Guest allyc Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Why watch them then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalgety Bay TA Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Yeah, yeah... Everything is hunky dory - Scotland were fantastic on Saturday, and holding Ireland to a draw is a great result - Even if they don't get 2nd place which is all but guaranteed now, Scotland will waltz through a play off, as they have such a great record in 'crunch' do or die type games....... That what you want to hear ? fine..... I don't think anyone is claiming that to be the case but considering where we were under the previous 2 managers, even you must acknowledge that we are in a far better place now? We were poor first half but one sub and a half time team talk brought us back to an acceptable level in the second half. I do think we were happy with a draw towards the end but then that's sensible, IMO, considering Ireland needed the win more than we did. I would rather the game finished with a point for us than three for Ireland. Looking at this campaign and under Strachan in general. We have taken 4 from 6 v Ireland, 2 hard games but thats a good record v a side who neither Poland or Germany have managed to beat yet. We have taken a point away to Poland, a place where Germany lost. Again we hung on in the last 15 mins there, again thats expected when the home side are throwing everything at you. We also had a pretty decent 2nd half away to Germany and probably created more decent chances in that game than any other game this campaign bar Gib at home. Not bad against the World Champions. The fact is we are still very much in with a chance of qualifying, in probably the hardest group, with 4 games to go and at the very least we have a good chance of a play off spot. As for our "great record in crunch/do or die type games", when was the last time we were even played one of those that mattered in recent times? There are areas of improvement, someone who can score goals, maybe a bit more cover at centre back and maybe other options at right back but we are much better than we were and, most importantly, we seem to have a pretty good manager and team spirit on the go at the moment, those two things alone are worth a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 And to add we won a do or die crunch game in this campaign - at home to Ireland. That was earmarked as a must win and we did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banjaxed Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Worry not Scottish fans. The play off is yours (at least). Ireland have only beaten 2 higher ranked teams in the last 15 years, and both of them were home games. Never mind Germany, history and stats says we won't even beat Poland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_B81 Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Worry not Scottish fans. The play off is yours (at least). Ireland have only beaten 2 higher ranked teams in the last 15 years, and both of them were home games. Never mind Germany, history and stats says we won't even beat Poland. Rewrite history just incase we need your help on the last game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMcoolJ Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 2 points dropped for me. Ireland are poor and totally one dimensional under the O'Neill brand. We missed a real chance on Saturday. A bit of belief and we could have won. Too many poor individual performances from us. We tried to cope with their physicality rather than play our own game. I can understand why Strachan started with Forsyth, but it was an error, albeit in hindsight. I don't get Ritchie at all though. Guaranteed to make the 5 yard pass backwards every time, he takes no responsibility, isn’t comfortable on the ball and has nothing creative about him. Thought Naismith and Fletcher were rather average. Admittedly Fletcher didn't have much to work with, and while I love Naismiths passion and work rate, I don't think he's good enough in the no. 10 role. Thought Martin had a fantastic game (again) and I think Mulgrew is brilliant on the deck. Not sure Mulgrew coped that well in the air at times but let's face it, it was pretty much an aerial bombardment so it's hard to criticise him for missing a couple of headers. I also though Brown and Marshall were excellent. Unfortunately, I think Hutton is done. I'd have Whittaker and Robertson as our full backs every day of the week. The positives for me are that 5 years ago we would have lost this game. Strachan will have learned from his selection. This is still very much in our hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bannannan Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 @SMcoolJ good analysis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jagtag Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 You strike me as the kind of person who is never happy and probably loved the Levein years when we were rank So you could really have moan.I[/ Yeah, yeah... Everything is hunky dory - Scotland were fantastic on Saturday, and holding Ireland to a draw is a great result - Even if they don't get 2nd place which is all but guaranteed now, Scotland will waltz through a play off, as they have such a great record in 'crunch' do or die type games....... That what you want to hear ? fine..... No but to run through the players slating them one by one is uncalled for. Many predicted that we would lose in Dublin and we didn't even though we didn't play at our best. I always look for the positives to take from any game instead of dishing out negative criticism. When this group was drawn everyone agreed that it was between Scotland Poland and Ireland to take 2nd place behind Germany. Beat both at home and draw away was pretty much the best everyone could hope for. I would say we are well on course and the whole squad and coaching staff deserve great credit not criticism after one below standard performance along the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 ame="Robbo `81" post="167873" timestamp="1434353222"] No but to run through the players slating them one by one is uncalled for. Many predicted that we would lose in Dublin and we didn't even though we didn't play at our best. I always look for the positives to take from any game instead of dishing out negative criticism. When this group was drawn everyone agreed that it was between Scotland Poland and Ireland to take 2nd place behind Germany. Beat both at home and draw away was pretty much the best everyone could hope for. I would say we are well on course and the whole squad and coaching staff deserve great credit not criticism after one below standard performance along the way. Spot on Jagtag. We were poor but still got a result from a match we fell a goal behind in. That alone takes character. If you look at it this team has that. We were a goal down in Germany and fought back, a goal down in Poland and fought back and likewise here so the character of the team cannot be questioned. We have also scored in every match of the campaign so far - I wonder when the last time that happened at this stage of a campaign? We are still right in the shake-up for qualification and considering by this stage in the last campaign we were only concerned about scrambling together another points to stay in pot four then you see how far we have come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackcountry jock Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Can't Believe some folk still goin on about this ... Ok we all know we were shite Saturday but we still came away with a point we still got a good chance finishing second and an even better chance finishing third so I'm for one am very happy being on Georgia and let's forget about the performance 4/6 point from our 3rd place rivals is a great return Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_B81 Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Can't Believe some folk still goin on about this ... Ok we all know we were shite Saturday but we still came away with a point we still got a good chance finishing second and an even better chance finishing third so I'm for one am very happy being on Georgia and let's forget about the performance 4/6 point from our 3rd place rivals is a great return People are entitled to their opinion. Yes 4/6 is a decent return but the performance wasn't great, something highlighted by the manager, and we need to learn to make sure that we play better in Georgia if we're to win there, which we need even more given we didn't win on Saturday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tartanmartin Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Yeah, yeah... Everything is hunky dory - Scotland were fantastic on Saturday, and holding Ireland to a draw is a great result - Even if they don't get 2nd place which is all but guaranteed now, Scotland will waltz through a play off, as they have such a great record in 'crunch' do or die type games....... That what you want to hear ? fine..... Clearly you're forgetting the recent Qatar match. We sailed through that do or die cup final Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyD Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Didnt think it was as bad as many seemed to.. given the situation. The officials were absolutely shocking! Their goal's offside. McCarthy should have had a red. Nothing given either for Hendrick(?) again slapping people in the face while jumping. Lost count of the number of times they went thru the back of us and didn't get booked. The officiating was absolutely laughable. So at the end of the day, a good point, given that the rules of football didn't seem to apply if you were in a Irish shirt. Focussing on our performance. Anya - Showed his worth here. Didn't do much spectacular by himself, but a neat, intelligent lay off for the goal and nullified the big threat that Coleman had been all thru the first half. His pace makes the opponent think twice about coming forward and that's a very helpful thing. Hopefully WGS will now acknowledge it, he's got to be a started when available imo. Maloney - Absent for the entire first half. But popped up and lucked a goal again. His real contribution is hugely questionable, but as long as he's popping up with lucky goals off other players asses he's going to be in the side. 2nd fluke goal for him this campaign.. long may it continue. Forsyth - Bombscare early on.. but was much better 2nd half. Seemed more confident and was winning things by the end. I think having Anya ahead of him (who worked really hard to get back) helped too. This game will have done him good. He'll come out of it trust his own ability a bit more. Naismith - Another quite one. Got to come under pressure now, especially if Snodgrass is back come September. Adam and Armstrong cant be far behind. Fletcher - Thought he did ok actually. Drew a LOT of fouls, relieved pressure and got us possession in decent positions. Nothing much dropped to him, but Maloney, Naismith and Ritchie weren't really creating anything. Room to improve, for sure. but nothing disastrous. We took 4 points from them and qualification is very much in our own hands. Both the players and WGS will have learnt things from this game, so hopefully we can carry that into the Georgia match and pick up what is a vital 3 points there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattywin Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 A lot of players had fairly poor games by their standards. Marshall had a great game. Whittaker and Robertson should be our full backs. Hutton should be dropped although still in squad. He can't keep getting away with some of that defending. I personally don't think Brown and Morrison are a good partnership. I'd rather see Fletcher come in instead of Morrison. Not that he's done much wrong. Just think Flecther would add more belief and leadership to the team alongside Brown. Anya, Maloney and Naismith need to start and Fletcher up top. I think Adam and Morrison have a role to play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2DarkBlues Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Put it this way, Germany and Poland can't get more points off ROI than we do so I'd say that's a good result for us. I admit it could've been better but I'm happy qualification is still in our hands at this stage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 If we were to dig back to when the draw was made the lion's share of our needed results probably would have been:- V Germany (2 or 3 points - still do-able) V Poland (4 points - still do able) V Ireland (4 points - mission accomplished) V Georgia (6 points - still do able) V Gibraltar (6 points - surely a mission about to be accomplished) So you see they are meeting our requirements so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angus_Young Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 I think it shows how far we have come when we can play THAT badly and still come away with a point. This is against a side who have taken points off the World Champions and the group leaders. I'm baffled that we have so many doom a gloom merchants when you consider a) where we were last campaign and we have taken 4 points from Ireland. Some perspective is clearly needed. The arrogance that is creeping into us again is idiotic IMO. The next round of games are absolutely huge. Ireland have been written off by the their own press but I'm not so sure. I think they will win their next two games without too much problems. If other results go a certain way then it could be all to play for again for the 4 of us. We need to believe in ourselves but also need to accept that this is international football and that it's never easy. Beating Poland at home IS doable. A point at home to Germany IS doable. Winning away in Georgia and Gilbralter IS doable. I know it's an annoying cliche but it really is a case of one game at a time in this group. We CAN do this, but there are 4 of us in this group that can legitimately say the same. lets just see where we are after the next lot of games, before we book our tickets, or ask for the manager to be hung Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gala Tartan Army (Borders) Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Whatever you think of Ireland's tactics, they are hard to beat, as their results against Germany and Poland show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTV Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 My glass is very much half full after that. It was a horrible, tense experience, and a pretty rotten game of fitba, but we have navigated the Ireland fixtures safely and achieved much of what was required. 6 points would have been great, but we are right on track and we are the only team of the four contenders to have played all of their away games against the other three: (1) Poland still have to play away to Scotland and Germany, (2) Ireland away to Poland, (3) Germany away to Scotland and Ireland. Our only away 'test' yet to come is in Tbilisi. No one is suggesting that is easy but it is easier than playing in Warsaw or Dortmund. If we can pick up those three priceless points in Georgia I think we are back into Euro 2008 crunch territory... The two perspectives below from the papers, one Scottish and one Irish, sum it up for me. The abiding sensation is one of relief that, as much fun as they were, these games are out the way. Now Scotland can get back to playing normal football, with national hopes of a return to a major championships after an 18-year absence burning brighter than ever on the back of five competitive matches unbeaten for the first time since 2001. Win in Tbilisi in September, the venue of a horror 2-0 defeat there in October 2007, and Scotland will be in good shape for a play-off place at worst, with free hits to come at Hampden against both Germany and Poland for automatic qualification. Long-suffering Scotland fans have the freedom to dream a little while longer. The bottom line is that we need someone to do for us what Gareth Bale has done for Wales, Kyle Lafferty for Northern Ireland and Shaun Maloney for Scotland. We need something more. So far it has been okay. But okay is not good enough if we are to qualify. Wales score a thrilling victory over Belgium, Iceland perform more heroics to turn over the Czech Republic and the Republic of Ireland? We don't even have the consolation of that old 'players simply aren't there' number anymore. Wales and Iceland are hardly coming down with world-class talent after all. For that matter neither are Scotland but they provided what little constructive football was on show at the Aviva. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 (edited) I can't really understand the 2 points dropped opinion. Sure Ireland are somewhat limited and with a better performance we may have won but we played very poorly for the majority of the match so getting a draw is a point gained in my opinion. So far so good after 6 games Edited June 15, 2015 by ParisInAKilt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auchinyell Sox Change Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Marshall had a good game But did anyone else question his need to tip over the header before the corner leading to the goal Looked to be going over? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_B81 Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Marshall had a good game But did anyone else question his need to tip over the header before the corner leading to the goal Looked to be going over? Key point there, to you and I it's easy to say, with TV pictures, that there was no need for him to tip it over but I'd rather he was safe than misjudge it and it dips below him and in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Marshall had a good game But did anyone else question his need to tip over the header before the corner leading to the goal Looked to be going over? That was my first reaction after watching a reply Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 I can't really understand the 2 points dropped opinion. Sure Ireland are somewhat limited and with a better performance we may have won but we played very poorly for the majority of the match so getting a draw is a point gained in my opinion. Indeed, look at the match stats:- Shots: Ire 11 - Sco 6 On Target: Ire 5 - Sco 1 Corners: Ire 13 - Sco 4 Possession: Ire 52% - Sco 48% Doesn't suggest 2 points dropped to me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_B81 Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 That was my first reaction after watching a reply Easy to say when watching a replay but did you think it was going over in real time? I'd rather my goalkeeper took no chances. Shocking defending at the corner (and the officials not spotting Walters being offside) was to blame for the goal not Marshall tipping a header over the bar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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