Scotty CTA Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 Gotta agree with Rossy here, Wullie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auchinyell Sox Change Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Gotta agree with Rossy here, Wullie. no bother , we'll agree to disagree i find it bizarre in reading a lot of these posts how rational folk are getting over engaged with the whole process - going past healthy debate , and inferring anyone voting No is somehow a traitor (see rugby thread) or less of a Scot , or why would they be at Hampden cheering team on etc like yourself am over here with no vote (as opposed to vote no...) am obviously extremely interested in what happens on thursday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auchinyell Sox Change Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Just switched over to French news which is discussing Obama's interjection on Syria/Iraq and IS - and they guy referred to UK as England ! Small thing but gets my goat especially when their next report is about the Indyref !? have you not seen the Obama tv clip where he refers to the english embassy most of the world think of the whole island as england - galling as it is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringo Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 have you not seen the Obama tv clip where he refers to the english embassy most of the world think of the whole island as england - galling as it is Yes, although he did quickly correct himself. Kind of sums it up though as most people think of England as UK (this has happened all my lifetime) but particularly galling when they are then discussing Scottish Ref so the difference should be a bit clearer to them now (although I know it's not intentional). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty CTA Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 no bother , we'll agree to disagree I think Rossy described the situation well. Loudmouths pushing the envelope to basically the point of an open challenge. I can't see any reason to vote No, myself. Would you trade being ruled from Ottawa, Canada to being ruled by Washington D.C. in America? There's no doubt it's a BIG, BIG, deal and emotions are going to run high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auchinyell Sox Change Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 I think Rossy described the situation well. Loudmouths pushing the envelope to basically the point of an open challenge. I can't see any reason to vote No, myself. Would you trade being ruled from Ottawa, Canada to being ruled by Washington D.C. in America? There's no doubt it's a BIG, BIG, deal and emotions are going to run high. not sure how well , or accurate the situation was described appears to be second such instance in as many days am sure there are loudmouths on both sides - depends if you feel the need to get drawn into someones else conversation (especially if wife & kids with you) for what it's worth - if i had a vote i would really struggle re your Canada point ; surely the Quebec analogy is more suited than USA you will also have read how close the polls were and the actual vote itself - am not sure though it had the same damaging effect on it's population that seems to be unfolding by the day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 What are ordinary people doing in the Spectator? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonny Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Heartfelt letters from ordinary people to Scotland http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/9311032/please-scotland-stay-with-us/ FFS, how many times does it have to be explained? WE'RE NOT GOING ANYWHERE.We will continue to live in SCOTLAND that is JOINED to ENGLAND, We will continue to get FREE prescriptions, while you say, 'we can't afford it', We will continue to get FREE Tuition fees, while you say, 'we can't afford it'. Honestly, it's pathetic. Just decide the very things that are morally right to do, read Alan's propoganda telling to you to shut yer pus about what we can and cannae afford. Big Business isnae happy with Indy? Good! The guys that continually pay themselves £1million, sorry, ONE MILLION, pound bonuses after causing the financial crash are suddenly to be listened to? We make OUR decisions. We decide to make a priority of universality, YOU, Alan, want to divide people according to what they do and spend, Thatcherism at its finest. This is about democracy. This should be about local people making decisions and choices for themselves but peculiarly at the UK State level, this is only being questioned for the first time. 'Oh ye cannae do that' The British State, like any other State in history is doing EXACTLY the same thing, except that this State broadcaster has excelled in producing wonderful Nature programmes. Don't be fooled by the wildlife, it's still Darwinian pash in this referendum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty CTA Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 re your Canada point ; surely the Quebec analogy is more suited than USA No, not at all. Scotland would have loved to have Quebec's powers as we bend over backwards for them yet they remain the biggest crybabies on the planet. Nothing we do will ever be enough. They have what they because we gave it to them after they were defeated in war. The fact that they never won any rights themselves is worn as the biggest chip on the shoulder ever seen. Most would love to come to Canada, but they want to leave. The difference is that most of Quebec doesn't know how good they've got it, and that most of Scotland does know how they're being held back. England, like the States, is 10 times the population of Scotland and Canada respectively. Scotland gets roped into whatever nonsense Britain gets itself involved in, but Canada gets to make it's own decisions. America tried to tell us to uphold their embargo on Cuba, but we go there on holiday. America went to Viet Nam, and we gave their drafted teenagers refuge. America tried to tell us that we were going to go to Iraq with them, but we didn't. How anyone could vote against having their own say is beyond me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auchinyell Sox Change Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 No, not at all. Scotland would have loved to have Quebec's powers as we bend over backwards for them yet they remain the biggest crybabies on the planet. Nothing we do will ever be enough. They have what they because we gave it to them after they were defeated in war. The fact that they never won any rights themselves is worn as the biggest chip on the shoulder ever seen. Most would love to come to Canada, but they want to leave. The difference is that most of Quebec doesn't know how good they've got it, and that most of Scotland does know how they're being held back. England, like the States, is 10 times the population of Scotland and Canada respectively. Scotland gets roped into whatever nonsense Britain gets itself involved in, but Canada gets to make it's own decisions. America tried to tell us to uphold their embargo on Cuba, but we go there on holiday. America went to Viet Nam, and we gave their drafted teenagers refuge. America tried to tell us that we were going to go to Iraq with them, but we didn't. How anyone could vote against having their own say is beyond me. the Canada / Quebec - Ottawa scenario is real the Canada / USA - DC one is what if - there has never been any union as such since the countries were formed , unless you allow for british north america , pre revolution which would have been under british rule anyway at that point would also argue that quebec has a stronger cultural difference with Canada , than Scotland does with england don't know where am going with this though..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antidote Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Ordinary people my arse. As if you Cringers somehow want to persuade Scotland that you 'love the country'. The whole No campaign has been the most negative, bullying, patronising, insulting, degrading in the history of world politics. It'll be a disgrace if Uncle Tom's like yourself win out on Thursday. **** off and **** my ****. Took the words right out of my mouth. On your other comment about loud mouthed English people. I'd give Alan 1 trip working offshore listening to the denigration and he'd soon be voting YES. Then again, he may enjoy all that bowing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddardStark Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 I seriously hope a lot of the posters on this thread are not out there convincing don't knows and No voters to vote for independence. Its about winning hearts and minds not abusing an individuals democratic choice. 50% of your fellow Scots look like they don't share your vision. You have to accept that and it will be your responsibility to bring them with you should the Yes vote materialize. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bzzzz Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 At what point did it become wrong to care about your own children first? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddardStark Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 No, not at all. Scotland would have loved to have Quebec's powers as we bend over backwards for them yet they remain the biggest crybabies on the planet. Nothing we do will ever be enough. They have what they because we gave it to them after they were defeated in war. The fact that they never won any rights themselves is worn as the biggest chip on the shoulder ever seen. Most would love to come to Canada, but they want to leave. The difference is that most of Quebec doesn't know how good they've got it, and that most of Scotland does know how they're being held back. England, like the States, is 10 times the population of Scotland and Canada respectively. Scotland gets roped into whatever nonsense Britain gets itself involved in, but Canada gets to make it's own decisions. America tried to tell us to uphold their embargo on Cuba, but we go there on holiday. America went to Viet Nam, and we gave their drafted teenagers refuge. America tried to tell us that we were going to go to Iraq with them, but we didn't. How anyone could vote against having their own say is beyond me. Sounds like a good case for Federalism for Scotland. I share this vision. Also SNP want to be a full part of NATO which in my opinion would open them up to a lot of American influence. The Iraq war is a bad example. This is accepted as a terrible decision in hindsight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhumper Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 I seriously hope a lot of the posters on this thread are not out there convincing don't knows and No voters to vote for independence. Its about winning hearts and minds not abusing an individuals democratic choice. 50% of your fellow Scots look like they don't share your vision. You have to accept that and it will be your responsibility to bring them with you should the Yes vote materialize. You serious? Come back when you've a vote m The UK Government/Media are doing all they can to force people to vote No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flora MaDonald Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 You serious? Come back when you've a vote m The UK Government/Media are doing all they can to force people to vote No. A wise word, my old Uncle told me - "never get involved with the deranged" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hessen Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Just switched over to French news which is discussing Obama's interjection on Syria/Iraq and IS - and they guy referred to UK as England ! Small thing but gets my goat especially when their next report is about the Indyref !? The Parisian French are just as cut off and arrogant as their London counterparts. They believe France is special and not everyone is able to run a country like they do. Their continuing use of 'England' to mean UK, is arrogant and lazy. The French Govt refuses to recognise any other language than French, so excludes Breton, Catalan, Provencal, Alsacian, Occitan, Flemish from all French life. Don't go looking to France for any support in our cause! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddardStark Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 A wise word, my old Uncle told me - "never get involved with the deranged" this would be a wise piece of advice if I valued humpers opinion. Thankfully I don't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exile Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Can these people also invite republic of Ireland back to the UK? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brant grebner Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 (edited) Really Ed? Federalism is the forward case to protect your version of Scotland? Let's drop everything that's happened in Scotland since 1999, vote no, go in to stasis, wait for Yorkshire, Surrey and Kent to catch up. The Westminster no bunch are basically the same and will grant absolutely everything required to make this happen. We'll just wait the 10 to 15 years that are required to catch up every region outside of Scotland in terms of mass understanding and then we'll all join together (better) in a federal paradise UK in hopefully 17 to 18 years time. Granted Wales are the closest to even getting federalism and they're only 24-48 months behind Scotland But we're Better Together. Edited September 13, 2014 by brant grebner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddardStark Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 (edited) Really Ed? Federalism is the forward case to protect your version of Scotland? Let's drop everything that's happened in Scotland since 1999, vote no, go in to stasis, wait for Yorkshire, Surrey and Kent to catch up. The Westminster no bunch are basically the same and will grant absolutely everything required to make this happen. We'll just wait the 10 to 15 years that are required to catch up every region outside of Scotland in terms of mass understanding and then we'll all join together (better) in a federal paradise UK in hopefully 17 to 18 years time. Granted Wales are the closest to even getting federalism and they're only 24-48 months behind Scotland But we're Better Together. I have never said I wanted the status quo to remain. Edited September 13, 2014 by EddardStark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thplinth Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Do people actually believe those are real letters? "Once, I also dreamt of an independent Scotland, the master of its own destiny. I voted SNP, cheered Scotland and anyone opposing England. Then I moved to England in the late 1990s, as an ‘economic refugee’. To my discomfort, I found the English (aside from their annoying habit of calling Britain ‘England’) were just like us: worried about their kids’ education; lamenting summer weather; concerned with their own daily challenges; despairing of (and largely unrepresented by) their government. "To my discomfort..." These letters are are all made up bullshit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hessen Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 (edited) "To my discomfort..." hemorrhoids....too much sittin on the fence Edited September 13, 2014 by Hessen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thplinth Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Instead of berrating Alan (for being Alan) People should use this thread to post examples of the anti scottish bigotry that can be found littered around the comments sections of every major english newspaper. I'll kick it off... Comment in the Daily Mail this morning... khswales, Bristol, United Kingdom, 1 hour ago Jim Sillars' remarks are typical of those silly little whingeing Scots who think they are oppressed like some small tribe. Per capita they get more money from Whitehall. Get rid of them. There are other untapped oil reserves around our Union shores. Cut the Scots adrift and the funding for the rest of us goes up.And on Sillars' comment that the NO campaigners are on the side of the Tories, he shows a lack of intelligence - the Tories from a seat perspective would benefit from Scotland voting YES ! It's clear that an independent Scotland would be ruled by a numpty King Alex and numpty Officials ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thplinth Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 Some stay together friends in the Telegraph, you really don't have to look far at all.. clickonme • 15 minutes ago Bring it on....and wait for the Scots plebs to take it out of Salmond s hide when the backlash is unleashed. TheBoggart • 15 minutes ago Go for it, Scotland! Bloody well GO FOR IT. England needs to be shot of you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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