andyg83 Posted October 4, 2014 Author Share Posted October 4, 2014 That's exactly how I feel. Post of the year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lamia Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 If I actually believed that people voted No because after looking into both arguments they thought Scotland's interests were best served by the UK and could explain coherently why I would not be so angry. I know that this is not the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giblet Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 the Whole "part of the EC" is complete bollox, does anyone think Germany etc arent independent? We chose to defer our powers to Westminster and let others govern ourselves rather than be responsible for our own Country. This thing about, "I want Scotland to be independent, just no the now" is a way for those that like the trappings of following Scotland on a World Stage at sport but voted against the idea of Scotland as a normal Country to not feel as awkward and indeed guilty as they stand there in their Scotland top, kilt singing that we can still rise now and be a nation again. If you voted for No due to an economic argument, you voted for your own personal interests, an extremely short term future versus our Nation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goozay Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Can we not do both? I am not entirely sure how you convince someone who refuses to listen to be honest-this was my experience of many people who voted No. If you refuse to engage in the biggest political decision you could make I think it is more than reasonable for you to expect to be called the odd name. The result doesn't just lie at the door of the Yes Campaign - we all had the ability to research and then decide based on information from all sources. Many refused to do this and they share much of the blame Feel free to do both - but finger pointing and name calling those that voted No will only hinder our progress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hertsscot Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Feel free to do both - but finger pointing and name calling those that voted No will only hinder our progress. I think Lamia's post highlights the importance of having at least some of MSM on your side or at least not so much against you. People in a democracy have a right not to vote and not to inform themselves but it's very frustrating and I can certianly understand Lamia's anger when people don't seem to want to engage at any level but still vote No because of some sound bite or some newspaper headline or some dodgy vow or simply cos that's the way their family has always voted or because 'If you don't know, vote no.' Totally agree that we've got to build a bridge to those that voted No, reassure some of them, educate some of them, don't demonise (all of ) them no matter how disappointed we are, how angry we are or how gobsmacked we are by some people's naivety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bzzzz Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 I think Lamia's post highlights the importance of having at least some of MSM on your side or at least not so much against you. People in a democracy have a right not to vote and not to inform themselves but it's very frustrating and I can certianly understand Lamia's anger when people don't seem to want to engage at any level but still vote No because of some sound bite or some newspaper headline or some dodgy vow or simply cos that's the way their family has always voted or because 'If you don't know, vote no.' Totally agree that we've got to build a bridge to those that voted No, reassure some of them, educate some of them, don't demonise (all of ) them no matter how disappointed we are, how angry we are or how gobsmacked we are by some people's naivety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slasher Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 So have we just not to talk about it in case we upset someone? Keep politics away from the football? Feck off....politics is life as is football and this has always been the case. As a support we have always been divided, from the anti English brigade, the social underclass to the middle class you might meet in Belarus, Jacksonville and the like who think they are better than the rest of us. The support will find its way over the next few months as it always does with humour and good nature and the football will ultimately take over. In the meantime it's only natural that it's discussed and debated and if that makes some people uncomfortable then.....tough! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robroysboy Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 So have we just not to talk about it in case we upset someone? Keep politics away from the football? Feck off....politics is life as is football and this has always been the case. As a support we have always been divided, from the anti English brigade, the social underclass to the middle class you might meet in Belarus, Jacksonville and the like who think they are better than the rest of us. The support will find its way over the next few months as it always does with humour and good nature and the football will ultimately take over. In the meantime it's only natural that it's discussed and debated and if that makes some people uncomfortable then.....tough! Goodpost Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320lichtie Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Scotland <3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddardStark Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 I was surprised by how little political stuff there was in Germany. I came to the conclusion its over stated in terms of its relevance to the national team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auchinyell Sox Change Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 If I actually believed that people voted No because after looking into both arguments they thought Scotland's interests were best served by the UK and could explain coherently why I would not be so angry. I know that this is not the case. their own interests Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lamia Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 I was surprised by how little political stuff there was in Germany. I came to the conclusion its over stated in terms of its relevance to the national team. People clearly didn't want to discuss it with you then - it was everywhere in Germany Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lamia Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 their own interests Well that would only be the case if they had actually taken the time to find out how it would affect them personally. I don't believe many did Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bzzzz Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 I was surprised by how little political stuff there was in Germany. I came to the conclusion its over stated in terms of its relevance to the national team. Must have been the company you keep as I was amazed by the level of support, open support, there was for Yes. In fact it was more like a case of spot the guy without a Yes badge. It was just about the best away support I've experienced with Scotland, I put that down to the excitement over the referendum. Was amazing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COLT NY Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 the social underclass to the middle class you might meet in Belarus, Jacksonville and the like who think they are better than the rest of us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Laud Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 I was surprised by how little political stuff there was in Germany. I came to the conclusion its over stated in terms of its relevance to the national team. Did you walk about with your eyes closed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lamia Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Must have been the company you keep as I was amazed by the level of support, open support, there was for Yes. In fact it was more like a case of spot the guy without a Yes badge. It was just about the best away support I've experienced with Scotland, I put that down to the excitement over the referendum. Was amazing. Totally agree and loads of German's really interested coming up to speak about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddardStark Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 (edited) Maybe I was mixing with a different crowd ... Just might have been my lucky day that the pubs I frequented the fans wanted to talk about football.I did witness a strange procession with a wee guy with a Yes sign and twenty fans walking behind him. Nobody paid them much attention. Edited October 5, 2014 by EddardStark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bzzzz Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 I think maybe you were in the wrong country. It was fkin everywhere! Didn't come across a single person who said they didn't like it or felt uncomfortable about it, was just brilliant. I think it entirely has it's place at Scotland games, it's our national team and it belongs to US, Scots. I'll welcome it being there, enjoy it and join in, if fowk dinnae like it then just avoid it same as anything else in life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddardStark Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 (edited) I think maybe you were in the wrong country. It was fkin everywhere! Didn't come across a single person who said they didn't like it or felt uncomfortable about it, was just brilliant. I think it entirely has it's place at Scotland games, it's our national team and it belongs to US, Scots. I'll welcome it being there, enjoy it and join in, if fowk dinnae like it then just avoid it same as anything else in life.you are missing the point. It was not a subject of conversation. Edited October 5, 2014 by EddardStark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bzzzz Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 you are missing the point. It was not a subject of conversation. Not surprised. if I was a No voter I'd be too ashamed of myself to talk about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irnbruman Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 What is the point of discussing anything with Eddard? Village idiot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320lichtie Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 (edited) Abdy and their dug had yes stuff on in Germany. I'd say atleast 90 percent of folk. Same in London for Nigeria game. Edited October 5, 2014 by 1320lichtie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddardStark Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 you just stick to Clare Balding Bruman... leave the fitba chat to the big lads. :wink2: ps, you genuinely scare me.. anymore of your abuse and I will put you on ignore. Don't want you getting another banning old chap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goozay Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Must have been the company you keep as I was amazed by the level of support, open support, there was for Yes. In fact it was more like a case of spot the guy without a Yes badge. It was just about the best away support I've experienced with Scotland, I put that down to the excitement over the referendum. Was amazing. Hmmmm. There were plenty of Yes badges and sticker on show in Dortmund. But for every punter wearing a badge there were at least two that weren't and folk were talking about the game, the weather, where they got there carry out from, whether they preferred Marshall or McGregor and they were talking about the upcoming vote. Let's not kid on it was some kind of Yes convention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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