Refugee Crisis - Page 15 - Anything Goes - Other topics not covered elsewhere - Tartan Army Message Board Jump to content

Refugee Crisis


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 907
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

So they can fly out safely from Syria without danger. It can't be that terrible a country then. I tend more to think of countries where people cannot come and go freely as somewhere terrible but evidently these people can fly out. I hope this country is vetting them all thoroughly or else there could be another Abul Hamza or IS sympathist amongst them.

Daily Mail reader IMO.

Pretty disgusting attitude and I say that as somebody who's ancestors moved to Britain at the start of the 1900s to seek a better life.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Daily Mail reader IMO.

Pretty disgusting attitude and I say that as somebody who's ancestors moved to Britain at the start of the 1900s to seek a better life.

One thing that amuses me is that a lot of folk who have these sort of views are migrants themselves, or descended from migrants who arrived here not that long ago. It's OK for them to do it but not OK for these dammed foreigners.

Of course if it wasn't for migration none of us would be here at all - if you go back far enough.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's a real complicated issue and to see people taking a polarising view of good v bad, liberal v racist is pretty depressing but that's political debate these days.

Ultimately the UK is a very good country. One of the best in the world with stability, potential, protection, English language, wealth, deep rooted liberalism of a manner of strains. I can't blame anyone from a poorer nation wanting to come here as it's better than 90% of countries in the world. It's not arrogance. It's not nationalism or chest beating it's just basic facts. For all the flaws it has like any country the good outweighs the bad massively. UK, Germany, Scandinavian countries are the "promised land" over other EU countries.

You have a terrible confusing complicated war going on in Syria. Not started by Tony Blair (boo hiss) but by centuries of Shia v Sunni hatred, a despotic dictatorship, intensified by the growth of a militant fascist brach of islam which has been encouraged by the Wahhbism beliefs of those bastards from the House of Saud. We also have a collapse of border countrols in Libya so there are 2 recognised ways to get into the European Union which can be followed by social media like Facebook with communication using whatsapp too. Again I don't blame people for wanting to get to a better country.

If we were to have open borders then our public services, support networks and health services would cease to work as there would be a huge influx of people not planned for. Budgets are set for x amount of citizens years in advance. Germany have really messed up. Very unGerman. Very saintly. Very stupid. As now there is a rush to get there as they have said 500 000 will be taken in with no real planning. Borders are now being closed. The EU is built on freedom of movement and that is being eroded due to this crisis. The number of flights from Middle Eastern countries to Turkey soared after the German announcement as people saw a way of getting into EU. A massive carrot was dangled.

I think the UK Governments policy of taking people from refugee camps is correct. There are millions of refugees in Turkey, Lebanon and Jordan who need help. Actions from Germany only encourages people traffikers and economic migrants. Ultimately countries are built on selfish needs of the people who live there already. We have a cushy existence in the West compared to developing or under developing countries. For every banner held up at a football game for 5 mins (as people pat themselves on the back) and every politician cringely saying they would house a refugee (still not seen it happen yet) it has to be recognised that mass influxes of people with no support, jobs, housing brings conflict with people already there. Look at the "liberal" bastions of Scandinavia. Denmark has a right wing populist party as it's 2nd largest. Sweden has a right wing populist party making a breakthrough in parliament now. We can never rest on our laurels and think our country is somehow welcoming and better than others.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, do we have more legal rights than these foreigners? Are you OK with that.

Why should it be much easier for us to migrate, in search off a better life, than it is for them?

You seem to confusing immigration with migration. But should a citizen of a country (or a politico-economic union such as the EU) not have more rights in their own country than someone from outside that country?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's a real complicated issue and to see people taking a polarising view of good v bad, liberal v racist is pretty depressing but that's political debate these days.

Ultimately the UK is a very good country. One of the best in the world with stability, potential, protection, English language, wealth, deep rooted liberalism of a manner of strains. I can't blame anyone from a poorer nation wanting to come here as it's better than 90% of countries in the world. It's not arrogance. It's not nationalism or chest beating it's just basic facts. For all the flaws it has like any country the good outweighs the bad massively. UK, Germany, Scandinavian countries are the "promised land" over other EU countries.

You have a terrible confusing complicated war going on in Syria. Not started by Tony Blair (boo hiss) but by centuries of Shia v Sunni hatred, a despotic dictatorship, intensified by the growth of a militant fascist brach of islam which has been encouraged by the Wahhbism beliefs of those bastards from the House of Saud. We also have a collapse of border countrols in Libya so there are 2 recognised ways to get into the European Union which can be followed by social media like Facebook with communication using whatsapp too. Again I don't blame people for wanting to get to a better country.

If we were to have open borders then our public services, support networks and health services would cease to work as there would be a huge influx of people not planned for. Budgets are set for x amount of citizens years in advance. Germany have really messed up. Very unGerman. Very saintly. Very stupid. As now there is a rush to get there as they have said 500 000 will be taken in with no real planning. Borders are now being closed. The EU is built on freedom of movement and that is being eroded due to this crisis. The number of flights from Middle Eastern countries to Turkey soared after the German announcement as people saw a way of getting into EU. A massive carrot was dangled.

I think the UK Governments policy of taking people from refugee camps is correct. There are millions of refugees in Turkey, Lebanon and Jordan who need help. Actions from Germany only encourages people traffikers and economic migrants. Ultimately countries are built on selfish needs of the people who live there already. We have a cushy existence in the West compared to developing or under developing countries. For every banner held up at a football game for 5 mins (as people pat themselves on the back) and every politician cringely saying they would house a refugee (still not seen it happen yet) it has to be recognised that mass influxes of people with no support, jobs, housing brings conflict with people already there. Look at the "liberal" bastions of Scandinavia. Denmark has a right wing populist party as it's 2nd largest. Sweden has a right wing populist party making a breakthrough in parliament now. We can never rest on our laurels and think our country is somehow welcoming and better than others.

Very good post
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You seem to confusing immigration with migration. But should a citizen of a country (or a politico-economic union such as the EU) not have more rights in their own country than someone from outside that country?

I think the suggestion is to not have countries anymore.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

See the plan wasn't for a new leader it's to destablise the region for Israel. As their foreign policy dictates and as we did in Iraq.

"Russia proposed more than three years ago that Syria’s president, Bashar al-Assad, could step down as part of a peace deal, according to a senior negotiator involved in back-channel discussions at the time.

Former Finnish president and Nobel peace prize laureate Martti Ahtisaari said western powers failed to seize on the proposal. Since it was made, in 2012, tens of thousands of people have been killed and millions uprooted, causing the world’s gravest refugee crisis since the second world war.

"

Ahtisaari held talks with envoys from the five permanent members of the UN security council in February 2012. He said that during those discussions, the Russian ambassador, Vitaly Churkin, laid out a three-point plan, which included a proposal for Assad to cede power at some point after peace talks had started between the regime and the opposition.

But he said that the US, Britain and France were so convinced that the Syrian dictator was about to fall, they ignored the proposal."

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/15/west-ignored-russian-offer-in-2012-to-have-syrias-assad-step-aside?CMP=fb_gu

Edited by phart
Link to comment
Share on other sites

So basically the system the world has been based on for centuries.

You should open your mind to new ideas.

These people are not going to destroy your way of life. We should show them some compassion and allow them to share some of the good things that we have. They might even contribute and make it better. The alternative is to build stronger barriers and send them back to their own country to die.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You should open your mind to new ideas.

These people are not going to destroy your way of life. We should show them some compassion and allow them to share some of the good things that we have. They might even contribute and make it better. The alternative is to build stronger barriers and send them back to their own country to die.

Re Compassion

Has anyone seriously looked at sponsoring individuals/ families , or is it all just flag waving and tin rattlimg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You should open your mind to new ideas.

These people are not going to destroy your way of life. We should show them some compassion and allow them to share some of the good things that we have. They might even contribute and make it better. The alternative is to build stronger barriers and send them back to their own country to die.

A significant proportion of them wouldn't die if they were sent back to their own country they are economic migrants not refugees.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...



×
×
  • Create New...