends how much it costs you money and time wise, all competitive games, yes. 

Friendly against Estonia, nah France nah Something in between maybe. 

Costa Rica definitely, so I can moan about anyone that doesn't go as long as I have been since we last played them. 

Only the elite were there

[Orraloon]

1 hour ago, ceudmilefailte said:

Depends how much it costs you money and time wise, all competitive games, yes. 

Friendly against Estonia, nah France nah Something in between maybe. 

Costa Rica definitely, so I can moan about anyone that doesn't go as long as I have been since we last played them. 

Only the elite were there

Anybody got a translation for this, please?

[ceudmilefailte]

1 hour ago, Orraloon said:

Anybody got a translation for this, please?

Which bit? 

[Orraloon]

2 hours ago, ceudmilefailte said:

 

Costa Rica definitely, so I can moan about anyone that doesn't go as long as I have been since we last played them. 

 

This bit.

[N4Footsoldier]

I understand to some extent the gate being smaller for teams that aren't glamourous' seeing as how some of the big players  are commoditized these days through endorsements, Sky Sports etc. Understandably kids will pester their parents to take them to see Mbappe, Ronaldo, Neymar, Messi etc play at Hampden Park.

For grown adults who consider themselves Scotland fans (even casually), I really don't get it. 

I remember people were refusing to turn our for Gibraltar at home, which I understood was mostly about the ticket pricing at the time and the fact the team weren't very good. But saying it was BECAUSE it was only Gibraltar is a kop out for me. 

[ceudmilefailte]

21 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

This bit.

Friendly in 2018,we lost 1-0,official attendance 20,000 I would say 5000 was nearer the mark. Now I think about it was supporters club  points for home games then. Didn't think so. 

To all the newbies unless you sat though that sort of shit don't moan about not getting tickets for games now. 

 

Edited December 14, 2023 by ceudmilefailte

[Grim Jim]

6 hours ago, N4Footsoldier said:

I understand to some extent the gate being smaller for teams that aren't glamourous' seeing as how some of the big players  are commoditized these days through endorsements, Sky Sports etc. Understandably kids will pester their parents to take them to see Mbappe, Ronaldo, Neymar, Messi etc play at Hampden Park.

For grown adults who consider themselves Scotland fans (even casually), I really don't get it. 

I remember people were refusing to turn our for Gibraltar at home, which I understood was mostly about the ticket pricing at the time and the fact the team weren't very good. But saying it was BECAUSE it was only Gibraltar is a kop out for me. 

My dad used to take me to a few games.   The only Home Internationals though, were against Northern Ireland.   I think it was because he wanted to see George Best.   I don't think he ever turned up, but Law was there!   We did catch an ageing Eusebio in a friendly, so he was the starstruck one.   ...Possibly because (before my time), he was sick in bed with flu holding a ticket for the Real vs Frankfurt game and missed it ☹️

Re. Gibraltar, I was on the way to that game and was thinking that we might see the first Scotland hat-trick since Colin Stein.   "Damn me, if it happens, I'll be headin' back to the Pot Still for a 25 year old dram!"   No disrespect to Gibraltar; it had been feckin' decades 😄

Barman couldn't find the bottle though 🙈

[N4Footsoldier]

9 hours ago, Grim Jim said:

My dad used to take me to a few games.   The only Home Internationals though, were against Northern Ireland.   I think it was because he wanted to see George Best.   I don't think he ever turned up, but Law was there!   We did catch an ageing Eusebio in a friendly, so he was the starstruck one.   ...Possibly because (before my time), he was sick in bed with flu holding a ticket for the Real vs Frankfurt game and missed it ☹️

Re. Gibraltar, I was on the way to that game and was thinking that we might see the first Scotland hat-trick since Colin Stein.   "Damn me, if it happens, I'll be headin' back to the Pot Still for a 25 year old dram!"   No disrespect to Gibraltar; it had been feckin' decades 😄

Barman couldn't find the bottle though 🙈

At the time I was convinced there wasn't a team in the world we were capable of putting 6 goals past. So when they equalised after Strachan played that mental formation with 2 recognized defenders in the starting 11 I feared the worst.

At least you've not had to wait too long to have that Hattrick Dram again!

[GLOSTA]

On 12/9/2023 at 1:19 PM, N4Footsoldier said:

Please note the title of this topic isn't there to cause any offence, I picked the terminology up from some humourous posts from social media following the raft of arguments over allocations, points and the sales schedule for the Euro 2024 tickets. Joking aside, there has been an ugly side to the debate over the last few days between SSC members (leaving the SSC themselves out of it), which hopefully should eventually gloss over as a storm in a teacup. I’d also like to stress that most of the below should be considered my own opinion but more a summary of what I’ve already heard.

I wanted to create a space to share my own thoughts on the whole situation and for others to gather opinions respectfully on it all. In terms of my own perspective, I am on 30 points now after starting from 0 points in late 2017, missing only 1 home game in that time and accruing many points through going to away games which mostly went down to zero points through the 2018-19 period when we were shite. That said, I hope to give a balanced view of the happenings of the last few days.

The whole incident came up when of 10,000 tickets allocated to SSC members, the SSC would provide access codes to those on 32-12 points, approximately 7800 people. For perspective, a regular sales schedule for smaller away day allocations normally starts at 32-23 points, or 1000 people, depending on the allocation we get. Let’s call this set of people “The Elite”. The sensitivity here was exacerbated by the excessive disparity in pricing between FF and Cat 3 and above tickets for the opening game v Germany.

The initial widespread gripe from the Elite was the exposure they had to the pricing, now being pitched in direct competition with close to 7000 additional people for the cheaper tickets, and people who some of them may have considered as not being deserving of such an opportunity given the years of commitment and money spent to attend so many games to accrue said points. Especially for those who could be seen as “glory hunting” over the last 3 years when the team has done well, which has thickened the pyramid of the points table.

Digging into that argument, in fairness, following Scotland has never been as easy in the last 20 years as it has been now in terms of the team’s success. People on 23+ points have undoubtedly travelled far and wide to places where we either knew we would lose, didn’t fancy ourselves for a result, or in the worst scenario, unexpectedly lose. People who have been through years and decades of that could have seen the ticket release as a slap in the face in favour of those who haven’t “paid their dues” as much. There is also the common myth that Elite members are “loaded”, which in some instances may be true, but there are considerable sacrifices made by most of them to travel the world supporting Scotland.

Make no mistake, no one forces anyone to go on Scotland trips. And in doing so, you have to balance up other commitments like relationships, family, work, money, even club teams etc. While the Elite can arguably say they have “earned it” through all these considerations I wouldn’t say it is the be all and end all. Others may see it as a bit sad the extent to which people go to support Scotland and are quite happy to support the team more casually. Then you have people who don’t stay within reasonable commuting distance from Glasgow, who need to take days off work and spend some extortionate amounts on domestic public transport or fuel to attend home games, for which, thankfully loyalty points are now given. I was quite happy about this myself having not been able to accrue away points or go to away games when I was much younger despite going to most games throughout my teenage years.

Nowadays I live in England with easy access to many cheap routes and connecting flights to Europe. I also have the ability to work from home from my Mum’s house in Glasgow, originally being from there. So I can attend both home and away relatively more easily without such high costs or annual leave commitments as many people in more rural Scotland for example. Despite having to travel to Glasgow from 400 miles away for home games, all things considered I do have things relatively easy.

The argument against the Elite regarding the sales schedule would be that the purpose of the loyalty point system ensures the guarantee of an opportunity to buy tickets within the amount allocated, NOT the guarantee of a cheaper ticket than everyone else. This is an argument that I can also get behind in that sense.

Basically all I’m saying is that despite being considered in the “Elite”, I can see both sides of the argument. The Elite members quite rightly have a voice with the SSC due to their long-standing commitment at substantial personal cost, but we set a poor precedent if some 1000 people have a far heavier sway than the rest of the combined 37000+.

My hope is that this will all be forgotten, after all some of today’s riff raff will be tomorrow’s elite, and given the average ages across the spectrum of the points ladder, that needs to be considered for the long term future of the Tartan Army.              

I was one of those having a whinge. It was bad tempered, self centred and daft of me. Quite rightly any ire should be aimed at UEFA- as an example the only ticket for Munich my 11 year old nephew cousl get was €600.

My only mitigation was I let a bad mood get the better of me...

Having dragged our work group to leave Bosnia early so we could get to Zagreb on time for me to buy the tix... except it was a screw up.

When ballot restarted next day I stopped a work meeting to go online...  could only get a €195 ticket for Munich.. and at same time getting messages from someone who got a Fans First with no intention of going to the game.

Not an excuse.

BTW since I started going back to away games 20 years ago the Elite remain a mysterious and mythical bunch I have yet to meet.