ceudmilefailte Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 1 hour ago, SkyBlueScot said: A big who cares about a player getting huge plaudits and driving his team towards promotion to the EPL? Just Google his name and read the articles about him. The Daily Star (And I am sorry to quote them) have an article today saying that Villa owe their promotion push to him more than to Grealish or Abraham. Although my argument might be completely undermined by quoting the Daily Star! What tell's a story is that the first two are both English and younger than McGinn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chripper Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 4 hours ago, PASTA Mick said: If we only took notice of players that perform well against the top 6 in England we wouldn't be able to put out a team for 5-a-side. Well, we barely have any players playing in the EPL. I'm talking about players playing in that league. 3 hours ago, SkyBlueScot said: A big who cares about a player getting huge plaudits and driving his team towards promotion to the EPL? Just Google his name and read the articles about him. The Daily Star (And I am sorry to quote them) have an article today saying that Villa owe their promotion push to him more than to Grealish or Abraham. Although my argument might be completely undermined by quoting the Daily Star! Yes. Temmu Pukki has scored how many goals in the Championship? 26 goals in 33 matches. In the SPL he scored 7 in 25 and generally looked hopeless. The England Championship is not very good. It's tough to gauge how good a player really is if he's playing in a poor league. Fine, he's pulling trees us this season and generally looking like a superstar and he either gets a move or gets promoted with Villa to the EPL and for the next season he's anonymous. Then what? I say give it a "wait and see", same goes for McBurnie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chripper Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 Rangers with only one eligible Scot in their side, Motherwell with four. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrniaboc Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 17 hours ago, JECK said: McGinn been a superstar by all accounts in that league in his debut season in England. He was also one of many who struggled in Kazakhstan obviously. We just need the right manager to get the best out of him. Would he make the Ni, wales and Roi squads and play? I think the answer is unequivocally yes I totally agree. I really frustrates me when people assess a player's ability based purely on their Scotland performance. Any player in the world can have a poo game when playing for a badly managed team. Just look at Paul Pogba this season! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWMM82 Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 Rangers and Hearts are a great example of what is wrong within the Scottish game regarding the development of homegrown players. Middleton was getting used regularly at the beginning of the season but in recent months has disappeared off the radar.....for who....f**king Grezda!! McCrorie in and out the team despite impressing nearly every time he plays! Hearts have reduced Cochrane and McDonald, who were standouts last year, to a squad-filler and a loanee! Yeah there are consistency issues at that age, but you cannot tell me that the players they have brought in have improved the team. Its just seems like the easy option to drop young players because there isn’t the same pressure to play them as there is the average-at-best journeymen on higher wages! I believe the main issue with the national team, and has been for a long time, is the limited first team opportunities our homegrown players get. It’s the only way they will develop, and the reason we end up scouring the lower leagues in England for any player that has got a Scottish ancestor! Aberdeen - Ferguson, Campbell, McLennan, McKenna Celtic - Tierney, McGregor, Forrest, Christie Motherwell - Hastie, Turnbull, Campbell Examples of players amongst the best players at their clubs, all homegrown and given opportunities to shine and taking it. Gives all those teams identity and makes them far more exciting to watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 Dont killie have some good talent too? Aberdeen also have Bruce Anderson, I think he will break through next season. Scott Wright wont. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazmidd Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 18 hours ago, ceudmilefailte said: Surely they must be better as they are playing ahead of their Scottish counterparts or are football managers like lemmings? I can't work out how the English plan will work. The top teams will still buy the best foreign players they can afford and will be forced into buying the best and most promising English players to make up their squads. Is this good for English football in the long term? Are Man City and the likes going to be told they are only allowed 13 foreigners in their squads if the ruling is increased ? Even championship teams with any ambition? All sounds great but won't happen as far as I can see. Would work in the lower leagues or Scotland? I suppose if the teams agree to it. Will that happen? There is a part to this I agree with and something that would worry me in regards the Old Firm. In this country where they would just simply buy the best scottish players to simply fill up there squads to adhere to the rules. To combat that I would say 7 of the 13 Scottish Homegrown players in a 25 man squad in Scotland must be homegrown by your own club. This then forces every club to produce their own. Every top club in Scotland should be producing 7 players through their academy anyway for their squad without any rules, it is not a high number to ask, but this would enforce it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ONeils4oyarder Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 17 hours ago, Chripper said: Rangers with only one eligible Scot in their side, Motherwell with four. I realise you see yourself as some sort of all-knowing oracle, but you're incorrect here I'm afraid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tartan_McCole Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 On 4/4/2019 at 11:29 AM, Tartan_McCole said: Big man was honking last night. It's frightening how poor his first touch can be, and the less said about his miss from 4 yards out the better. Somehow managed to better his miss from 4 yards with a sitter from 2 yards on Saturday. Jesus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelonehutch Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 14 hours ago, vanderark14 said: Dont killie have some good talent too? Aberdeen also have Bruce Anderson, I think he will break through next season. Scott Wright wont. Can the pars keep Bruce? Please Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWMM82 Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 15 hours ago, vanderark14 said: Dont killie have some good talent too? Aberdeen also have Bruce Anderson, I think he will break through next season. Scott Wright wont. A couple of years ago I would’ve said yes with Kiltie and Frizzell coming through but they have disappeared. Always thought Kiltie was a good talent. Yeah never been impressed by Scott Wright. Ethan Ross not been in and about the first team squad as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhumper Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 57 minutes ago, SWMM82 said: A couple of years ago I would’ve said yes with Kiltie and Frizzell coming through but they have disappeared. Always thought Kiltie was a good talent. Yeah never been impressed by Scott Wright. Ethan Ross not been in and about the first team squad as well? Kiltie has been really unlucky with injuries. Still fairly young, so hoping his loan at Morton does him good and he kicks on. Same with Iain Wilson at QOTS,, He's just unlucky we've a midfield with Mulumbu, Power and Dicker in it and guys like Tishbola struggle to get a start. Greg Taylor is a brilliant talent, played some amount of games for a 21 year old and if it wasn't for Tierney/Robertson/Douglas he'd be a regular in the Scotland squad. Stuart Findlay is IMO, the most consistent Scottish Centre half in the league. Guy keeps getting better and better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyD Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 On 4/6/2019 at 10:27 PM, JECK said: McGinn been a superstar by all accounts in that league in his debut season in England. He was also one of many who struggled in Kazakhstan obviously. We just need the right manager to get the best out of him. Would he make the Ni, wales and Roi squads and play? I think the answer is unequivocally yes Cracking goal, no question. But he didn't do much else the rest of the match. Mostly a roll it about in midfield performance for him, while those around him did the hard work. Seemed absent in most defensive situations for Villa. Bannan on the other hand was superb. Made the first with a great ball over the top to find George Boyd, and pretty much won the pen with another fantastic ball to Fletcher, so the defender had to bring him down. I think McGinn's main problem is consistency over the 90 minutes. He's obviously very talented, and is capable of the spectacular. But we've seen him make repeated lapses at international level (not just one bad game), and he doesn't take good enough care of the ball at that level. Probably the most dangerous situations in international football are counters, and McGinn tends to give the opposition counters. Until he irons that out, improves his touch and his awareness then I don't think he's an international calibre player. The problem for us is, we've got a lot of 'decent' center mids. Not a lot of true international class players. For me, McTominay is one, Armstrong seems very consistent to me as well, he's often making things happen for us and rarely responsible for calamity at our end. Christie's looked good in his handful of caps, instrumental in the last two nations league games. So hopefully he can continue that and top the midfield triangle for us into the future. But behind that, there's a lot of 'ok' players. The likes of McGregor, McGinn, Bannan, Fleck.. I don't think there's a massive amount between them. You'll get great performances out of them on a good day and fairly anonymous or worse on others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
er yir macaroon Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 5 minutes ago, andyD said: Cracking goal, no question. But he didn't do much else the rest of the match. Mostly a roll it about in midfield performance for him, while those around him did the hard work. Seemed absent in most defensive situations for Villa. Bannan on the other hand was superb. Made the first with a great ball over the top to find George Boyd, and pretty much won the pen with another fantastic ball to Fletcher, so the defender had to bring him down. I think McGinn's main problem is consistency over the 90 minutes. He's obviously very talented, and is capable of the spectacular. But we've seen him make repeated lapses at international level (not just one bad game), and he doesn't take good enough care of the ball at that level. Probably the most dangerous situations in international football are counters, and McGinn tends to give the opposition counters. Until he irons that out, improves his touch and his awareness then I don't think he's an international calibre player. The problem for us is, we've got a lot of 'decent' center mids. Not a lot of true international class players. For me, McTominay is one, Armstrong seems very consistent to me as well, he's often making things happen for us and rarely responsible for calamity at our end. Christie's looked good in his handful of caps, instrumental in the last two nations league games. So hopefully he can continue that and top the midfield triangle for us into the future. But behind that, there's a lot of 'ok' players. The likes of McGregor, McGinn, Bannan, Fleck.. I don't think there's a massive amount between them. You'll get great performances out of them on a good day and fairly anonymous or worse on others. If we follow the example of the other home nations, Billy Gilmour will be a contender for the first 11 within a year. There’s reason to believe he could be a genuine top class player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyD Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 (edited) 29 minutes ago, er yir macaroon said: If we follow the example of the other home nations, Billy Gilmour will be a contender for the first 11 within a year. There’s reason to believe he could be a genuine top class player. While I entirely agree about his potential, but if he's never kicked a ball for the first team of a club, then i don't think we should be putting him in the side. Following the Strachan model of calling him up just to give him a taste of the squad, or maybe to give him 5 minutes against san marino, then fair enough (this is the kind of thing strachan did with a young john mcginn iirc). But competing for the first team with no actual evidence that you can cut it at any level of club football? seems crazy to me. Edited April 8, 2019 by andyD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
er yir macaroon Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 7 minutes ago, andyD said: While I entirely agree about his potential, but if he's never kicked a ball for the first team of a club, then i don't think we should be putting him in the side. Following the Strachan model of calling him up just to give him a taste of the squad, or maybe to give him 5 minutes against san marino, then fair enough (this is the kind of thing strachan did with a young john mcginn iirc). But competing for the first team with no actual evidence that you can cut it at any level of club football? seems crazy to me. Within a year he’ll be in a first team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWMM82 Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 51 minutes ago, er yir macaroon said: If we follow the example of the other home nations, Billy Gilmour will be a contender for the first 11 within a year. There’s reason to believe he could be a genuine top class player. I reckon he will go out on loan next season and it won’t be long till we see him in the full squad. He is already better than some midfielders that have been called up for Scotland in recent times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWMM82 Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 1 hour ago, Squirrelhumper said: Kiltie has been really unlucky with injuries. Still fairly young, so hoping his loan at Morton does him good and he kicks on. Same with Iain Wilson at QOTS,, He's just unlucky we've a midfield with Mulumbu, Power and Dicker in it and guys like Tishbola struggle to get a start. Greg Taylor is a brilliant talent, played some amount of games for a 21 year old and if it wasn't for Tierney/Robertson/Douglas he'd be a regular in the Scotland squad. Stuart Findlay is IMO, the most consistent Scottish Centre half in the league. Guy keeps getting better and better. Yeah I would’ve had Taylor in the last squad.....not going to start ahead of Robertson and Tierney obv, but with the call offs, he would’ve been a much better option than Shinnie. Hindsight n all eh! Liked the look of Wilson at the Toulon tournament and thought he might’ve had more of a sniff this year, but as you say the competition has been strong at Kilmarnock this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWMM82 Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 1 hour ago, andyD said: Cracking goal, no question. But he didn't do much else the rest of the match. Mostly a roll it about in midfield performance for him, while those around him did the hard work. Seemed absent in most defensive situations for Villa. Bannan on the other hand was superb. Made the first with a great ball over the top to find George Boyd, and pretty much won the pen with another fantastic ball to Fletcher, so the defender had to bring him down. I think McGinn's main problem is consistency over the 90 minutes. He's obviously very talented, and is capable of the spectacular. But we've seen him make repeated lapses at international level (not just one bad game), and he doesn't take good enough care of the ball at that level. Probably the most dangerous situations in international football are counters, and McGinn tends to give the opposition counters. Until he irons that out, improves his touch and his awareness then I don't think he's an international calibre player. The problem for us is, we've got a lot of 'decent' center mids. Not a lot of true international class players. For me, McTominay is one, Armstrong seems very consistent to me as well, he's often making things happen for us and rarely responsible for calamity at our end. Christie's looked good in his handful of caps, instrumental in the last two nations league games. So hopefully he can continue that and top the midfield triangle for us into the future. But behind that, there's a lot of 'ok' players. The likes of McGregor, McGinn, Bannan, Fleck.. I don't think there's a massive amount between them. You'll get great performances out of them on a good day and fairly anonymous or worse on others. I would say McGregor is better than “ok”.......not just domestically...... I’ve seen him put in some very good performances in Europe against the likes of Bayern Munich and Zenit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhumper Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 51 minutes ago, SWMM82 said: Yeah I would’ve had Taylor in the last squad.....not going to start ahead of Robertson and Tierney obv, but with the call offs, he would’ve been a much better option than Shinnie. Hindsight n all eh! Liked the look of Wilson at the Toulon tournament and thought he might’ve had more of a sniff this year, but as you say the competition has been strong at Kilmarnock this season. Wilson just signed a new deal in the new year so fingers crossed he pushes on. He is a smart kid, he was stalling over signing a new deal as he's not featured much but Clarke agreed to send him out on loan in January, even though he wanted him in our squad for the rest of the season and Wilson agreed to sign on. Kid is desperate to play so fair play to him. Would be easy to sign a new deal and just take the money sitting on the bench. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chripper Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 10 hours ago, ONeils4oyarder said: I realise you see yourself as some sort of all-knowing oracle, but you're incorrect here I'm afraid. Really? Motherwell: Gillespie, Campbell, Turnbull, Hastie. Rangers: Jack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceudmilefailte Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 On 4/7/2019 at 4:12 PM, SWMM82 said: g the lower leagues in England for any player that has got a Scottish ancestor! Aberdeen - Ferguson, Campbell, McLennan, McKenna Celtic - Tierney, McGregor, Forrest, Christie Motherwell - Hastie, Turnbull, Campbell Examples of players amongst the best players at their clubs, all homegrown and given opportunities to shine and taking it. Gives all those teams identity and makes them far more exciting to watch. You could find one or two more that would be the best at their club's if their current club wasn't Celtic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMcD Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 11 hours ago, Chripper said: Really? Motherwell: Gillespie, Campbell, Turnbull, Hastie. Rangers: Jack. Tait for Motherwell as well as McGregor for Rangers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chripper Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 2 minutes ago, SteveMcD said: Tait for Motherwell as well as McGregor for Rangers. I said eligible. McGregor is retired. Tait's Scottish? I always thought Tait was English for some reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazmidd Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Still another game in Scotlands top league where they can't field a team of Scots between them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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