General Election 2024

[Caledonian Craig]

24 minutes ago, vanderark14 said:

I don't think he is useless. He's just not Alex Salmond or as aggressive as some would like him to be. I was impressed with his handling of the Gaza/Israel situation. Despite what crazy twitter trolls with Watp on their profile pic say, he also made sure the Jewish community in Scotland did not feel isolated. 

My slight complaint would be he's not aggressive enough. Stephen Flynn doesn't hold back in Westminster and I'd like Humza to be more like this. 

One thing I'll say is it doesn't matter if he is aggressive or takes the soft approach, the media in the UK will go for him regardless. Surely he has learned this from salmond and sturgeon. They're still attacking sturgeon now. He has nothing to lose because they're coming for him anyway.

 

Nail on the head.

Whoever is SNP leader is fair game for the unionist-biased media. They could have St Peter as leader and anything they could find would be escalated and flung at him from the scummy, one-eyed, sub-servient media, take the knee media.

[scotlad]

2 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Give me your ideas on how to fast track Scotland to independence please?

Holding a referendum regardless of say so from Westminster is pointless as we have seen with the Catalan one.

Holding a defacto referendum was Sturgeon's plan but got no support for it and posters on here were not for it either.

So what is this magic door to Scottish independence?

Even posters on here's love child Salmond only got a referendum purely on Cameron's say so.

My starting point would be to make it clear that a vote for the SNP is a vote for independence, given the option of a plebiscite has been flatly rejected by WM.

Now, at this point in time, unlike a year ago, I think the SNP will struggle to get a majority of seats never mind a majority of votes, but at least it might make it look like we mean business. After the dust has settled, that would be when I would consider softening my stance.

Incidentally I don't remember the de facto referendum plan being unpopular on here or elsewhere. I know I had issue about the parameters - I felt that 50%+ of the vote was too high a bar in a first-past-the-post election, but then it would have given the result more legitimacy in the eyes of the world.

[Caledonian Craig]

1 minute ago, scotlad said:

My starting point would be to make it clear that a vote for the SNP is a vote for independence, given the option of a plebiscite has been flatly rejected by WM.

Now, at this point in time, unlike a year ago, I think the SNP will struggle to get a majority of seats never mind a majority of votes, but at least it might make it look like we mean business. After the dust has settled, that would be when I would consider softening my stance.

Incidentally I don't remember the de facto referendum plan being unpopular on here or elsewhere. I know I had issue about the parameters - I felt that 50%+ of the vote was too high a bar in a first-past-the-post election, but then it would have given the result more legitimacy in the eyes of the world.

Your starting point is all very well but with the shower of shits at Westminster it counts for zilch. I have seen it all before - a strong vote for the SNP and Westminster and media will still insist not everyone that votes SNP backs independence but everyone who votes elsewhere support the union.

And scroll back to posts around that time and the defacto referendum idea was not greeted with warmth from poster here in general and MP's too offered less support for it too forcing Sturgeon to shelve the idea.

Now I know a referendum without Westminster backing would mean Jack in the grand scheme of things but in all honesty what damage can it do? A healthy vote of Yes would turn up the pressure on Westminster. If it has no success try again and again and Westminster would not be able to carry on saying no.

[vanderark14]

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/english-tory-politicians-running-facebook-28449407

 

Arseholes 

[Hertsscot]

40 minutes ago, vanderark14 said:

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/english-tory-politicians-running-facebook-28449407

 

Arseholes 

It's not necessarily related to this but mention of Facebook reminded me that the Tory Government is raising or has just raised the amount of money that can be spent on elections from £20 million to £35 million. That will probably benefit them more than anyone else.

[scotlad]

11 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Your starting point is all very well but with the shower of shits at Westminster it counts for zilch. I have seen it all before - a strong vote for the SNP and Westminster and media will still insist not everyone that votes SNP backs independence but everyone who votes elsewhere support the union.

And scroll back to posts around that time and the defacto referendum idea was not greeted with warmth from poster here in general and MP's too offered less support for it too forcing Sturgeon to shelve the idea.

Now I know a referendum without Westminster backing would mean Jack in the grand scheme of things but in all honesty what damage can it do? A healthy vote of Yes would turn up the pressure on Westminster. If it has no success try again and again and Westminster would not be able to carry on saying no.

Well, you did ask for my ideas, so I provide you with one! 🤷‍♂️ 😄

By making it clear to the electorate that a vote for the SNP is effectively a vote for independence, their opponents cannot credibly use the "not everyone who votes for the SNP supports independence" line. I don't remember the de facto referendum idea being unpopular on here, but fair enough.

I'm not against holding a referendum without WM's say-so but there are pitfalls there too, such as local authorities - most of which, I think, are now unionist or partly unionist controlled - failing to cooperate, meaning the SG would likely struggle to set up polling stations.

Humza seems to be singing the same auld tune that's been sung these past three WM elections but I don't think it will be enough this time. I think a lot of SNP voters from 2019 will stay at home, unenthused by the SNP's tame messaging, like 2017 on steroids. Floating voters, who might otherwise have voted SNP, will move to Labour - because at the very least they'll feel a Labour victory might result in some semblance of change. 

[Ally Bongo]

Even Aaid couldn't disagree with this

https://www.facebook.com/AlexSalmond

[Malcolm]

Scottish  enterprise highlight the key inhibitors to growth in Scotland are the continuing divergence in the tax system from the rest of the UK and the lack of university places for indigenous Scots.  
 

the SNP under Humza don’t get business or care about growth.  They have lost my vote.

[vanderark14]

1 hour ago, Malcolm said:

Scottish  enterprise highlight the key inhibitors to growth in Scotland are the continuing divergence in the tax system from the rest of the UK and the lack of university places for indigenous Scots.  
 

the SNP under Humza don’t get business or care about growth.  They have lost my vote.

They never had your vote you narcissistic twat.

[vanderark14]

The obstacle to growth is being tied to Westminster. People have to be a special type of thick cunt not to realise that.

Westminster, especially this tory government is not interested in the growth of Scotland. 

[Caledonian Craig]

1 hour ago, vanderark14 said:

The obstacle to growth is being tied to Westminster. People have to be a special type of thick cunt not to realise that.

Westminster, especially this tory government is not interested in the growth of Scotland. 

Absolutely.

Westminster are not interested in doing anything that aids Scotland's growth. Put the shackles on, keep them under the thumb and sub-servient that is their raison d'etre. It keeps the don't knows as doubters, the unsures even less sure about independence and keeps lining Westminster's pockets as long as Scotland remain chained and padlocked to this union.

[Malcolm]

2 hours ago, vanderark14 said:

They never had your vote you narcissistic twat.

yes, they did… for almost 8 years.  I suspect that many independence minded moderates like me are now staunchly against the snp and far more likely to vote no.  Time will tell when polling day comes.

I laugh at the disbelief of those far lefties that think people should blindly vote snp/green if they support independence, irrespective of how incompetent and far left they are.

 

[Squirrelhumper]

On 1/19/2024 at 5:24 PM, PapofGlencoe said:

 

The SNP have had their horrors but i'd rather not vote than cross a box for those charlatans. 

This is where i'm currently at. 

[Malcolm]

43 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Absolutely.

Westminster are not interested in doing anything that aids Scotland's growth. Put the shackles on, keep them under the thumb and sub-servient that is their raison d'etre. It keeps the don't knows as doubters, the unsures even less sure about independence and keeps lining Westminster's pockets as long as Scotland remain chained and padlocked to this union.

Of course Westminster are doing that, and the problem is that the snp are giving them all the ammunition through their utter incompetence. 

The snp are not pro business or wealth creation, they are ideologically opposed to the concept of winners and losers and inequality.  The reality is you need inequality to drive the wealth creators, which in turn makes the pie bigger for everyone, including the ability to pay for the socially disadvantaged. What the snp are doing is ever decreasing circles - tax the wealthy, discourage growth, leading to lower tax receipts, leading to higher tax… and so on.  We need to do the opposite.

 

[vanderark14]

14 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

Of course Westminster are doing that, and the problem is that the snp are giving them all the ammunition through their utter incompetence. 

The snp are not pro business or wealth creation, they are ideologically opposed to the concept of winners and losers and inequality.  The reality is you need inequality to drive the wealth creators, which in turn makes the pie bigger for everyone, including the ability to pay for the socially disadvantaged. What the snp are doing is ever decreasing circles - tax the wealthy, discourage growth, leading to lower tax receipts, leading to higher tax… and so on.  We need to do the opposite.

 

More nonsense

If you want to know what holds Scotland back - ITS YOU and voters like you because you are selfish

[Malcolm]

12 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

Even Aaid couldn't disagree with this

https://www.facebook.com/AlexSalmond

100% agree with Alex Salmond.  Humza has ruined 25 years of work in less than 12 months. To be fair to him, it started going badly downhill when the Greens got involved.  Shambles.

Humza is leagues below a politician like Alex.

 

[Alibi]

4 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

100% agree with Alex Salmond.  Humza has ruined 25 years of work in less than 12 months. To be fair to him, it started going badly downhill when the Greens got involved.  Shambles.

Humza is leagues below a politician like Alex.

 

Can't really argue with that.  I wonder where we'd be now if Salmond hadn't resigned in 2014.  Probably not up shit creek without a paddle, which is where we seem to be, with nobody actually pushing forward with a route to indy.  Yousaf is so low grade that he would be rejected at a recycling plant.  He's a managerial type, nothing more.

BTW regarding the story about the house of lords, we want out of the union, not to be complicit in keeping it running.  If any SNP politician were to accept a lordship, it would send a strong signal that they weren't interested in getting independence, and it would probably knock a few points off the SNP vote.  Nothing says establishment like ermine and pissed breeks.

[Malcolm]

5 minutes ago, vanderark14 said:

More nonsense

If you want to know what holds Scotland back - ITS YOU and voters like you because you are selfish

not selfish in the slightest.  Very generous actually.  Fundamentally disagree with your politics though - I believe in capitalism but with a safety net for those in need.  We should be doing everything we can to encourage risk takers and entrepreneurs to make the most amount of money they can and that means competing for that talent globally.

[TDYER63]

18 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

not selfish in the slightest.  Very generous actually.  Fundamentally disagree with your politics though - I believe in capitalism but with a safety net for those in need.  We should be doing everything we can to encourage risk takers and entrepreneurs to make the most amount of money they can and that means competing for that talent globally.

You criticise others for having pie in the sky ideals yet you are guilty of the very same thing. Capitalism with a safety net ? Can you tell me where i can purchase some of those magic beans ? From the Oxfordymoron Farmers market perhaps? 

You have bought into the trickle down economy bullshit like so many others as it helps  you sleep at night . And no, I am not a socialist , just. a realist.

[Malcolm]

9 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

You criticise others for having pie in the sky ideals yet you are guilty of the very same thing. Capitalism with a safety net ? Can you tell me where i can purchase some of those magic beans ? From the Oxfordymoron Farmers market perhaps? 

You have bought into the trickle down economy bullshit like so many others as it helps  you sleep at night . And no, I am not a socialist , just. a realist.

not pretending that I can solve societies problems, but from an economic perspective, yes, I believe in supply side economics, the Laffer curve, etc.  you tax people too much and they won’t bother working or will adjust their economic output accordingly.  When the time comes for me to move on to my next role, I am considering going very part time as the recent snp tax increases are the straw that breaks the camels back for me.  I am in my early 50s which should be way too early to remove my labour from the workplace.

 

[vanderark14]

1 hour ago, Malcolm said:

not selfish in the slightest.  Very generous actually.  Fundamentally disagree with your politics though - I believe in capitalism but with a safety net for those in need.  We should be doing everything we can to encourage risk takers and entrepreneurs to make the most amount of money they can and that means competing for that talent globally.

 How can you possibly disagree with my politics when you have no idea what my politics is? 

 

[TDYER63]

38 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

not pretending that I can solve societies problems, but from an economic perspective, yes, I believe in supply side economics, the Laffer curve, etc.  you tax people too much and they won’t bother working or will adjust their economic output accordingly.  When the time comes for me to move on to my next role, I am considering going very part time as the recent snp tax increases are the straw that breaks the camels back for me.  I am in my early 50s which should be way too early to remove my labour from the workplace.

 

Phart has already rubbished your ‘high tax ‘ hyperbole. Earning £ 75k for example you pay £2100 a year more. On £150k you pay £3800 more. That is without paying any of your salary into a tax efficient product like pension or ISA which will reduce the tax you pay.
If you are wealthy enough to live on a part time salary because you don’t want to pay a couple of grand more then you are either not struggling in any way or you are just greedy . However I am sure another person in more need will be grateful to fill the economic output hole your part time position creates . 

We have various things in Scotland that people in other parts of the UK do not get which I dont need to list again .
Plus Its fundamentally cheaper to live in Scotland. House prices . Take Glasgow and Manchester for instance. 2 similar cities. 
A 4 bedroom house on average is £80k cheaper than Manchester. On a mortgage of say 5% , how much interest is someone going to pay back a year ? 
 

 

And they dont earn any more down there either to cover this. 

You want it both ways. You want somewhere cheap to  live with extra add ons but dont want to help pay anything for it. That is selfish .

Oh. And while I am here lets throw this in.

[Dave78]

2 hours ago, TDYER63 said:

You have bought into the trickle down economy bullshit like so many others as it helps  you sleep at night . And no, I am not a socialist , just. a realist.

The phrase 'trickle down economics' is exactly what came to mind when reading Malcolm's pish.

 

Malcolm, simply cutting taxes to the wealthy doesn't stimulate economic growth as much as you think it does. Most of the wealthy hoard that money than reinvest it.

You only need to look at the Truss/Kwarteng budget to see the result of cutting taxes and magically thinking that will be enough for the economy to grow. The bond market didn't buy it, which caused the currency to be devalued, and the UK pension market had to be saved by a £60bn Bank of England intervention.

 

 

 

[PapofGlencoe]

If the Times article is true about Ian Blackford it confirms a few things for me I feel I already knew.

He should be suspended from the party.  SNP are the party of Scottish independence, to suggest joining the unelected House of Lords is an utter disgrace.  It's an opinion that goes to the heart of their raison d'etre.

Just when I thought the pendulum had swung for me to hold my nose and vote SNP, i'm unsure again.

[Malcolm]

2 hours ago, TDYER63 said:

Phart has already rubbished your ‘high tax ‘ hyperbole. Earning £ 75k for example you pay £2100 a year more. On £150k you pay £3800 more. That is without paying any of your salary into a tax efficient product like pension or ISA which will reduce the tax you pay.
If you are wealthy enough to live on a part time salary because you don’t want to pay a couple of grand more then you are either not struggling in any way or you are just greedy . However I am sure another person in more need will be grateful to fill the economic output hole your part time position creates . 

We have various things in Scotland that people in other parts of the UK do not get which I dont need to list again .
Plus Its fundamentally cheaper to live in Scotland. House prices . Take Glasgow and Manchester for instance. 2 similar cities. 
A 4 bedroom house on average is £80k cheaper than Manchester. On a mortgage of say 5% , how much interest is someone going to pay back a year ? 
 

 

And they dont earn any more down there either to cover this. 

You want it both ways. You want somewhere cheap to  live with extra add ons but dont want to help pay anything for it. That is selfish .

Oh. And while I am here lets throw this in.

 

it is absolutely not cheap to live in Edinburgh and my job or proportion of it would almost certainly be replaced in London or surrounding area so the tax income will be  lost to Scottish Government.

the argument on property prices is irrelevant.  Most professional jobs nowadays can be done anywhere in the UK if not globally, and we are now at a significant competitive disadvantage to our neighbours.  It’s not for fun that virtually every business consortium in Scotland signed the open letter from scottish enterprise.

whether someone is wealthy in your eyes and should be paying more is also irrelevant it’s about our competitive position and encouraging work.  Call me selfish if you like - I’m not here to make money for the snp for them to then waste it.  I’d rather sit on my arse.  The marginal rate for top earners is almost at 50% which is staggering.

Nobody on this board will convince me that the current tax regime is sensible.  We should be aligned to Uk tax rates or very very close. Follow this path to madness and you will have nobody making money and people living off their investments or benefits.