Big Teams and Wee Teams

[Regenmann]

20 hours ago, Reevesy said:

That's some amount of shite you've posted there, well done.

Saying "Celtic have a bigger attendance but that's only cos they have a bigger stadium" doesn't really back up your point about them being a smaller club very well, does it? 

Celtic have a European cup and are a worldwide brand. Rangers are phoenix club and aren't really that well known by folk outside Britain and the north of Ireland.

They got a song about Joe Garner into the top 60 or something though, so congratulations on that.

As for Celtic Park - Breezeblock Boulevard was obviously built to the cheapest possible specification - complete with view impairing stanchions. 

Fans were rattling about in it likes peas in a drum until this "phoenix club" appeared in the top league. 

Ibrox is easily the best football stadium in Scotland - compare the Leitch-designed and listed Struth Stand to the main stand at CP with its 'swing bin' roof. 

[adamntg]

1 hour ago, Regenmann said:

As for Celtic Park - Breezeblock Boulevard was obviously built to the cheapest possible specification - complete with view impairing stanchions. 

Fans were rattling about in it likes peas in a drum until this "phoenix club" appeared in the top league. 

Ibrox is easily the best football stadium in Scotland - compare the Leitch-designed and listed Struth Stand to the main stand at CP with its 'swing bin' roof. 

I prefer Tynecastle, then Celtic Park. 

[Reevesy]

1 hour ago, Regenmann said:

As for Celtic Park - Breezeblock Boulevard was obviously built to the cheapest possible specification - complete with view impairing stanchions. 

Fans were rattling about in it likes peas in a drum until this "phoenix club" appeared in the top league. 

Ibrox is easily the best football stadium in Scotland - compare the Leitch-designed and listed Struth Stand to the main stand at CP with its 'swing bin' roof. 

Ibrox was the best but is now a run down shitehole, and that's a view shared by many Rangers fans.

Celtic Park is far superior now, inside and out. The Struth stand (named after a hun that none of you cared about until recent years) looks like an office building from the 70s.

Anyway, I thought we were comparing clubs, not stadiums.

[Squirrelhumper]

Saw a photo of the roof of ibrox from Saturday. It looks in serious need of TLC.  

[Redz]

3 hours ago, deecie said:

Yes.

He was doing quite well too.

Sad really.

[Fairbairn]

2 hours ago, Reevesy said:

Ibrox was the best but is now a run down shitehole, and that's a view shared by many Rangers fans.

Celtic Park is far superior now, inside and out. The Struth stand (named after a hun that none of you cared about until recent years) looks like an office building from the 70s.

Anyway, I thought we were comparing clubs, not stadiums.

I think you mean the Sandy Jardine stand (old Govan). The Bill Struth Stand is the old Main Stand with the listed front. 

[Toepoke]

4 hours ago, Reevesy said:

The Struth stand (named after a hun that none of you cared about until recent years) 

Bizarre statement.

 

[adamntg]

Phew, glad to see we've resorted to Old Firm willy comparisons - it gets so dull talking about Ayr and Dumbarton all the time. 

(Dumbarton lost the right the right to be considered a viable proper club when they built that ludicrous little stand - likewise East Fife.  Just as a new stadium can inspire and revitalise a club, so a daft little ground can strangle one.  See also St Mirren.)

[Reevesy]

7 hours ago, Toepoke said:

Bizarre statement.

 

Nothing bizarre about it at all. They only named it after him a few years after we opened the Jock Stein stand.

As always, mirroring anything Celtic do, but just not as well as us.

Most huns wouldn't have known who he was before then ffs.

[Orraloon]

43 minutes ago, adamntg said:

Phew, glad to see we've resorted to Old Firm willy comparisons - it gets so dull talking about Ayr and Dumbarton all the time. 

(Dumbarton lost the right the right to be considered a viable proper club when they built that ludicrous little stand - likewise East Fife.  Just as a new stadium can inspire and revitalise a club, so a daft little ground can strangle one.  See also St Mirren.)

Why did the Arabs only build half a stand? Were they in two minds whether they wanted to be a "proper club" or not? 

[Marky]

1 hour ago, adamntg said:

Phew, glad to see we've resorted to Old Firm willy comparisons - it gets so dull talking about Ayr and Dumbarton all the time. 

(Dumbarton lost the right the right to be considered a viable proper club when they built that ludicrous little stand - likewise East Fife.  Just as a new stadium can inspire and revitalise a club, so a daft little ground can strangle one.  See also St Mirren.)

Not even close sonny. 

[Mazziessc]

1 hour ago, adamntg said:

Phew, glad to see we've resorted to Old Firm willy comparisons - it gets so dull talking about Ayr and Dumbarton all the time. 

(Dumbarton lost the right the right to be considered a viable proper club when they built that ludicrous little stand - likewise East Fife.  Just as a new stadium can inspire and revitalise a club, so a daft little ground can strangle one.  See also St Mirren.)

Can't disagree, it's awful. However Avg. Attendances are at there highest for a good while 

 

47 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

Why did the Arabs only build half a stand? Were they in two minds whether they wanted to be a "proper club" or not? 

They still got the monstrous advertising boards in the corner between the stands? Advertising a pub  or some nonsense? Eyesore and a half them.

 

4 minutes ago, Marky said:

Not even close sonny. 

For once yer right Marky. Stadiums no bad. I do miss the old five aside park underneath love street tho!

[Marky]

6 minutes ago, Mazziessc said:

Can't disagree, it's awful. However Avg. Attendances are at there highest for a good while 

 

They still got the monstrous advertising boards in the corner between the stands? Advertising a pub  or some nonsense? Eyesore and a half them.

 

For once yer right Marky. Stadiums no bad. I do miss the old five aside park underneath love street tho!

Aye the old Caley stand at Love Street was great. Shame it was wasted on away fans!!

[adamntg]

1 hour ago, Orraloon said:

Why did the Arabs only build half a stand? Were they in two minds whether they wanted to be a "proper club" or not? 

Are you talking about Britain's first cantilever stand built in 1962?  At the time they were only just promoted and had spent the first 50 years in division two, so probably.  However, it was seen as innovative and a sign of their ambition at the time.  

Why did the Jags demolish one end of the ground and build a junior style grass slope?

[adamntg]

8 minutes ago, Marky said:

Aye the old Caley stand at Love Street was great. Shame it was wasted on away fans!!

I thought Love Street was a brilliant ground, great atmosphere.   The new one is pretty soulless and also pretty small.  Is it 6,000 or bigger than that?

Why are so many of the new stadia just four (or one, two or three shoeboxes) pointing on the pitch?  Hearts built good looking stands, and actually I think the Fair Play and Eddie Thompson Stands at Tannadice are not bad.  (I'd convert the Shed back to safe standing though)

[Marky]

22 minutes ago, adamntg said:

I thought Love Street was a brilliant ground, great atmosphere.   The new one is pretty soulless and also pretty small.  Is it 6,000 or bigger than that?

Why are so many of the new stadia just four (or one, two or three shoeboxes) pointing on the pitch?  Hearts built good looking stands, and actually I think the Fair Play and Eddie Thompson Stands at Tannadice are not bad.  (I'd convert the Shed back to safe standing though)

St. Mirren Park holds 8100. Whether we like it or not that's plenty for us now. 

As for what the stadium looks like, I think it looks pretty good in comparison to the some of the other recent efforts. At least it's got 4 matching sides. I'd say only Almondvale is better. I also think it's better and more functional than some of the dubious "improvements" to old grounds. I do agree though that in that category Tynecastle is the best by a mile.

As for it being soulless. Fans make a ground soulless not the bricks and mortar. If St. Mirren Park has been soulless it's because we've largely been $hite since we've been in there. I have it in good authority that it has been anything but soulless for the last few months. 

My original  was at your suggestion that the building of our new stadium had "strangled" us. On the contrary, if it wasn't for the new stadium, we probably wouldn't even exist now. 

Oh and if you want soulless. 3500 fans rattling around in Rugby Park. Now that's soulless. 

Edited May 4, 2017 by Marky

[Squirrelhumper]

15 minutes ago, Marky said:

St. Mirren Park holds 8100. Whether we like it or not that's plenty for us now. 

As for what the stadium looks like, I think it looks pretty good in comparison to the some of the other recent efforts. At least it's got 4 matching sides. I'd say only Almondvale is better. I also think it's better and more functional than some of the dubious "improvements" to old grounds. I do agree though that in that category Tynecastle is the best by a mile.

As for it being soulless. Fans make a ground soulless not the bricks and mortar. If St. Mirren Park has been soulless it's because we've largely been $hite since we've been in there. I have it in good authority that it has been anything but soulless for the last few months. 

My original  was at your suggestion that the building of our new stadium had "strangled" us. On the contrary, if it wasn't for the new stadium, we probably wouldn't even exist now. 

Oh and if you want soulless. 3500 fans rattling around in Rugby Park. Now that's soulless. 

RP can still create an atmosphere with a small number of fans in it though, when 25% full. St Mirren Park just seems to lose any atmosphere it creates IMO and I've been in it when it's full!

Give me RP over NDP, Caley, Firhill, Dingwall etc any day.

[Marky]

23 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

RP can still create an atmosphere with a small number of fans in it though, when 25% full. St Mirren Park just seems to lose any atmosphere it creates IMO and I've been in it when it's full!

Give me RP over NDP, Caley, Firhill, Dingwall etc any day.

 25% of Rugby Park is 4500. You must enjoy that good atmosphere 3 times a season when the old firm come to town. Oh and regardless.....naw it doesnae. 

No even going to comment on some of the middens you've suggested are better than SMP. 

 

 

 

Aw ah cannae help masel at one in particular....NDP 

Edited May 4, 2017 by Marky

[PapofGlencoe]

Love Street was a great stand for away supporters.  Not been to the new ground but definitely agree the stadium can change the atmosphere of the clubs.

Can't believe Ayr and Dumbarton are still being discussed haha.  Ayr are not doing well and still get more coming to their games than Dumbarton.  End of.  Dumbarton are a big team in the next level down.

 

The intrigue and banter of Scottish football sets it apart from other leagues.  Can have a discussion on quality but there's a lot there to keep things interesting.  The last few years have been great - attendances are up.  Play offs have been a great success.  Would have been good if the old stadiums were still mostly on show but that's progress.

Nothing quaint about the lower leagues.  Plenty passion there.

[Marky]

29 minutes ago, PapofGlencoe said:

Love Street was a great stand for away supporters.  Not been to the new ground but definitely agree the stadium can change the atmosphere of the clubs.

Can't believe Ayr and Dumbarton are still being discussed haha.  Ayr are not doing well and still get more coming to their games than Dumbarton.  End of.  Dumbarton are a big team in the next level down.

 

The intrigue and banter of Scottish football sets it apart from other leagues.  Can have a discussion on quality but there's a lot there to keep things interesting.  The last few years have been great - attendances are up.  Play offs have been a great success.  Would have been good if the old stadiums were still mostly on show but that's progress.

Nothing quaint about the lower leagues.  Plenty passion there.

Top post! 

[Toepoke]

4 hours ago, Reevesy said:

Nothing bizarre about it at all. They only named it after him a few years after we opened the Jock Stein stand.

As always, mirroring anything Celtic do, but just not as well as us.

Most huns wouldn't have known who he was before then ffs.

Naming stands after people wasn't exactly de rigueur in Struth or Stein's time. Whoever did it first is immaterial really.

Anyone with a passing knowledge of Scottish football history will be aware of Bill Struth's importance to Rangers.

 

[aljay]

Quote

Club	Winners	Runners-up	Third	Last win
Rangers[note 3]	54	30	18	2010–11
Celtic	48	31	17	2016–17
Aberdeen	4	15	9	1984–85
Heart of Midlothian	4	14	18	1959–60
Hibernian	4	6	13	1951–52
Dumbarton[note 3]	2	0	0	1891–92
Motherwell	1	7	8	1931–32
Kilmarnock	1	4	3	1964–65
Dundee	1	4	1	1961–62
Dundee United	1	0	8	1982–83
Third Lanark	1	0	2	1903–04

 

Seems about right over the piece, although Celtic's recent momentum (both on the pitch and in the financial world) gives them the edge over RFC now.  

But, yeah; Dumbarton in clear 6th and no Ayr United.  As it should be.  I might be tempted to drop Third Lanark from this chart because momentum seems to be against them.  Their last game ever was against Dumbarton too. Makes you think.

As an aside, I've been wondering for a while if it would be possible to compile figures for average Away attendance from a team and how that compares to their average home gate.  Any ideas if that could be done?

[sbcmfc]

3 hours ago, Reevesy said:

Nothing bizarre about it at all. They only named it after him a few years after we opened the Jock Stein stand.

As always, mirroring anything Celtic do, but just not as well as us.

Most huns wouldn't have known who he was before then ffs.

Did Celtic not treat the Lisbon lions pretty poorly for quite a while? Possibly in the pre-fergus years.

(on a tangent, mind the Celtic fans booed fergus raising the league flag at parkhead, effectively because they wished he was more like David Murray. Isn't hindsight wonderful!  )

[sbcmfc]

21 minutes ago, aljay said:

As an aside, I've been wondering for a while if it would be possible to compile figures for average Away attendance from a team and how that compares to their average home gate.  Any ideas if that could be done?

I think announcing the away support is something that's only crept in over the last few seasons. Certainly at fir park.

i don't know if other clubs are the same, but Motherwells home support is a pretty steady 3500-4500 regardless of circumstances, whereas our away support can be anything from 150-2000+ depending on various factors.

[Reevesy]

1 minute ago, sbcmfc said:

Did Celtic not treat the Lisbon lions pretty poorly for quite a while? Possibly in the pre-fergus years.

(on a tangent, mind the Celtic fans booed fergus raising the league flag at parkhead, effectively because they wished he was more like David Murray. Isn't hindsight wonderful!  )

 

1 minute ago, sbcmfc said:

Did Celtic not treat the Lisbon lions pretty poorly for quite a while? Possibly in the pre-fergus years.

 

Not sure but they were always idolised by the fans. Bill Struth became popular because they needed an icon to try and rival Jock Stein though. You wouldn't have seen all these daft yoda type quotes of his about "dignity" all over facebook if it had been around 20 years ago.

1 minute ago, sbcmfc said:

 

(on a tangent, mind the Celtic fans booed fergus raising the league flag at parkhead, effectively because they wished he was more like David Murray. Isn't hindsight wonderful!  )

That's  partly true, but he was booed for more than that. The "Bhoys against Bigotry" campaign for one. Calling rebel songs bigoted was just ignorance, and to some fans it showed how out of touch he was with the support.

Still a good guy in my book though, saved the club and that's all that matters to me