Indyref 2 (2)

[Hertsscot]

Some very confused people on X demanding that there should be a General Election because Humza has resigned!!!!

[TDYER63]

1 hour ago, RanelaghScot said:

I like John Swinney as a government minister but his name getting put forward is like when a managerial vacancy comes up in Scottish football and the Open All Mics team starts bumming up one of their own like Billy Dodds or Jim Duffy.

Especially when they have previously managed the club and been ineffective at best. 

Another leadership contest. At least by retaining my membership I can have another say but if no one is nominated that I feel is competent for the job I wont bother voting. Picking the best of a bad bunch is pointless plus I am not encouraging a party that just makes the same mistakes again. 

Has anyone got confirmation of Alba’s demands yet? It would be good to know if they were taking the piss or the high heid yins will just never entertain AS. 

[DoonTheSlope]

37 minutes ago, StirlingEgg said:

That accolade should be reserved for Call Me Dave on his luxury jet mystery tour...Securing arm sales? Some natural resources? Trying to make China/Russia jealous? Just photo ops?...

But look at Westminster…

A typical response to any form of criticism aimed at the SNP

Where would the SNP and its followers be without a bit of whataboutery eh

[DoonTheSlope]

Unhinged, unwanted and unelected

A failure in every ministerial position he’s held. A transport minister who was on the road without proper insurance

Two weeks ago he vowed to make Scotland Tory free then only at the weekend he was sending begging letters to the linesman. I would call him an absolute fanny but fannys are useful

He's no great loss

I hope Big Alex is smiling wryly to himself tonight when he has a dram or two

[Hertsscot]

I don't get the Green mentality. Scupper the SNP, throw your toys out of the pram and where does it get them? Certainly no closer to seeing their agenda becomes reality. 

[Ally Bongo]

If Swinney or Robertson get it the SNP can switch the lights off

 

[hampden_loon2878]

41 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

Especially when they have previously managed the club and been ineffective at best. 

Another leadership contest. At least by retaining my membership I can have another say but if no one is nominated that I feel is competent for the job I wont bother voting. Picking the best of a bad bunch is pointless plus I am not encouraging a party that just makes the same mistakes again. 

Has anyone got confirmation of Alba’s demands yet? It would be good to know if they were taking the piss or the high heid yins will just never entertain AS. 

From what I can gather, there was no demands

[StirlingEgg]

25 minutes ago, DoonTheSlope said:

But look at Westminster…

A typical response to any form of criticism aimed at the SNP

Where would the SNP and its followers be without a bit of whataboutery eh

It's not just whataboutery though, it's an observation of the enormous amount of hypocrisy we put up with daily.

The fact that Sunak is still in power after a plethora of scandals which dwarfs anything happening north of the border shows how broken our shambles of a system is. The Tories voted against the very creation of Scottish & Welsh parliaments...there might come a day when it will be only Westminster we can look at. 

[hampden_loon2878]

10 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

If Swinney or Robertson get it the SNP can switch the lights off

 

I actually believe the MP’s apart from cherry, blackford and a few other are totally oblivious to what sturgeon and her cronies have been up too,, get all those close to sturgeon on the furthest back,back benches 

[DoonTheSlope]

4 minutes ago, StirlingEgg said:

It's not just whataboutery though, it's an observation of the enormous amount of hypocrisy we put up with daily.

The fact that Sunak is still in power after a plethora of scandals which dwarfs anything happening north of the border shows how broken our shambles of a system is. The Tories voted against the very creation of Scottish & Welsh parliaments...there might come a day when it will be only Westminster we can look at. 

It’s absolutely whataboutery. The discussion is about the SNP led Scottish government and not about Sunak or Cameron but the age old SNP war cry of aye but Westminster still continues to rear its brass neck

[Ally Bongo]

1 hour ago, TDYER63 said:

Especially when they have previously managed the club and been ineffective at best. 

Another leadership contest. At least by retaining my membership I can have another say but if no one is nominated that I feel is competent for the job I wont bother voting. Picking the best of a bad bunch is pointless plus I am not encouraging a party that just makes the same mistakes again. 

Has anyone got confirmation of Alba’s demands yet? It would be good to know if they were taking the piss or the high heid yins will just never entertain AS. 

 

[Malcolm]

I would be right up for an SNP, Alba, conservative coalition led by Kate Forbes with Douglas Ross as deputy FM.

[AlfieMoon]

I wanted Forbes to get it in the last leadership contest but I wouldn’t say that Swinney seems like any sort of bad call at this point.  
 

Admittedly, I don’t know the ins and outs of the entrenched camps within the SNP that may be doing more harm than good. 

[Northern Light]

It's going to be Honest John, isn't it. It's like a year ago all over again with the establishment trying to get unstoppable momentum behind the Sturgeon candidate. If that happens it's just another two years lost in the Independence wilderness. Nicola's fingerprints are all over this unfortunately.

I'm not sure Kate will even stand and maybe the clever long game is to let Swinney pick up the thumping the SNP will inevitably get in the WM GE and then put in a challenge ahead of the 2026 election as I struggle to see how someone like Swinney could remotely inspire the missing voters from 2024 to return to voting SNP in 2026

[Och Aye]

28 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

I would be right up for an SNP, Alba, conservative coalition led by Kate Forbes with Douglas Ross as deputy FM.

Do you sell any gear or just take it?

[exile]

I don't see Swinney as the future, unless it is to hold the fort for someone else. What is Stephen Flynn's game?

Re whataboutery, I think it's reasonable to compare situations when we are talking about 'circumstances in which a country's leader might be expected to resign'. It's not just Scotland v Wesminster. In all the scandals and f---ups since Johsnon took over, amost no one resigned for wrong going, when you'd normally expect it. 'Normally' means comparing with previous Westminster practice, of ministers falling on their words etc, when they are more likely nowadays to brazen it out. 

I thought there was a prediction the other day that SNP would hold their seats, not a wipeout. The prediction may be wrong, or in any case could be already undermined by the FM 'chaos'.

To continue the football analogies, the whole thing feels like a massive unforced error. Of course it involved challenges from the opposition, like a sturdy shoulder charge, but that is par for the course; or else it was passing to opposing attackers or fouling them in an attacking positon so they get a free kick given away needlessly. A free hit for the media too - which is part of the game. What a mess.

 

Edited April 29 by exile

[Ally Bongo]

Any SNP MSP or MP who states that they would not work with Kate Forbes if she was elected leader NEED to be deselected

It's already started

[StirlingEgg]

30 minutes ago, exile said:

I don't see Swinney as the future, unless it is to hold the fort for someone else. What is Stephen Flynn's game?

Re whataboutery, I think it's reasonable to compare situations when we are talking about 'circumstances in which a country's leader might be expected to resign'. It's not just Scotland v Wesminster. In all the scandals and f---ups since Johsnon took over, amost no one resigned for wrong going, when you'd normally expect it. 'Normally' means comparing with previous Westminster practice, of ministers falling on their words etc, when they are more likely nowadays to brazen it out. 

I thought there was a prediction the other day that SNP would hold their seats, not a wipeout. The prediction may be wrong, or in any case could be already undermined by the FM 'chaos'.

To continue the football analogies, the whole thing feels like a massive unforced error. Of course it involved challenges from the opposition, like a sturdy shoulder charge, but that is par for the course; or else it was passing to opposing attackers or fouling them in an attacking positon so they get a free kick given away needlessly. A free hit for the media too - which is part of the game. What a mess.

 

👍The original comment I responded to was about Yousaf being a national security risk. This is where Westminster are relevant given their tinkering in other nations' conflicts which the Scottish govt/parliament can only have nightmares about. The vitriol on here can be very uneven given the difference in powers and consequences. 

[Hertsscot]

1 hour ago, Malcolm said:

I would be right up for an SNP, Alba, conservative coalition led by Kate Forbes with Douglas Ross as deputy FM.

I suspect most of the country would not be 

[Hertsscot]

38 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

Any SNP MSP or MP who states that they would not work with Kate Forbes if she was elected leader NEED to be deselected

It's already started

Agreed. Put the egos behind them, start acting as grown ups. If she's elected it will be by party members and they need to respect that.

[Ally Bongo]

32 minutes ago, Hertsscot said:

Agreed. Put the egos behind them, start acting as grown ups. If she's elected it will be by party members and they need to respect that.

Something else

Yousaf spoke to the ALBA "team" at 7.30am today and was clearly still trying to regain the narrative

However - someone at Holyrood leaked a story to The Times last night saying Humza was resigning and John Swinney would take over

Then we have Blackford & Flynn stating at lunchtime today that there was no better candidate than Swinney, who most people would have been surprised at being a runner since he vehemently ruled himself out 12 months ago

It seems Joanna Cherry has been wise to the "coup d'etat" which is why she sent that tweet earlier mentioning "men in grey suits"

[scotlad]

2 hours ago, AlfieMoon said:

I wanted Forbes to get it in the last leadership contest but I wouldn’t say that Swinney seems like any sort of bad call at this point.  

Only in the same way Alex McLeish wasn't a bad call for Scotland manager in 2018, when the only other names in the frame were Gary Caldwell and John Hughes. 😕

2 hours ago, Northern Light said:

It's going to be Honest John, isn't it. It's like a year ago all over again with the establishment trying to get unstoppable momentum behind the Sturgeon candidate. If that happens it's just another two years lost in the Independence wilderness. Nicola's fingerprints are all over this unfortunately.

I'm not sure Kate will even stand and maybe the clever long game is to let Swinney pick up the thumping the SNP will inevitably get in the WM GE and then put in a challenge ahead of the 2026 election as I struggle to see how someone like Swinney could remotely inspire the missing voters from 2024 to return to voting SNP in 2026

I'd still back him to beat Ross or Sarwar in a HR election. Ross leads a toxic party that's in the middle of its own self-destruct cycle and Sarwar is a gibbering moron that no one apart from completely intransigent tribal Labour supporters would see as FM. Swinney would still have his work cut out to avoid the drubbing that's appears to be on the cards at WM though.

If I was Swinney and I was serious about taking the job I'd be on the phone to Forbes offering her her old job back in exchange for a clear run at the leadership post. I'd also do what I could to scrap the daft, unnecessary rule preventing SNP MPs from sitting as MSPs (and vice versa). The SNP's current talent pool isn't deep enough for them to impose such restrictions on themselves.

51 minutes ago, Hertsscot said:

Agreed. Put the egos behind them, start acting as grown ups. If she's elected it will be by party members and they need to respect that.

Absolutely, and if they can't accept that they should put their money where their mouths are and leave the party.

[Malcolm]

2 hours ago, Och Aye said:

Do you sell any gear or just take it?

it’s what I would like not what I expect 😂

[Hertsscot]

1 hour ago, scotlad said:

 😕I'd still back him to beat Ross or Sarwar in a HR election. Ross leads a toxic party that's in the middle of its own self-destruct cycle and Sarwar is a gibbering moron that no one apart from completely intransigent tribal Labour supporters would see as FM. Swinney would still have his work cut out to avoid the drubbing that's appears to be on the cards at WM though.

You may be right. Tories are gloating today but they're a mess. I noticed that the i had a story on their front page about how they'd been speculation that Sunak would call a GE today as he wanted to stave off an attempt to depose him as leader. The  Tory MSPs who are crowing today will be very quiet on social media on Friday as most people expect the Tories to get battered at the local elections in England.

Labour, they're benefitting only because of SNP shooting itself in the foot. They, whether it's Sarwar or Starmer, really have nothing to offer Scotland and SNP need to hammer that home. Labour have betrayed Scotland time and time again, they are Tory-lite and Starmer boasts that they're the party of English patriotism. Can't see that selling well on the doorstep.

[Ally Bongo]

2 minutes ago, Hertsscot said:

You may be right. Tories are gloating today but they're a mess. I noticed that the i had a story on their front page about how they'd been speculation that Sunak would call a GE today as he wanted to stave off an attempt to depose him as leader. The  Tory MSPs who are crowing today will be very quiet on social media on Friday as most people expect the Tories to get battered at the local elections in England.

Labour, they're benefitting only because of SNP shooting itself in the foot. They, whether it's Sarwar or Starmer, really have nothing to offer Scotland and SNP need to hammer that home. Labour have betrayed Scotland time and time again, they are Tory-lite and Starmer boasts that they're the party of English patriotism. Can't see that selling well on the doorstep.

Kezia Dugdale was on Radio 4's The World Tonight with Drew Henry

"John Swinney just might stop the SNP rot but he can't stop the surge in voters turning to Labour"

This is where Drew Henry should have said - going by the elections in the last year the only surge has been in SNP voters staying at home

Kezia again " Even if i was to admit that Scotland would be better off Independent, Independence is not on the table"