WCTA Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 (edited) Absolute embarrassment from my club. My avatar looks spot on today. Nothing new though. They did it in the early 90s. Other clubs have done it also. It’s not exclusive to Saints. Edited January 4, 2020 by WCTA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaid Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 1 hour ago, vanderark14 said: self preservation and looking after their own interests rather than the game as a whole is also part of why scottish football is fucked. Also you should re-phrase that to They've got to look after each others interest as they need each other to thrive If you don't believe that *every* single club puts their own self-interest first and that the wider interests of the game come a very long second then you're deluded. You're own club has consistently shown that they want to retain the status quo and aren't interested in any change that would potentially see them losing out. Somehow though its the two biggest clubs that are at fault and all the others are blameless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCTA Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 1 minute ago, aaid said: If you don't believe that *every* single club puts their own self-interest first and that the wider interests of the game come a very long second then you're deluded. You're own club has consistently shown that they want to retain the status quo and aren't interested in any change that would potentially see them losing out. Somehow though its the two biggest clubs that are at fault and all the others are blameless. I lay the blame for this embarrassment firmly at the door of my own club. Nothing to do with Celtic or Rangers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, aaid said: If you don't believe that *every* single club puts their own self-interest first and that the wider interests of the game come a very long second then you're deluded. You're own club has consistently shown that they want to retain the status quo and aren't interested in any change that would potentially see them losing out. Somehow though its the two biggest clubs that are at fault and all the others are blameless. I'm not deluded, I know why these clubs including my own have their own interests at heart but have you ever asked why? I know what my club do, it doesnt mean I agree with it. I fully expect aberdeens attitude to change now the wimpy house builder has moved on. Edited January 4, 2020 by vanderark14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orraloon Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 1 hour ago, macy37 said: Saints won’t even fill that one stand. The club are capitalising while they can. They might very well need that cash next season when they are playing Arbroath. Arbroath are having a great season and Dick Campbell deserves to win manager of the year (2019), but i don't think they will get promoted this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 5 minutes ago, WCTA said: I lay the blame for this embarrassment firmly at the door of my own club. Nothing to do with Celtic or Rangers. I disagree, st johnstone made the decision of course but the old firm have had the biggest hand in strangling competition from the game.which puts clubs like st johnstone in the position they are in. Each club has a voice but as the game in Scotland moved on celtic and rangers became the dominate voice because they believe their fan base means they should have the loudest voice. The other clubs bought it and we now have a league where nobody other than the OF can win it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaid Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Just now, vanderark14 said: I'm not deluded, I know why these clubs including my own have their own interests at heart but have you ever asked why? I know what my club do, it doesnt mean I agree with it. Because they can't see past the two home games against Rangers and Celtic each season to increase the average attendance or the fact that the miserly amount that the TV deal brings in is predicated almost entirely on four old firm games a season. Like all clubs, they rely on the fact that due to blind loyalty fans will accept anything and will still turn up, buy strips and pay for subscription TV channels. I guess the question is how badly do *you* have to disagree with what they do in order for you to say enough is enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 5 minutes ago, vanderark14 said: I disagree, st johnstone made the decision of course but the old firm have had the biggest hand in strangling competition from the game.which puts clubs like st johnstone in the position they are in. Each club has a voice but as the game in Scotland moved on celtic and rangers became the dominate voice because they believe their fan base means they should have the loudest voice. The other clubs bought it and we now have a league where nobody other than the OF can win it. What should the old firm have done instead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Just now, aaid said: Because they can't see past the two home games against Rangers and Celtic each season to increase the average attendance or the fact that the miserly amount that the TV deal brings in is predicated almost entirely on four old firm games a season. Like all clubs, they rely on the fact that due to blind loyalty fans will accept anything and will still turn up, buy strips and pay for subscription TV channels. I guess the question is how badly do *you* have to disagree with what they do in order for you to say enough is enough. I agree with you on that. Its probably easier for me to say now but I'm already at enough is enough stage, im limited to seeing aberdeen when im at home one or twice a year but I opted against going boxing day because really what is the point? I believe that point will come again soon for a lot of fans. I know your a rangers fan but if you weren't, what would be the point? The entire game in scotland along with media coverage is based on the old firm and the circus it comes with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 1 minute ago, ParisInAKilt said: What should the old firm have done instead? Not much because they dont want any competition despite moaning about the lack of it for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaid Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Just now, vanderark14 said: I agree with you on that. Its probably easier for me to say now but I'm already at enough is enough stage, im limited to seeing aberdeen when im at home one or twice a year but I opted against going boxing day because really what is the point? I believe that point will come again soon for a lot of fans. I know your a rangers fan but if you weren't, what would be the point? The entire game in scotland along with media coverage is based on the old firm and the circus it comes with. FWIW, I haven't given a penny to Rangers in the last 10 years or so. That's pretty easy as I live in England and watch other teams that are local to me. I think the last time I was at a Rangers game at Ibrox was in 2008 when I stayed up after the friendly against Argentina and funnily enough went to see Rangers play Aberdeen. I haven't bought any merchandise for years, I think the last thing I bought was a pair of jogging bottoms in the sale at SportsDirect so they wouldn't have gotten anything from that. Indirectly, I suppose I have a Sky subscription, but Scottish League football is only one reason for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Just now, vanderark14 said: Not much because they dont want any competition despite moaning about the lack of it for years. Aye I see what you’re saying but I don’t think you can blame any club for wanting to be as successful as possible using any means available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Just now, ParisInAKilt said: Aye I see what you’re saying but I don’t think you can blame any club for wanting to be as successful as possible using any means available. You can when that ambition completely destroyed the competition and almost destroyed one its biggest clubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 3 minutes ago, aaid said: FWIW, I haven't given a penny to Rangers in the last 10 years or so. That's pretty easy as I live in England and watch other teams that are local to me. I think the last time I was at a Rangers game at Ibrox was in 2008 when I stayed up after the friendly against Argentina and funnily enough went to see Rangers play Aberdeen. I haven't bought any merchandise for years, I think the last thing I bought was a pair of jogging bottoms in the sale at SportsDirect so they wouldn't have gotten anything from that. Indirectly, I suppose I have a Sky subscription, but Scottish League football is only one reason for that. Fair enough Who do you watch nowadays? I've had countless invited to lower league games but never taken any up. Aldershot and maidenhead are the two teams lads I know will go to. Reading being another but they're not exactly lower league Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDYER63 Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Whilst I firmly believe it is duty of each club and their fans to sort out and deal with the idiots in their support, it is really disappointing to see St Johnstone cave in here. I totally understand and sympathise with the financial aspect , and from the link posted by the OP it would seem the club have tried to generate interest in old firm fixtures by offering the ‘being a friend for a tenner’ deal to their fans. However I think it is fair to say that most people would agree that the travelling support of the respective OF teams consist of a higher than normal number of numbskulls, and that most clubs agree there is a problem with sectarianism. So what do St Johnstone do ? Open their doors to even more of the idiots whilst shunting their own season ticket holders out their seats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, vanderark14 said: You can when that ambition completely destroyed the competition and almost destroyed one its biggest clubs. If the game had any integrity that couldn’t have happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCTA Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 17 minutes ago, aaid said: I haven't bought any merchandise for years, I think the last thing I bought was a pair of jogging bottoms in the sale at SportsDirect so they wouldn't have gotten anything from that. You trampy, chavvy cunt. 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 31 minutes ago, ParisInAKilt said: What should the old firm have done instead? I do have a certain degree of sympathy for the Old Firm when they get blamed for the lack of competition. Changes in football globally over the past 30 years (Bosman, TV money, Champions League etc.) have had more of an impact on the competitiveness of our domestic game than anything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaid Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 (edited) 23 minutes ago, vanderark14 said: Fair enough Who do you watch nowadays? I've had countless invited to lower league games but never taken any up. Aldershot and maidenhead are the two teams lads I know will go to. Reading being another but they're not exactly lower league Had a season ticket at Stamford Bridge for 20 years which I gave up about 3 years ago. I got a bit fed up with that, more so with top flight football and all the messing around of kick off times and the like. I'm glad I don't have to put up with VAR as that would do my nut completely. That also coincided with Maidenhead winning the NLS and getting promoted to the NL and so I decided to focus on that. I'm not some Jocky-come-lately though as I've been watching them for 25 years and seen a load of lows in that time. TBH, I prefer it to watching games in the top flight. The quality of football isn't as good. in fact some times it can be brutal but you see a lot of good contests and the National League is one of those where on any given day, any team can beat any other team. There's a real good feeling around the club right now which hasn't always been the case but you really get the sense that the whole town is turning out and is behind the club. It's a pretty good experience at Maidenhead these days, the ground is a bit ramshackle but depending on how many away fans turn up we get between 1200 and 1700 which can create a good atmosphere because the grounds so tight. Particularly if you're playing an ex-League club who are too big for their boots and beat them, like we did to Wrexham last Saturday. A good thing about the ground is its right in the town centre and next to the train station so easy to get to. I've been to Aldershot loads of times and its always decent there. I know a few Aldershot fans so we always have a good time. I think if I moved back to Scotland, I wouldn't go and watch the SPFL unless someone dragged me along. I'd probably watch someone further down the leagues or possibly a Junior club. As for Reading, Maidenhead have picked up a lot of disillusioned Reading fans over the last few years as they don't like the whole Madjeski experience and view going to watch Maidenhead as close to what watching Reading at Elm Park was like. Edited January 4, 2020 by aaid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 1 minute ago, Toepoke said: I do have a certain degree of sympathy for the Old Firm when they get blamed for the lack of competition. Changes in football globally over the past 30 years (Bosman, TV money, Champions League etc.) have had more of an impact on the competitiveness of our domestic game than anything else. Agreed. Easy to forget it’s not a problem that’s unique to Scottish football either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolling hIlls Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Agree with the bigger amount of nutters in OF away support. Problem is they spend a lot of money which the likes of st johnstone could do with. Doesn't make it right though. But not just an old firm or Scottish problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan cake Posted January 4, 2020 Author Share Posted January 4, 2020 As an away fan I won’t be visiting again, would be more than happy to see them and hertz swap places with the two Dundee clubs at the end of the season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThistleWhistle Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 Its interesting, and a bit dispiriting, to see how much it has changed in my lifetime from my first game watching Aberdeen: 85-94: Ø Only once in 10 years did the old firm finish 1st and 2nd Ø Only once was the gap between 1st and 2nd over 10 points Ø It was 2 points for a win but 44 games so loads closer than what was to come. 95-11 Ø Only once the Old Firm didn’t finish 1st and 2nd Ø Only once was the gap between the diddies and the winner under 10 points. Ø Only 3 times was the gap between 2nd and 3rd under 10 points and was actually over 20 points seven times. Ø Over half these seasons the gap between 1st and nearest diddy was 30+ points. Ø Every season apart from three the gap between 1st and nearest diddy was 20+ points Ø Less games but 3 points for a win 12-17 Ø Gap between 2nd and 3rd was single figure every season apart from 2014 when it was 10. Ø Teams finishing 2-6th don’t have to watch their side play much stronger opponents from the old firm one in five league games. Essentially the SPL is in place so the diddies can be cannon fodder for the old firm so that they in turn can be cannon fodder in Europe. I gave up going SPL games about 10 years ago and wouldn’t even consider returning. Stoke were boring in the EPL too once the novelty wore off as essentially playing for 8th unless the moons and stars align like they did for Leicester – VAR is fucking it up even further and there does seem to be a whiff of WWE about it. In the Championship though over the last 4 seasons the gap between the last play-off spot in 6th and the final relegation spot in 22nd has been under 35 points so it’s a right competitive league. Although Stoke have been absolutely terrible every game means something and teams actually try to win away from home without parking the bus the mad bastards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cove_Sheep Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 6 hours ago, vanderark14 said: self preservation and looking after their own interests rather than the game as a whole is also part of why scottish football is fucked. Also you should re-phrase that to They've got to look after each others interest as they need each other to thrive Doesn't the guy you just replied to 'support' Barcelona rather than a Scottish cub? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farcity Posted January 4, 2020 Share Posted January 4, 2020 5 hours ago, aaid said: If you don't believe that *every* single club puts their own self-interest first and that the wider interests of the game come a very long second then you're deluded. You're own club has consistently shown that they want to retain the status quo and aren't interested in any change that would potentially see them losing out. Somehow though its the two biggest clubs that are at fault and all the others are blameless. Consistently? Apart from the 11-1 vote can you embellish on this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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