killiefaetheferry Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 49 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said: One scenario UEFA/FIFA have not thought about if our semi goes ahead in June. We (if we win) will have had to play two massive matches in the space of four days unlike Wales. Does not seem fair to me. Needs must. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDYER63 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 1 hour ago, Caledonian Craig said: One scenario UEFA/FIFA have not thought about if our semi goes ahead in June. We (if we win) will have had to play two massive matches in the space of four days unlike Wales. Does not seem fair to me. How on earth they cant have thought about it is beyond me. It was the first thing I thought of. Whilst I will be delighted if Ukraine are in a position to play the game in June it puts us at a complete disadvantage for the Wales game if we win. I think the Wales/Austria should have been moved too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDYER63 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 1 hour ago, killiefaetheferry said: Needs must. There was , however , no need. There were alternatives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesaint Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 6 hours ago, vanderark14 said: It's not heartless at all. You are 100% spot on. They shouldn't get a bye out of sympathy. What us the decision in November if yhe fighting In Ukraine is ongoing? Ach, let's just put them in the last 16. IMO Fifa are afraid to make the decision for fear of looking heartless because its better to jump on the virtue signalling band wagon Not that often i agree with you, but you are spot on. Fifa have dug a hole for themselves by postponing our match. Now they are shit scared about looking bad, and to be honest i don't think they have clue where to go from here.They are making decisions on the altar of virtue signaling and not on what is actually right for football. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghorne67 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 31 minutes ago, thesaint said: Not that often i agree with you, but you are spot on. Fifa have dug a hole for themselves by postponing our match. Now they are shit scared about looking bad, and to be honest i don't think they have clue where to go from here.They are making decisions on the altar of virtue signaling and not on what is actually right for football. I don't think it's virtue signaling to allow Ukraine a few months to see if they can still put a team together after their country gets blown to smithereens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 48 minutes ago, thesaint said: Not that often i agree with you, but you are spot on. Fifa have dug a hole for themselves by postponing our match. Now they are shit scared about looking bad, and to be honest i don't think they have clue where to go from here.They are making decisions on the altar of virtue signaling and not on what is actually right for football. Theres ppl dying and suffering, giving ukraine a bit more time to see how this war develops is a small price to pay for us compared with ukraine. If ukraine cant play in june then fifa need to make a tough decision on it but its no great hardship for us. A little perspective is needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazda Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 Maybe giving them a bye this stage in the next World Cup would've been more sensible. Their country has much more important things to adjust to , in the near future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesaint Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 1 hour ago, mccaughey85 said: Theres ppl dying and suffering, giving ukraine a bit more time to see how this war develops is a small price to pay for us compared with ukraine. If ukraine cant play in june then fifa need to make a tough decision on it but its no great hardship for us. A little perspective is needed. Exactly. So do you actually think that football is of any importance to them. I'm sure they have lost a lot of sleep worrying about whether they get to play in a world cup. As you say terrible things are happening in their country but nothing that cant be cured apparantly by the chance of playing in a world cup. It's not good, but the fact is Ukraine aren't and probably won't be anytime in the near future in a position to take part. As for it not being virtue signalling,,,,, aye right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 It will be very interesting to see how FIFA handle the Ukraine matter at the draw a week today for the World Cup Finals. You would think they will have needed to make a firm decision on any bye for Ukraine and announce which group will have five teams before the draw is made. I cannot imagine they can just ignore the matter so they surely will have to make a firm decision in the coming week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbo `81 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 I feel Scotland should be playing Wales on Tuesday with the winner to play Ukraine for a place in Qatar I know that's not ideal, and Wales would potentially have to play 3 games, but from a bigger.picture viewpoint it means the least disruption in June...if Ukraine aren't able to play no changes to fixtures is required, but if they are then only 1 game would need to be accommodated instead of 2 as is now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 7 minutes ago, Robbo `81 said: I feel Scotland should be playing Wales on Tuesday with the winner to play Ukraine for a place in Qatar I know that's not ideal, and Wales would potentially have to play 3 games, but from a bigger.picture viewpoint it means the least disruption in June...if Ukraine aren't able to play no changes to fixtures is required, but if they are then only 1 game would need to be accommodated instead of 2 as is now I am now of the mindset that if Ukraine cannot fulfil the fixture in June then they should forfeit the match. I mean a line has to be drawn somewhere and there is no evidence whatsoever that the situation in Ukraine will be over anytime soon. I know people will say that is being unreasonable but it really isn't All other three teams in Path A have been very accommodating and have been patient and Ukraine must know that the fixture cannot be put on-hols indefinitely especially with the draw taking place next Friday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 3 hours ago, mccaughey85 said: Theres ppl dying and suffering, giving ukraine a bit more time to see how this war develops is a small price to pay for us compared with ukraine. If ukraine cant play in june then fifa need to make a tough decision on it but its no great hardship for us. A little perspective is needed. Are fifa or uefa going to offer the same to all countries suffering because of war? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottincarlisle Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 If the war rages on for another 2 or 3 months would Ukraine even be in a position to field a team at WC if they're given a bye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super_Scotlandfan Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 I see that Finland were given a bye against Ukraine in the World Handball Championship Qualifying. The decision was made by the European Handball Federation rather than Ukraine asking to pull out. Handball might not mean much to us but it's a popular sport for a lot of Europe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super_Scotlandfan Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 10 minutes ago, scottincarlisle said: If the war rages on for another 2 or 3 months would Ukraine even be in a position to field a team at WC if they're given a bye. Yes, they could pull a squad together with their foreign based players. They could field a much stronger team that the Czech C team we played last year. It's the circumstance that that makes forcing them to play unfair. But obviously they can't wait forever, I don't think we can wait until September. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesaint Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 The problems they have created 1 hour ago, Super_Scotlandfan said: I see that Finland were given a bye against Ukraine in the World Handball Championship Qualifying. The decision was made by the European Handball Federation rather than Ukraine asking to pull out. Handball might not mean much to us but it's a popular sport for a lot of Europe. Some governing body with a pair of balls.Right from the start i felt that Ukraine should have pulled out if they couldn't complete the fixture in March.Instead of making the judgement based on the situation in March,fifa are making At last a governing body with a pair of balls.Exactly what should have happened in our situation.The decision should have been made taking into account the situation in March and not on some imaginary situation come October. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 4 hours ago, thesaint said: Exactly. So do you actually think that football is of any importance to them. I'm sure they have lost a lot of sleep worrying about whether they get to play in a world cup. As you say terrible things are happening in their country but nothing that cant be cured apparantly by the chance of playing in a world cup. It's not good, but the fact is Ukraine aren't and probably won't be anytime in the near future in a position to take part. As for it not being virtue signalling,,,,, aye right. The world cup is obviously not their priority right now but its no hardship for us or fifa to allow them some extra time. Alot can happen in few months and there could be a ceasefire that might allow ukraine to put together a team to play us. I would hope fifa would do the same for us if we were in similar circumstances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 3 hours ago, vanderark14 said: Are fifa or uefa going to offer the same to all countries suffering because of war? Eh? Is there any countries who have play offs for the world cup who have been invaded in the last couple of months who cant currently field a team because of it? If there is then the answer is yes, they should also be given more time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 3 hours ago, Robbo `81 said: I feel Scotland should be playing Wales on Tuesday with the winner to play Ukraine for a place in Qatar I know that's not ideal, and Wales would potentially have to play 3 games, but from a bigger.picture viewpoint it means the least disruption in June...if Ukraine aren't able to play no changes to fixtures is required, but if they are then only 1 game would need to be accommodated instead of 2 as is now Thats a terrible idea, its massively unfair on wales. Why should they have to beat three teams to qualify. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 1 hour ago, mccaughey85 said: Thats a terrible idea, its massively unfair on wales. Why should they have to beat three teams to qualify. Sounds like a great plan! Anything that screws over the Welsh is fine by me 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 1 hour ago, mccaughey85 said: The world cup is obviously not their priority right now but its no hardship for us or fifa to allow them some extra time. Alot can happen in few months and there could be a ceasefire that might allow ukraine to put together a team to play us. I would hope fifa would do the same for us if we were in similar circumstances. Everyone keeps saying football is an irrelevance and they've got bigger things to worry about, which is true, so for fuck sake stop stringing us irrelevants along and just withdraw from the competition already! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 2 hours ago, thesaint said: The problems they have created Some governing body with a pair of balls.Right from the start i felt that Ukraine should have pulled out if they couldn't complete the fixture in March.Instead of making the judgement based on the situation in March,fifa are making At last a governing body with a pair of balls.Exactly what should have happened in our situation.The decision should have been made taking into account the situation in March and not on some imaginary situation come October. Shoosh you!, the 'right on' brigade are gonna be all over you😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 1 hour ago, mccaughey85 said: Eh? Is there any countries who have play offs for the world cup who have been invaded in the last couple of months who cant currently field a team because of it? If there is then the answer is yes, they should also be given more time. So it's only those who make the playoffs. Thanks for clarifying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 48 minutes ago, vanderark14 said: So it's only those who make the playoffs. Thanks for clarifying No, obviously this is a rare situation but if a country was invaded during the qualifying groups and was struggling to field a team then fifa should try and help that country out by making allowances like they are now. Given the harsh realities that the ukrainian ppl are facing i would hope that we(scotland) are willing to do the small goodwill gesture of playing the match at a later date. Its a little depressing that our fans on here are whining like 5 year olds when the ukrainian ppl are courageously fighting foreign occupation of their country. We could learn alot from the ukrainians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romanticscot Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 (edited) I believe that war qualifies as force majeure, meaning Ukraine cannot fulfil their obligations but with no penalty. I believe FIFA will give the situation until late May and make a decision or they will defer it to the IOC for a ruling. It is not out with the realms of possibility that the game goes ahead because players leave Ukraine to train such as Oleksandr Usyk is doing but you need 11 players plus subs and medical and coaching staff. I am sure there would be no shortage of volunteers for support staff. Ukraine should be given reasonable time, but it cannot be delayed beyond June. I am looking for precedent to see if there were any teams national or domestic removed from a tournament because of war and I haven't found anything yet. Removing Ukraine from the play off will likely happen and I expect they will be given some consolation such as a guaranteed play off spot for the next World Cup. They wont be given a by to this world cup, there would be logistical challenges not just for fixtures but travel, and training facilities PLUS if they can't play in June what guarantee's are there that they can play in the Autumn? Ukraine's domestic co-efficient might be boosted somehow but that means agreement from UEFA. If FIFA decide to remove them, I doubt anyone in Ukraine will be focused on it at that moment it will be external people who will be complaining. A bonkers consideration would be a World 11 playing as Ukraine - that would be a movie in the making if it were to happen. I expect Scotland to be professional whoever we play if we play anyone at all. Edited March 26, 2022 by romanticscot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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