N4Footsoldier Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 48 minutes ago, adamntg said: Why are they having 12 groups of 4 or 5 with play offs instead of a more sensible 8 groups with 6 or 7 and top two qualify? Seems unnecessarily complicated. Too many fixtures maybe? It will be related to number of international windows versus the amount of matchdays that would produce. So the answer in short is yes. It must have been impossible considering UEFA/FIFA appear to be doing anything to shoehorn more competitive matches into the schedule these days. Cash is king Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tartan blood Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 On 6/21/2023 at 2:22 PM, Caledonian Craig said: Also for me our squad's have virtually no padding. By padding I mean in the past you could look at a few players in the squad (outfield players) who you felt were only there to make up the numbers and you hoped we would not have to need to use them. That, for me, is not the case now. There are players on the bench you would be happy to see get a run as their form is great such as Lewis Ferguson and so many who are proven performers such as Christie, Patterson, Armstrong, Cooper and more all waiting in the wings. There are also others outwith the squad who I'd be excited to see get a call-up so we have plenty of options. Roll on September. That's a good point about the lack of padding. I feel that comes from the fact that every new player that is added to the squad is an upgrade on their predecessor. Patterson>O'Donnell, Hickey>Palmer, Dykes>McBurnie, Adams>Russell, Hendry>Bates, Porteous>Gallagher, Gilmour>Fleck. Goalkeeper is probably the only exception to this rule. Some may have argued McLean was padding up until this weekend. Ryan Jack isn't padding, but his Scotland career certainly seems to be winding down. It's not like we have a shortage of midfielders though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 1 hour ago, adamntg said: Why are they having 12 groups of 4 or 5 with play offs instead of a more sensible 8 groups with 6 or 7 and top two qualify? Seems unnecessarily complicated. Too many fixtures maybe? Can’t have more than 6 in a group because there are only 10 match days per group. That doesn’t explain why they don’t keep the current format of 10 groups of 5 or 6. Group winners qualify as of right and 10 runners up go into playoffs with 2 best placed group winners from Nations League who did not finish in top 2. Go back to 2 legged playoffs and you’ve got your 16 qualified teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkbluegas Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 The reality is that now Pots are wedded to competitive performance we need a FIFA world ranking of 30 or above to regularly qualify for World Cups and a top 40ish for the Euro's. It's very doable at the moment but takes considerable investment Financially and Politically to achieve it over the long term Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairbairn Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 2 hours ago, Tartan blood said: That's a good point about the lack of padding. I feel that comes from the fact that every new player that is added to the squad is an upgrade on their predecessor. Patterson>O'Donnell, Hickey>Palmer, Dykes>McBurnie, Adams>Russell, Hendry>Bates, Porteous>Gallagher, Gilmour>Fleck. Goalkeeper is probably the only exception to this rule. Some may have argued McLean was padding up until this weekend. Ryan Jack isn't padding, but his Scotland career certainly seems to be winding down. It's not like we have a shortage of midfielders though. Did David Bates get in Scotland squads? Jeez, we must have slim pickings at that point! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotlad Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 2 minutes ago, Fairbairn said: Did David Bates get in Scotland squads? Jeez, we must have slim pickings at that point! Not only did he get in squads he also won caps! I mind him playing against Israel and Albania. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamntg Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 2 hours ago, Texas Pete said: Can’t have more than 6 in a group because there are only 10 match days per group. That doesn’t explain why they don’t keep the current format of 10 groups of 5 or 6. Group winners qualify as of right and 10 runners up go into playoffs with 2 best placed group winners from Nations League who did not finish in top 2. Go back to 2 legged playoffs and you’ve got your 16 qualified teams. On the other hand, if there are 12 groups and Scotland could continue to improve to get into the top 12 then the second seed could be significantly less strong than with fewer groups. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judith Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 58 minutes ago, Fairbairn said: Did David Bates get in Scotland squads? Jeez, we must have slim pickings at that point! He did indeed. If you look back to the Russia away game which was one of Steve Clarkes early fixtures, our first 11 was...... Marshall Palmer Mulgrew Devlin Robertson McGregor McGinn Fleck, Snodgrass Fraser Burke Thats some turnaround in the squad and formation. It has taken a fair bit of time to get where we are now, but Clarke must take huge plaudits for the work he has done building a competitive squad. Of course some of that can just be down to timing, and the emergence of younger players like Gilmour, Patterson and Hickey etc isnt Clarkes doing, but he still has to develop them.and get them playing effectively as a team. Good times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 Just noticed Oddschecker has us at 200-1 to win the euros but Norway at 125-1 Wtf with that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 3 hours ago, Texas Pete said: Can’t have more than 6 in a group because there are only 10 match days per group. That doesn’t explain why they don’t keep the current format of 10 groups of 5 or 6. Group winners qualify as of right and 10 runners up go into playoffs with 2 best placed group winners from Nations League who did not finish in top 2. Go back to 2 legged playoffs and you’ve got your 16 qualified teams. This is how i would like it. Maybe 2 of the best placed runners up could qualify automatically and the other 8 runners play a play off match against each other for the other 4 spots. Not sure i would bother with nations league getting spots. Did they get play off spots last time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 19 minutes ago, todd said: Just noticed Oddschecker has us at 200-1 to win the euros but Norway at 125-1 Wtf with that? Thats mental. Norway might not even get in via the nations league play offs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 1 hour ago, mccaughey85 said: This is how i would like it. Maybe 2 of the best placed runners up could qualify automatically and the other 8 runners play a play off match against each other for the other 4 spots. Not sure i would bother with nations league getting spots. Did they get play off spots last time? Yeah Austria and Czech Republic reached the playoffs via the Nations League for the last World Cup. The chances of winning our group in the next NL will be reduced as we’ll be in League A so your suggestion would potentially benefit us but I think UEFA is keen on using the NL for playoff purposes where they can so I’ll be surprised if they don’t do the same again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
er yir macaroon Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 On 6/21/2023 at 5:44 PM, mccaughey85 said: Dunno i felt both him and smith really took the mickey. Both literally just took the job and then fucked off at the slightest better offer. They both just used it as stepping stone in the worst possible way. Smith especially was dirty. To piss off in the middle of a campaign was dirty as fuck. I think clarke has little more class to him and i wouldnt begrudge him leaving at the end of the euros in 2024. That would three campaigns hes had and thats a fair length of service imo. Smith was quite clear there was only one offer that could have made him leave. Slagging off the dead and laughing about molesting women, it’s been some week for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 (edited) 14 minutes ago, er yir macaroon said: Smith was quite clear there was only one offer that could have made him leave. Slagging off the dead and laughing about molesting women, it’s been some week for you. Its been a cracking week tbh. I think you need to take time out from your laptop/phone buddy. If you are pissed off about what i said about smith or some daft jokes i made then you are clearly taking this place too serious and its maybe time to go for a walk or sit in your garden and relax. Provided you have one. Edited June 23, 2023 by mccaughey85 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, er yir macaroon said: Smith was quite clear there was only one offer that could have made him leave. Slagging off the dead and laughing about molesting women, it’s been I'm too lazy to do the proper research, but, with us being in group A, (are our fixtures first?) Could we be the first nation to officially guarantee qualification? Edit to say: general question, not linked to the poster in question, should've clicked on Reply to topic, doh! Edited June 23, 2023 by todd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 2 hours ago, todd said: I'm too lazy to do the proper research, but, with us being in group A, (are our fixtures first?) Could we be the first nation to officially guarantee qualification? Edit to say: general question, not linked to the poster in question, should've clicked on Reply to topic, doh! No it doesn’t work like that but we could still be the first team to qualify. Not sure of the benefit of that to be honest but it would sure as hell beat being the first team eliminated which I’m sure happened to us under Levein. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orraloon Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 1 hour ago, Texas Pete said: No it doesn’t work like that but we could still be the first team to qualify. Not sure of the benefit of that to be honest but it would sure as hell beat being the first team eliminated which I’m sure happened to us under Levein. Levein was gone by the time that happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 31 minutes ago, Orraloon said: Levein was gone by the time that happened. Aye but he started it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 18 hours ago, todd said: Just noticed Oddschecker has us at 200-1 to win the euros but Norway at 125-1 Wtf with that? Haaland effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 (edited) 23 hours ago, Texas Pete said: Can’t have more than 6 in a group because there are only 10 match days per group. That doesn’t explain why they don’t keep the current format of 10 groups of 5 or 6. Group winners qualify as of right and 10 runners up go into playoffs with 2 best placed group winners from Nations League who did not finish in top 2. Go back to 2 legged playoffs and you’ve got your 16 qualified teams. The next Nations League has been expanded to include promotion/relegation play-offs, plus a quarter finals in March 2025, in addition to the semis / finals in June 2025, hence why the World Cup groups need to be smaller. Changed days, you used to be barely finished with the Euros when the World Cup qualifiers started up. The bulk of the qualification for WC26 looks like being between September and November 2025, with playoffs probably in March 2026. Won't leave much time to make plans for North America! Edited June 24, 2023 by Toepoke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 1 hour ago, Toepoke said: The next Nations League has been expanded to include promotion/relegation play-offs, plus a quarter finals in March 2025, in addition to the semis / finals in June 2025, hence why the World Cup groups need to be smaller. Changed days, you used to be barely finished with the Euros when the World Cup qualifiers started up. The bulk of the qualification for WC26 looks like being between September and November 2025, with playoffs probably in March 2026. Won't leave much time to make plans for North America! I think they are planning on increasing the Euros to 32 teams in the near future and doing away with Euro qualifiers altogether and just using the Nations League to decide who goes to the finals so maybe this is UEFA beefing up the NL in preparation for that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Texas Pete said: I think they are planning on increasing the Euros to 32 teams in the near future and doing away with Euro qualifiers altogether and just using the Nations League to decide who goes to the finals so maybe this is UEFA beefing up the NL in preparation for that? Unsure, 32 team Euros seems a bit OTT though! Given that we're now in Nations League A there's a 3 in 4 chance we'll be involved in a quarter final or relegation play-off in March 2025. Can't see it confirmed but I'd guess the teams qualifying for the NL quarters will be in a 4 team World Cup group as they will all potentially not be able to play qualifiers in the March or June. A bit of a concern that a player being out for a relatively minor injury could miss an entire World Cup qualification campaign! Edited June 24, 2023 by Toepoke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Toepoke said: Unsure, 32 team Euros seems a bit OTT though! Given that we're now in Nations League A there's a 3 in 4 chance we'll be involved in a quarter final or relegation play-off in March 2025. Can't see it confirmed but I'd guess the teams qualifying for the NL quarters will be in a 4 team World Cup group as they will all potentially not be able to play qualifiers in the March or June. A bit of a concern that a player being out for a relatively minor injury could miss an entire World Cup qualification campaign! I read an article a while back and some UEFA official was saying they want to expand the euros to 32 teams but it would make qualifying redundant so they would likely just use the Nations League but would need to think about the format. Edited June 24, 2023 by Texas Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 6 hours ago, Texas Pete said: I read an article a while back and some UEFA official was saying they want to expand the euros to 32 teams but it would make qualifying redundant so they would likely just use the Nations League but would need to think about the format. Maybe the future of the euros will be the inclusion of middle eastern teams. Israel already gets in. Why not a few more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 22 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said: Maybe the future of the euros will be the inclusion of middle eastern teams. Israel already gets in. Why not a few more. Would those teams bring any value? Not saying they wouldn’t I’m just not sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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