Scottish players in action 21/22

[ProudScot]

8 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

There are several players that left Rangers and went onto have careers at a higher level than Rangers 1st team. Charlie Adam and Ross McCormack are just two however this is missing the point. 

The point is that players development is halted because they dont get their chance in the 1st team. By the time they leave they have lost multiple years of crucial development time so they are effectively playing catchup.

Comparing Man City and Rangers is relative. Nobody is saying Rangers should be producing players the standard of Phil Foden but to play 1st team football for Rangers you dont need to be of that standard. Rangers spend significantly more than anybody else in Scotland on their academy bar Celtic. They have the pick of any player in Scotland because of the draw and money they can offer. 

Your final point would be good if it was just this batch of players but we are talking a significant number of years. Are you saying that in 15 odd years Rangers havent had any players who had the talent to make it into their 1st team? When you look at some of the absoulte dross that Rangers have bought, even to make the bench, guys like Scott Wright, Ohalleran, Jones etc etc, nobody who had the potential to be better than these guys.

Lets face it, even when Rangers went to 3rd div they splashed out on guys like Kevin Kyle when they could have filled their side with promising youth and a few senior pros.

Completely bang on. 

Players like Lowry & Stephen Welsh need to get out asap.

Looking at the other Scottish clubs it’s not much better either, Aberdeen, Livi etc barely a Scot in their starting 11.

Sad state of affairs. 

[Tartan blood]

9 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

There are several players that left Rangers and went onto have careers at a higher level than Rangers 1st team. Charlie Adam and Ross McCormack are just two however this is missing the point. 

The point is that players development is halted because they dont get their chance in the 1st team. By the time they leave they have lost multiple years of crucial development time so they are effectively playing catchup.

Comparing Man City and Rangers is relative. Nobody is saying Rangers should be producing players the standard of Phil Foden but to play 1st team football for Rangers you dont need to be of that standard. Rangers spend significantly more than anybody else in Scotland on their academy bar Celtic. They have the pick of any player in Scotland because of the draw and money they can offer. 

Your final point would be good if it was just this batch of players but we are talking a significant number of years. Are you saying that in 15 odd years Rangers havent had any players who had the talent to make it into their 1st team? When you look at some of the absoulte dross that Rangers have bought, even to make the bench, guys like Scott Wright, Ohalleran, Jones etc etc, nobody who had the potential to be better than these guys.

Lets face it, even when Rangers went to 3rd div they splashed out on guys like Kevin Kyle when they could have filled their side with promising youth and a few senior pros.

To add to your point, the best Scottish youths would not be attracted to Rangers over the past 15 years either. It used to be pretty common that the old firm would lure the best youngsters to Glasgow. That doesn't seem to be the case any more. 

Their academy hasn't, historically, been that great either. (Not sure about now) A large part of the reason Rangers are now producing decent talent has a lot to do with the performance schools doing the groundwork. Lowry, King, Gilmour, Wilson and Patterson all went to the performance schools. Did Bailey Rice?

Rangers had an amazing opportunity to recruit all of the best young talent in Scotland while they were down in the lower tiers. They'd have had a very healthy bank balance as well. What a waste.

Edit: It seems Bailey Rice was pinched from Motherwell in 2022. 

Edited July 24, 2023 by Tartan blood

[Tartan blood]

11 hours ago, theabsentee said:

You say that's been the reality for as long as you can remember so tell me the players over this period that have left Rangers & had top class careers? Don't mention Gilmour or Patterson as we know why they both left. Ok Patterson probably should have got more chances but Rangers still sold him for major money.

   Comparing Man City to Rangers is ridiculous, City have a world class heavily funded academy, that's why Foden, Rico Lewis & the like will come thru & endless others will have successful careers even if not at City.

  I'm sorry in my opinion there's a reason why McCrorie has only had 1 loan period at even SPL level of which he spent half the time on the bench, there's probably something in his game that coaches feel isn't at the level required.. Once again if Rangers feel any of either King , Devine & Lowry have the potential to be good enough they will get the chance or be sent out on loan at a decent level to prove it. None of them have done so yet.

Even if Rangers weren't able to create their own, or find the best youngsters to join their academy, they at the very least could have been signing other clubs best players when they first break through. Just take a glance at the current Scotland squad, plus the list of good players that can't even get a call up. The players exist. It's about identifying them early and be willing to put in the effort to develop them.

[scotlad]

16 hours ago, theabsentee said:

I respect all the opinions on lack of Scottish youngsters making it at the old firm but I still don't buy it totally. Fans only have opinion they have no influence on who starts or gets minutes when the old firm are 2 or 3 up in cup / league games. Reality is that Old firm especially Rangers in recent years spent too much money on mediocrity but arguably they are still better than most of the Scottish kids coming thru .

Fans don't have a direct influence but if they start getting on a player's case it can very easily begin to affect his confidence, particularly if the player in question is young and inexperienced.

Clearly, the reason OF managers tend to go for imports is because success is demanded of them immediately.  It is funny how Rangers in particular are now signing players from the English Championship, a league where many of their "cast-offs" end up playing anyway!

[Squirrelhumper]

Liam Morrison started for Wigan vs Everton at the weekend. Seems to be getting good reviews. 

[Bristol Killie]

Another two for Conway at the weekend. Two good finishes. 

 

[mccaughey85]

1 hour ago, Bristol Killie said:

Another two for Conway at the weekend. Two good finishes. 

 

Really hope he starts the season well as i think he could easily be the goalscoring striker we usually lack.

[Kirk]

On 7/20/2023 at 9:21 AM, mccaughey85 said:

Sone nice bits of skills from doak. He seems to have that confidence and drive to take players on. Definitely something we have lacked in recent years. 

His speed is impressive as well.

Could this lad end up being scotlands youngest ever debutant?

3 mins and the majority were him passing simple balls. He does look sharp running with it but final ball pretty poor. Plenty of time for improvement and Klopp seems to like him so hopefully some first team games this year.

On 7/20/2023 at 1:26 PM, Orraloon said:

His final ball looks about as good as James Forrest's. 

Don't say that, we have already had the false hope of Ryan Fraser after him. Two utterly dire overrated players

10 hours ago, Squirrelhumper said:

Liam Morrison started for Wigan vs Everton at the weekend. Seems to be getting good reviews. 

Is that the boy that was at Bayern?

[csinclair]

43 minutes ago, Kirk said:

Is that the boy that was at Bayern?

Recently signed a new deal at Bayern and was loaned out to Wigan 

[Kirk]

23 minutes ago, csinclair said:

Recently signed a new deal at Bayern and was loaned out to Wigan 

Ahh fair enough hopefully gets some good game time then

[theabsentee]

2 hours ago, Kirk said:

3 mins and the majority were him passing simple balls. He does look sharp running with it but final ball pretty poor. Plenty of time for improvement and Klopp seems to like him so hopefully some first team games this year.

Don't say that, we have already had the false hope of Ryan Fraser after him. Two utterly dire overrated players

Is that the boy that was at Bayern?

Crikey I thought I was the one posting slightly negative stuff lately 😆

[Kirk]

1 hour ago, theabsentee said:

Crikey I thought I was the one posting slightly negative stuff lately 😆

Being realistic 😂

[Tartan blood]

22 hours ago, Kirk said:

3 mins and the majority were him passing simple balls. He does look sharp running with it but final ball pretty poor. Plenty of time for improvement and Klopp seems to like him so hopefully some first team games this year.

Don't say that, we have already had the false hope of Ryan Fraser after him. Two utterly dire overrated players

Is that the boy that was at Bayern?

Over the 2 games, I thought his final ball was not too bad. Especially the first game, where I felt the attackers should have made more of an effort to go for his crosses. But he's 17, the fact he is singlehandedly carving out these chances is remarkable. Experience will help with decision making. The talent he has already demonstrated is frightening. If he doesn't go onto get senior caps, I'll be astonished. He seems inevitable.

Ryan Fraser is only overrated by Ryan Fraser. When he's available, he's a fantastic creative outlet. His biggest hindrance is his attitude, it seems. I agree about Forrest, though. He had a very low ceiling that he bumped his head off of a few times.

[ceudmilefailte]

20 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

Over the 2 games, I thought his final ball was not too bad. Especially the first game, where I felt the attackers should have made more of an effort to go for his crosses. But he's 17, the fact he is singlehandedly carving out these chances is remarkable. Experience will help with decision making. The talent he has already demonstrated is frightening. If he doesn't go onto get senior caps, I'll be astonished. He seems inevitable.

Ryan Fraser is only overrated by Ryan Fraser. When he's available, he's a fantastic creative outlet. His biggest hindrance is his attitude, it seems. I agree about Forrest, though. He had a very low ceiling that he bumped his head off of a few times.

Forrest was brilliant in Albania and then agaist Israel.

Without those 2 wins we would still be waiting for our first finals appearance in 20 odd years.

[csinclair]

11 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said:

Forrest was brilliant in Albania and then agaist Israel.

Without those 2 wins we would still be waiting for our first finals appearance in 20 odd years.

Always found Forrest to be a bit of an enigma. Played alongside other Scotland players at Celtic who were able to replicate some of their club performances for the national team but never him apart from those 2 games where he was fantastic.

[Tartan blood]

21 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said:

Forrest was brilliant in Albania and then agaist Israel.

Without those 2 wins we would still be waiting for our first finals appearance in 20 odd years.

That was meant to be a Doak endorsement post, not a Forrest bashing one. 

I realise my assessment of him seemed harsh. I was always a Forrest fan, but he was at his absolute best against Albania/Israel. Unfortunately that was his peak. He never took his career to the next level after that. He is almost certainly past it now. Doak's potential is far far higher than Forrest ever came close to realising.

[Big Ramy 1314]

Ryan Christie scores for Bournmouth in a friendly....🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿👊

[Rich NATA]

1 hour ago, Big Ramy 1314 said:

Ryan Christie scores for Bournmouth in a friendly....🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿👊

Against Southampton, but Stuart Armstrong making his first pre-season appearance for Saints then equalised.

 

Pleased to see Armstrong again. Hadn't even seen a photo of him in the pre season galleries on the Saints website. I was beginning to think something was up.

[Kirk]

23 hours ago, ceudmilefailte said:

Forrest was brilliant in Albania and then agaist Israel.

Without those 2 wins we would still be waiting for our first finals appearance in 20 odd years.

Yes he had 2 good games in however many, waste of a jersey 99% of the time.

23 hours ago, csinclair said:

Always found Forrest to be a bit of an enigma. Played alongside other Scotland players at Celtic who were able to replicate some of their club performances for the national team but never him apart from those 2 games where he was fantastic.

This

[Diamond Scot]

Gilmour with a Rolls Royce performance for Brighton against Brentford tonight in a very competitive friendly. 

[Squirrelhumper]

On 7/25/2023 at 1:26 AM, Kirk said:

Being realistic 😂

Saying Forrest is/was dire isn't be realistic. It's just being daft. 

[Squirrelhumper]

On 7/25/2023 at 8:15 PM, Tartan blood said:

That was meant to be a Doak endorsement post, not a Forrest bashing one. 

I realise my assessment of him seemed harsh. I was always a Forrest fan, but he was at his absolute best against Albania/Israel. Unfortunately that was his peak. He never took his career to the next level after that. He is almost certainly past it now. Doak's potential is far far higher than Forrest ever came close to realising.

True, Forrest will still retire tone of he most decorated player in Celtic's history, been footballer writers player of the year, players player of the year, soored a hatrick or scotland which helped get us to the euros and got a testimonial at a huge club. He' not done too badly. 

[thesaint]

3 hours ago, Squirrelhumper said:

True, Forrest will still retire tone of he most decorated player in Celtic's history, been footballer writers player of the year, players player of the year, soored a hatrick or scotland which helped get us to the euros and got a testimonial at a huge club. He' not done too badly

Agree. Never had a problem with Forrest. Always liked him. 

[mccaughey85]

4 hours ago, Squirrelhumper said:

True, Forrest will still retire tone of he most decorated player in Celtic's history, been footballer writers player of the year, players player of the year, soored a hatrick or scotland which helped get us to the euros and got a testimonial at a huge club. He' not done too badly. 

Hes done alright in his career but for scotland he was mostly woeful apart from 2 games.

No harm to the guy. He seems like a nice lad who turned up and tried his best.

[ceudmilefailte]

Scott McTominay getting good reviews in Man Uniteds pre seaon games.

Sneaky feeling he will still be at Man United for the new season, valuable assit for a big club playing a lot of games.

Got a slight knock though, hopefully nothing serious.