Scottish players in action 21/22

[romanticscot]

McTominay hasn't played great for us, but he has been playing in defense and the one time I recall him this year in midfield I felt he was trying too hard.  He has not to my knowledge ever complained, always willing to play where he is asked and has a ton of ability.  Too bad we don't have friendlies to experiment these days. 

[0Neils40yarder]

1 hour ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Not for Scotland - not a chance in the world

Is he a better player? Aye without a doubt...

 

...has he been used here there and everywhere for Scotland and not been given a run of games in his best position? Aye without a doubt.

 

McGregor has played well recently I can't argue with that but he's had some shockers for Scotland as well over the years.

[Caledonian Craig]

7 minutes ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

Is he a better player? Aye without a doubt...

 

...has he been used here there and everywhere for Scotland and not been given a run of games in his best position? Aye without a doubt.

 

McGregor has played well recently I can't argue with that but he's had some shockers for Scotland as well over the years.

End of the day my interest is in Scotland and performances for us.

McGregor has performed better for us than McTominay - absolutely no doubt about that. You could argue about McTominay being played all over the place but so has he for United so it is not stretching it to expect the same from him for Scotland and he has not delivered. A great example is the recent Faroe Islands away and Moldova away games. McTominay featured in the Faroes game (McGregor did not) and that was a turgid disjointed display in which we laboured painfully to a late winner. The Moldova game saw no McTominay and McGregor playing and it was so much better a performance. 

[0Neils40yarder]

He has played the vast, vast majority of his Manchester United performances in the Premier League at Central midfield...he should be afforded the opportunity to play in his preferred position for a few games to let him put his stamp on it. I'm honestly amazed that anyone thinks Calum McGregor is better than him

[Caledonian Craig]

9 minutes ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

He has played the vast, vast majority of his Manchester United performances in the Premier League at Central midfield...he should be afforded the opportunity to play in his preferred position for a few games to let him put his stamp on it. I'm honestly amazed that anyone thinks Calum McGregor is better than him

For Scotland McGregor has defo been better than McTominay - it really isn't even a matter worth trying to debate at present. Our best performances in the last year have included McGregor/McGinn and Gilmour in midfield. When McTominay has played the difference is clear.

[mccaughey85]

11 minutes ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

He has played the vast, vast majority of his Manchester United performances in the Premier League at Central midfield...he should be afforded the opportunity to play in his preferred position for a few games to let him put his stamp on it. I'm honestly amazed that anyone thinks Calum McGregor is better than him

He hasn't always played that great for man utd, theres a reason why alot man utd fans slag him. He has good games but also has alot of average/poor games for them. 

Mcgregor has played well for Scotland and thats why he should keep his place even if you think mctominay is the better player. 

I would like to see a four man midfield diamond with Gilmour, McTominay, mcgregor and mcginn. 

 

[Blantyre_Braveheart]

14 minutes ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

He has played the vast, vast majority of his Manchester United performances in the Premier League at Central midfield...he should be afforded the opportunity to play in his preferred position for a few games to let him put his stamp on it. I'm honestly amazed that anyone thinks Calum McGregor is better than him

He hasn't had any good games for us as a CM.

 

He is a superior player to McGregor but McGregor suits our midfield better and links better with Gilmour than Mctominay does.

With a 3 man midfield sometimes it's about finding the best combination and not the best players.

 

 

[0Neils40yarder]

18 minutes ago, Blantyre_Braveheart said:

He hasn't had any good games for us as a CM.

 

He is a superior player to McGregor but McGregor suits our midfield better and links better with Gilmour than Mctominay does.

With a 3 man midfield sometimes it's about finding the best combination and not the best players.

 

 

I agree it's about finding the best combination but we haven't given the McTominay/Gilmour combination a reasonable try.

[mccaughey85]

Mcginn has had an excellent first half tonight. He's been everywhere and looks like making things happen for villa.

Gilmour has been poor, looks like he lacks the size, speed and power to play in the EPL going by that first half. 

[0Neils40yarder]

23 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

He hasn't always played that great for man utd, theres a reason why alot man utd fans slag him. He has good games but also has alot of average/poor games for them. 

Mcgregor has played well for Scotland and thats why he should keep his place even if you think mctominay is the better player. 

I would like to see a four man midfield diamond with Gilmour, McTominay, mcgregor and mcginn. 

 

Man Utd fans are a strange breed...the social media ones are even stranger. 

[mccaughey85]

4 minutes ago, 0Neils40yarder said:

Man Utd fans are a strange breed...the social media ones are even stranger. 

Maybe so but it is still fact that McTominay doesn't always have good games for them. He has alot of games where he's average and he doesn't really stand out in alot of games. 

[Malcolm]

12 hours ago, Dodger said:

Mental that we've found a midfield 3 that's helped win us 6 games in a row and some people want to mess around with it to shoehorn in a player that's consistently underperformed for us. 

We played a midfield 4 against Denmark, and Mctominay is a better option than Armstrong.

[Dodger]

18 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

We played a midfield 4 against Denmark, and Mctominay is a better option than Armstrong.

Armstrong didn't start against Denmark. Ryan Christie did. 

Struggling with the idea of McTominay playing in Christie's position. 

[syecosse]

Some Leeds fans on twitter are saying there defence looks lost without Cooper in it(currently injured, no organisation, they just lost 7-0 against man city. 

 

Didn't get on but striker Thomas Dickson-peters was on the bench for Norwich, 12 goals in his last 14 matches for the reserve team. 

[mcguffin]

48 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

Mcginn has had an excellent first half tonight. He's been everywhere and looks like making things happen for villa.

Gilmour has been poor, looks like he lacks the size, speed and power to play in the EPL going by that first half. 

I watched it too and agree that McGinn was excellent. (Was a bit worried when he took that knock to the knee. Glad to see him play on. Hopefully he was just subbed off as a precaution?).

I know what you mean about the size, speed and power.  To be fair, I think Norwich struggled  physically with Aston Villa in all positions.  That said, on the few occassions Gilmour was given the ball with a wee bit of space, he showed some nice touches: the first-touch cross-pitch pass with the outside of his left foot (2nd half) was particularly good.

One other thing that seemed a bit odd to me was that Norwich were 'going long' from their defence an awful lot. (Setting up Pukki-vs-Mings & Konsa aerial battles. I think those who didn't watch the game can guess the winner of those battles). And I think this partly contributed to Gilmour, to use the tv commentator's phrase, "not getting on the ball". Same for McLean. For much of the game they could only look up and watch the ball fly over their head.

Hoping for more from Norwich in the next game (and hope to see Hanley back soon, as well as their non-Scottish key players like Normann and Rupp). They're better than this showing, surely?

[mccaughey85]

27 minutes ago, mcguffin said:

I watched it too and agree that McGinn was excellent. (Was a bit worried when he took that knock to the knee. Glad to see him play on. Hopefully he was just subbed off as a precaution?).

I know what you mean about the size, speed and power.  To be fair, I think Norwich struggled  physically with Aston Villa in all positions.  That said, on the few occassions Gilmour was given the ball with a wee bit of space, he showed some nice touches: the first-touch cross-pitch pass with the outside of his left foot (2nd half) was particularly good.

One other thing that seemed a bit odd to me was that Norwich were 'going long' from their defence an awful lot. (Setting up Pukki-vs-Mings & Konsa aerial battles. I think those who didn't watch the game can guess the winner of those battles). And I think this partly contributed to Gilmour, to use the tv commentator's phrase, "not getting on the ball". Same for McLean. For much of the game they could only look up and watch the ball fly over their head.

Hoping for more from Norwich in the next game (and hope to see Hanley back soon, as well as their non-Scottish key players like Normann and Rupp). They're better than this showing, surely?

It didn't help that Norwich were terrible tonight. Another problem Gilmour has is he plays it far too simple and takes the easy option most of the time. He needs to be positive and make things happen.

Norwich really needed a player in midfield tonight to do what mcginn did and thats battle and make forward runs with the ball. Aston villa absolutely dominated Norwichs midfield which is a little worrying considering mclean and Gilmour were starting. 

On the other hand mcginn was excellent and really looked like he could play for a top 6 side. 

 

[mccaughey85]

1 hour ago, Dodger said:

Armstrong didn't start against Denmark. Ryan Christie did. 

Struggling with the idea of McTominay playing in Christie's position. 

A midfield diamond could be played with 1 up front. 

[mcguffin]

25 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said:

It didn't help that Norwich were terrible tonight. Another problem Gilmour has is he plays it far too simple and takes the easy option most of the time. He needs to be positive and make things happen.

Norwich really needed a player in midfield tonight to do what mcginn did and thats battle and make forward runs with the ball. Aston villa absolutely dominated Norwichs midfield which is a little worrying considering mclean and Gilmour were starting. 

On the other hand mcginn was excellent and really looked like he could play for a top 6 side. 

 

Yep. All good points. I have to agree with you.

[theabsentee]

3 hours ago, mccaughey85 said:

Mcginn has had an excellent first half tonight. He's been everywhere and looks like making things happen for villa.

Gilmour has been poor, looks like he lacks the size, speed and power to play in the EPL going by that first half. 

I don't like being negative but these are the exact fears I've had since i first saw wee Billy but really hoped i was wrong. 

     Great technical ability but no real pace, no great engine & doesn't tackle is i doubt what a team in a relegation battle needs.  Though this Norwich team look so poor, they have very few attacking threats so it can't be easy for him to find a killer offensive pass. 

   This looks the wrong move for him, might be for the best he goes back to playing with better players at Chelsea or on loan to another club perhaps on the continent in January. 

[mccaughey85]

44 minutes ago, theabsentee said:

I don't like being negative but these are the exact fears I've had since i first saw wee Billy but really hoped i was wrong. 

     Great technical ability but no real pace, no great engine & doesn't tackle is i doubt what a team in a relegation battle needs.  Though this Norwich team look so poor, they have very few attacking threats so it can't be easy for him to find a killer offensive pass. 

   This looks the wrong move for him, might be for the best he goes back to playing with better players at Chelsea or on loan to another club perhaps on the continent in January. 

Yeh I agree, he looked like a young boy against men tonight. The aston villa team had guys who look strong, powerful and fast which seems to be a big part of being an epl player these days. Obviously there are exceptions but alot of the guys in that league are physically strong and Norwich looked out of their depth in that department big time. Gilmour kind of reminds of a better version of Barry bannan, he's technically gifted with a brilliant range of passing but maybe doesn't have the physical attributes for the EPL. 

A move to somewhere better in January would be good for him. Norwich are very poor and they are going to struggle big time to stay up. Maybe a long term move to la liga or serie a where pace and power isn't as important would be a better move for him or just a move to better team in the epl where he isn't expected to do the midfield battling and tackling.

Either way hes potentially going to be an important player for us in the future so it would be good if he can go somewhere that utilises his strengths to good effect and helps him develop as a player.

[aaid]

12 hours ago, mccaughey85 said:

It didn't help that Norwich were terrible tonight. Another problem Gilmour has is he plays it far too simple and takes the easy option most of the time.

 

You are playing for a team at the bottom of the table.  One that when it loses possession struggles to get it back.  Playing it simple is exactly what a player should do in those circumstances.  Maybe if his teammates were able to do the same thing they'd be a bit further up the table.

Trying to play an expansive game under Farke and being picked off is why they are where they are right now.

A tough season for Gilmour but he will be better for the experience

[gkm_vancouver]

9 hours ago, theabsentee said:

I don't like being negative but these are the exact fears I've had since i first saw wee Billy but really hoped i was wrong. 

     Great technical ability but no real pace, no great engine & doesn't tackle is i doubt what a team in a relegation battle needs.  Though this Norwich team look so poor, they have very few attacking threats so it can't be easy for him to find a killer offensive pass. 

   This looks the wrong move for him, might be for the best he goes back to playing with better players at Chelsea or on loan to another club perhaps on the continent in January. 

Just to add to that, remember he got clattered/mugged in the Luxemburg/Netherlands friendlies before the Euros so is potentially a target and needs good supporting players around him to avoid more damaging tackles/injuries. I didn't watch the Norwich v Villa game but went to both the Man City and Leicester games against Villa and McGinn was a stand out in both games. However Vila v Man City was also like boys against men and Villa could hardly get the ball of Man City for the first half. Gilmour will definitely benefit from getting games under his belt but post-Xmas Norwich will likely be more adrift so a move to a better club would be ideal if at all possible.

[ProudScot]

Gilmour is too small…

Are we in the 80’s again!? 

[Tartan blood]

19 hours ago, er yir macaroon said:

McTominay would also provide some protection for Patterson’s forays up the park. This would in turn free up Gilmour (and McGinn) to provide support in attack. McGregor would do the same on the left. 

This is exactly what I'd like to see from McTominay in midfield. However, his discipline has been shocking. Almost every game I can remember him playing in midfield he is all over the place. He seems to take it upon himself to try and get up the park and cover every blade of grass. But that leaves his area of the pitch badly exposed, and then you end up having the players around him picking up the slack. 

The Faroes game was a good example of that. So many of our attacks went through, and were subsequently wasted by McTominay. I'm all for joining in attacks, but he seems to forget it isn't his primary responsibility as a holding midfielder.

I'd have McTominay ahead of McGregor if Clarke boots his backside and tells him to stick to his job.

[mcguffin]

3 hours ago, aaid said:

You are playing for a team at the bottom of the table.  One that when it loses possession struggles to get it back.  Playing it simple is exactly what a player should do in those circumstances.  Maybe if his teammates were able to do the same thing they'd be a bit further up the table.

Trying to play an expansive game under Farke and being picked off is why they are where they are right now.

A tough season for Gilmour but he will be better for the experience

I like your thinking.  Continuing from your last sentence, you might be interested in this?:

"Villa boss Gerrard revealed in post-match comments that he made a late substitution to try nullify Norwich’s Gilmour when they were pressing for an equaliser. Carney Chukwuemeka entered the action in the 83rd minute to carry out the manager’s instruction. ..."
https://www.thechelseachronicle.com/loan-watch/steven-gerrard-makes-billy-gilmour-claim-after-playing-against-chelsea-youngster-last-night/

While Billy Gilmour's at Norwich, I think opponents will try this tactic a lot to try and stifle him. Going to be a tough challenge, but will be an invaluable learning opportunity.