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I see this nonsense has raised its head again...the absolute state we have managed to get ourselves in since March, calling leagues early, dishing out medals for incomplete seasons, relegation for teams within touching distance of safety, the bribes and lies around the votes...the pigs ear we are making of reconstruction, the absolute and obviousness of the 'every man for themselves' attitude...and now this...

 

...an abomination of an idea, that will only allow the old firm a further stranglehold on our game, hoovering up even more youngsters. I honestly fucking despair 

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Absolutely oppose this unless it's opened up to other clubs.

Also they should not be allowed to be promoted from the bottom tier.

 

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34 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Absolutely oppose this unless it's opened up to other clubs.

Also they should not be allowed to be promoted from the bottom tier.

A Prem club can also buy their way in for £25k, but can only join the Highland or Lowland league to start with and not League 2, which will now be League 1?

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55 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Absolutely oppose this unless it's opened up to other clubs.

Also they should not be allowed to be promoted from the bottom tier.

 

I oppose it full stop

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Another lot of nonsense where Rangers* want to try and flex their muscles and have players playing competitive football for their u-21 team. 
 

It should be a non starter, but nothing unfortunately would surprise me. 
 

*I stated Rangers as I heard they proposed it, not sure if Celtic back it too. 

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Neil McCann thinks “it’s really really good”, that “there’s a lot of great stuff in it” and that he is all for it.

That confirms it must be absolute pish.

Edited by DaveyDenoon

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Scotland fans cant have it both ways. Loads complain that the Old Firm never bring through any youth. Then when a proposal gets put forward that guarentees both clubs reguarly playing around 16 under 21s they complain.

This would give youngters the opportunity to get competitive 1st team football at a level up the championshipnbut still retaining all the benefits of access to proper coaches and training facilities that they wouldnt get if they just went out on loan. From a Scotland view point what is the downside?

Somebody mentioned that the Old Firm would scoop up all the best players. They do this already but cant / dont actually play them. This would force them to play them.

Smaller clubs get increased money, exposure etc. Why is it good enough for Spain but not for Scotland. Go and look at the playerd who have played for the Real Madrid and Barca colt teams and tell me its not a good idea.

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56 minutes ago, Diamond Scot said:

Scotland fans cant have it both ways. Loads complain that the Old Firm never bring through any youth. Then when a proposal gets put forward that guarentees both clubs reguarly playing around 16 under 21s they complain.

This would give youngters the opportunity to get competitive 1st team football at a level up the championshipnbut still retaining all the benefits of access to proper coaches and training facilities that they wouldnt get if they just went out on loan. From a Scotland view point what is the downside?

Somebody mentioned that the Old Firm would scoop up all the best players. They do this already but cant / dont actually play them. This would force them to play them.

Smaller clubs get increased money, exposure etc. Why is it good enough for Spain but not for Scotland. Go and look at the playerd who have played for the Real Madrid and Barca colt teams and tell me its not a good idea.

This isn’t suggested for the good of the game. This has been suggested to benefit Rangers. They very kindly say that other teams can enter too, but just not at the same level as us. Why should rangers be allowed to field a team at u-21 level in the bottom tier, but Kilmarnock & St Mirren can’t, they’ll have to play in the lowland league. There’s ambitious highland & lowland teams that want to move in to the spfl, why should it be made even harder for them to do so? 
 

Brora have been denied a place so far in the set up, if this goes ahead, they may well get a place, but if Aberdeen, Ross County, ICT all enter teams into the highland league, that could set an ambitious team back years as there will be a ridiculously unfair advantage for the professional teams to progress year upon year. 
 

Then what, if all 12 teams from the Premiership decide to go ahead with entering teams, we could potentially have a bottom 2 leagues littered with colt teams to the detriment and probable death of the 12 teams that they’ve replaced. 
 

It’s simply a ridiculous idea designed for self gratification and nothing else. 

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2 hours ago, dandydunn said:

This isn’t suggested for the good of the game. This has been suggested to benefit Rangers. They very kindly say that other teams can enter too, but just not at the same level as us. Why should rangers be allowed to field a team at u-21 level in the bottom tier, but Kilmarnock & St Mirren can’t, they’ll have to play in the lowland league. There’s ambitious highland & lowland teams that want to move in to the spfl, why should it be made even harder for them to do so? 
 

Brora have been denied a place so far in the set up, if this goes ahead, they may well get a place, but if Aberdeen, Ross County, ICT all enter teams into the highland league, that could set an ambitious team back years as there will be a ridiculously unfair advantage for the professional teams to progress year upon year. 
 

Then what, if all 12 teams from the Premiership decide to go ahead with entering teams, we could potentially have a bottom 2 leagues littered with colt teams to the detriment and probable death of the 12 teams that they’ve replaced. 
 

It’s simply a ridiculous idea designed for self gratification and nothing else. 

Great post :ok:

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7 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

Scotland fans cant have it both ways. Loads complain that the Old Firm never bring through any youth. Then when a proposal gets put forward that guarentees both clubs reguarly playing around 16 under 21s they complain.

This would give youngters the opportunity to get competitive 1st team football at a level up the championshipnbut still retaining all the benefits of access to proper coaches and training facilities that they wouldnt get if they just went out on loan. From a Scotland view point what is the downside?

Somebody mentioned that the Old Firm would scoop up all the best players. They do this already but cant / dont actually play them. This would force them to play them.

Smaller clubs get increased money, exposure etc. Why is it good enough for Spain but not for Scotland. Go and look at the playerd who have played for the Real Madrid and Barca colt teams and tell me its not a good idea.

I knew this pish would come up. How many players have come through Rangers this millennium (so you've got 20 years to play with) and made it to a full cap.

Rangers are not a club to propogate youngsters to full players. They even had 4 years in the lower leagues where they could safely blood them. How many of those who played for them in the lower leagues have senior appearances for Rangers? 

This colt thing will.have no impact whatsoever on the Scottish National Team. 

On the other hand Celtic have a reasonable record with developing youth. This would benefit them I think, particularly if they are trying to get the same system of play throughout all levels of their teams. I don't know what their set up is noe so I'm  not sure if that is as. mportant now as when Rodgers was in charge. However they have done well enough loaning players out so I'm not sure how much they will gain as a club. 

Overall for Scottish Football it will be shit, not to mention the insufferable forelock tugging from the SMSM because a Celgers colt team is playing. Awful, awful idea.

 

Edited by beardy
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Just read a little in to it on papers and bbc Scotland.  Overall I think it is a good idea.  Along with other Managers and Directors.  Two main points.  Firstly it would bring more money for the smaller clubs.  Secondly I would hope it would benefit the national team.

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Thirdly.  Change is definitely needed.  Sure we can all agree on that.  You might not agree with Rangers plans but at least they are coming up with a proposal which will in the end be voted on by the clubs.  Some of you above posts would like the status quo?  Same old, same old?

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33 minutes ago, Rolling hIlls said:

Just read a little in to it on papers and bbc Scotland.  Overall I think it is a good idea.  Along with other Managers and Directors.  Two main points.  Firstly it would bring more money for the smaller clubs.  Secondly I would hope it would benefit the national team.

If you could fire up some links to these other managers and directors who think it is good that would help push the debate along.

Also could you outline how this will help the national team that would also be great.

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3 minutes ago, beardy said:

If you could fire up some links to these other managers and directors who think it is good that would help push the debate along.

Also could you outline how this will help the national team that would also be great.

Hi Beardy.  Go on BBC Scottish Football.  Also the Scottish Sun.  Only really glanced over them tbh.  The answer to your question about the national team is that The Big Two sign up the best young players who rarely get a chance to play 'REAL' football.  So might benefit the national team imo.  Also my point about money generation still stands.  I tried to find the article I read earlier from a chairman of a Northern club (not lying) and he felt the same.  Do you think we should just stay as it is?

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1 minute ago, Rolling hIlls said:

Hi Beardy.  Go on BBC Scottish Football.  Also the Scottish Sun.  Only really glanced over them tbh.  The answer to your question about the national team is that The Big Two sign up the best young players who rarely get a chance to play 'REAL' football.  So might benefit the national team imo.  Also my point about money generation still stands.  I tried to find the article I read earlier from a chairman of a Northern club (not lying) and he felt the same.  Do you think we should just stay as it is?

Celtic and Rangers both loan players to the lower leagues. Who has been a success in the last few years and stepped up to the first squad never mind the national team.

Callum McGregor would be the obvious one but hr went down south. As i mentioned Celtic appear to have a system of bringing their youth through.

I see no benefit of this. So let's hear who the success stories are.

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Just now, beardy said:

Celtic and Rangers both loan players to the lower leagues. Who has been a success in the last few years and stepped up to the first squad never mind the national team.

Callum McGregor would be the obvious one but hr went down south. As i mentioned Celtic appear to have a system of bringing their youth through.

I see no benefit of this. So let's hear who the success stories are.

I think my main point is that we need to change.  I have always advocated a bigger top division and less leagues.  So, in a general way I think it would be better (forgetting about the colts teams).  

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4 minutes ago, Rolling hIlls said:

I think my main point is that we need to change.  I have always advocated a bigger top division and less leagues.  So, in a general way I think it would be better (forgetting about the colts teams).  

So do you  think in a time of uncertainty that this is when we should implement change. 

Wait and see what the post Covid landscape looks like and then look to implement change. 

They're may not be 18 teams for a 3rd division and scraps thrown from the Rantic table won't change that.

 

Edited by beardy

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1 minute ago, beardy said:

So do you  think in a time of uncertainty that this is when we should implement change. 

Wait and see what the post Covid landscape looks like and then look to implement change. 

They're may not be 18 teams for a 3rd division and scraps thrown from the Rantic table won't change that.

 

I honestly believe that this is the perfect time for change.  Plenty breathing space just now to plan and for the clubs to talk.  It's annoying me now that I cant remember what that chairmans club is.  But I remember Rangers youths/U 21 team used to play at Bathgate Thistles ground.  I think it was a Sunday ( I never went).  But seemingly the crowds were very good and helped the junior club out very well in terms of gate receipts, food, hospitality etc.  Like it or not, the OF carry some support.  Things are what they are.  But I think this is the perfect time for change.  Also, this proposal would help other clubs like Partick, Brora and Kelty Hearts.

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Fair enough, i suspect organising a major change to the scottish game in such a time of uncertainty is madness.

Have Celtic made any comment about this proposal?

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Celtic have been strangely quiet for 3 months on everything!!  But just spoke to my pal there.  I do think this is a good time as planning has a chance to take place at this time.  Chairmen and clubs have breathing space to think.  Good debate though Beardy.  But we cant  (as a country) debate forever.  Decisions need to be made.  It might not suit everyone but change needs to happen.  I believe now is the correct time.  Good chat though mate.

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18 hours ago, Debian said:

A Prem club can also buy their way in for £25k, but can only join the Highland or Lowland league to start with and not League 2, which will now be League 1?

So why does the rest of the top flight start in a different league from Celtic and Rangers if they choose to enter a B team? 

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14 minutes ago, shaggycoo said:

So why does the rest of the top flight start in a different league from Celtic and Rangers if they choose to enter a B team? 

Because no one else matters, but it is an idea to benefit everyone, do keep up........🙄

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What I genuinely don't get is that Rangers have been shit at bringing  through youth for at least the last 20 years despite 'hoovering' up talent (I'm not sure taht is true) but they can't seem to produce players. So why do they get to lead this charge. 

I don't trust Rangers motives and I suspect the prospect of an 'Old firm' Colts derby which could easily have 30,000 @ 15 quid becomes a much bigger driver for this situation.

Actually it's all the home games, the investment of less than 200 Grand for the first season will be delayed many times into Rangers coffers.

Edited by beardy

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You don't trust Rangers.  If we have no trust in other clubs we have nothing.  What are celtic saying ?  The plan seems good for Scottish football but the cynics will always win out.  Typical Scottish Football.  Don't trust anyone no matter how good the idea is.

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