King Chucky's Big Corrie Do

[SamP]

21 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

I believe it has went from "90 minute bigotry" to something more insidious

Clearly the rise of the SNP has had a lot to do with it

Maybe. probably both.   I was never brought like that.  When I see older men all dressed with Rangers top or a Celtic one with their kids forced to wear the same from birth. It is so sad and imo the reason we cannot get independence.  Grown men walking about with these tops on.  What hope have the wee kids got.

[SamP]

8 minutes ago, aaid said:

Somewhere in the last couple of decades the club went from being described as “the Scottish Establishment club” to being the “quintessentially British club”, no idea exactly when or why but I suspect it was a cynical move to appeal to the lowest of the low. 

I know plenty of Rangers fans that support the Independence, I also know plenty who are Unionists, they all self-identify as  Scots.  I also know a small number who are Unionists that self-identify as British but generally they don’t have two brain cells to rub together.

Agree 100%

[Ally Bongo]

15 minutes ago, aaid said:

Somewhere in the last couple of decades the club went from being described as “the Scottish Establishment club” to being the “quintessentially British club”, no idea exactly when or why but I suspect it was a cynical move to appeal to the lowest of the low. 

I know plenty of Rangers fans that support the Independence, I also know plenty who are Unionists, they all self-identify as  Scots.  I also know a small number who are Unionists that self-identify as British but generally they don’t have two brain cells to rub together.

There are definitely organ grinders operating behind the scenes

In the 80s The National Front used to sell stuff outside Ibrox but the vast majority of Rangers fans ignored them

It would seem that the Conservative & Unionist party have taken over that roll

[Squirrelhumper]

1 hour ago, Ally Bongo said:

Apart from the decades up until the late 80s when the majority of the Scotland Support were also Rangers fans

Still are plenty of them in the Scotland support. Thankfully the ones that can't be arsed with the circus that comes with Rangers (and Celtic to an extent) these days. 

I'm well aware of the close links historically with the SFA and Rangers. You only need to look at some of the caps dished out in the 60s/70s to see that.

[Squirrelhumper]

25 minutes ago, aaid said:

Somewhere in the last couple of decades the club went from being described as “the Scottish Establishment club” to being the “quintessentially British club”, no idea exactly when or why but I suspect it was a cynical move to appeal to the lowest of the low. 

I know plenty of Rangers fans that support the Independence, I also know plenty who are Unionists, they all self-identify as  Scots.  I also know a small number who are Unionists that self-identify as British but generally they don’t have two brain cells to rub together.

They started signing catholics so had to appeal to these folk somehow. 

[Big Ramy 1314]

27 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

They started signing catholics so had to appeal to these folk somehow. 

Graeme Souness era...

[SamP]

The board of Celtic wouldn't let Jock Stein on the board.  They offered him a position in Celtic Pools.  Only because he was a protestant.  These are facts and an indication of the club that never stops. The greatest manager Celtic ever had and religion bias stopped it.  One of my heroes in football and got treated disgracefully.  But the simple won't understand that.

[aaid]

1 hour ago, Squirrelhumper said:

They started signing catholics so had to appeal to these folk somehow. 

Probably more to do with them stopping to dominate on the pitch in the early to mid 2000s

[Freeedom]

The met have always been institutionally racist, sexist, homophobic, authoritarian etc. They're not here to protect people, they are here to keep us all in our place and protect the interests of capital and the establishment. The lower your rung is in society the worse you are likely to have been treated by them. It's only in the last decade or so that some of the white middle class (myself included) have come to realise exactly how they operate.

As people have gotten more angry, the government has become more authoritarian and fascist to clamp down on any kind of dissent and as a consequence we've seen clubs like Rangers and their supporters follow suit.

 

[AlfieMoon]

14 hours ago, aaid said:

Maybe this will make them change their minds.  The Met Police are an absolute joke.

https://news.sky.com/story/metropolitan-police-regrets-arrest-of-anti-monarch-group-leader-and-five-others-before-coronation-12876663

I think they’ll be quite happy to inherit the power of the establishment and do as they wish, as the Tories have. 
 

The police action was clearly 100% planned to follow on from the introduction of the bill enabling it.
 

Months of dialogue with protest groups to let them think they would be allowed a reasonable middle ground then unexpectedly pull the rug from under them. The Met were never letting it happen and knew exactly what they were doing and the government enabled it. All for the crown!
 

Then issue a bollocks half-hearted apology after the event acting like they didn’t know what they were doing and made some bad decisions. Lot of pish! 

 

2 hours ago, aaid said:

Somewhere in the last couple of decades the club went from being described as “the Scottish Establishment club” to being the “quintessentially British club”, no idea exactly when or why but I suspect it was a cynical move to appeal to the lowest of the low. 

I know plenty of Rangers fans that support the Independence, I also know plenty who are Unionists, they all self-identify as  Scots.  I also know a small number who are Unionists that self-identify as British but generally they don’t have two brain cells to rub together.

SNP threat to the union and crown certainly gave the Tories an open door to push against with Rangers. Some noisy SNP MSP’s supporting Celtic on Twitter allows things to be amplified, then you just need some Tories like Tomkins to do likewise, supporting the opposite side and we were off and running. Tories certainly tapped into the Ibrox mindset since 2014. 

[AlfieMoon]

Has anyone else on Twitter been bombarded with a lot of pro-royal tweets in the last week?  

I don’t follow anything other than sport stuff and any look at politics, news etc is just in the passing. If my own algorithms had picked up anything I’d looked at in the lead up to the coronation street, I’d have thought it would be feeding me anti-monarchy stuff, but I seem to be getting a ton of stuff that showing the royals in a positive light.  

[aaid]

18 minutes ago, AlfieMoon said:

SNP threat to the union and crown certainly gave the Tories an open door to push against with Rangers. Some noisy SNP MSP’s supporting Celtic on Twitter allows things to be amplified, then you just need some Tories like Tomkins to do likewise, supporting the opposite side and we were off and running. Tories certainly tapped into the Ibrox mindset since 2014. 

I’m not saying that any of the above isn’t true but, I think it actually goes a bit further back to that to around the period when Rangers was sold to Whyte, then got worse under Green.  As far a politicians are concerned, a friend of mine was at school - Inverness Royal Academy, the IRA ironically enough - and he says he wouldn’t have known a football if one hit him on the head.

If anyone can actually trace the first year that Armed Forces day - or before that when they started to go over the top with Remembrance Sunday - became a thing at Ibrox, it’ll be around that time.

Edited May 9, 2023 by aaid

[aaid]

16 minutes ago, AlfieMoon said:

Has anyone else on Twitter been bombarded with a lot of pro-royal tweets in the last week?  

I don’t follow anything other than sport stuff and any look at politics, news etc is just in the passing. If my own algorithms had picked up anything I’d looked at in the lead up to the coronation street, I’d have thought it would be feeding me anti-monarchy stuff, but I seem to be getting a ton of stuff that showing the royals in a positive light.  

Make sure you’ve got it set to “following” not “for you”

[Squirrelhumper]

1 hour ago, SamP said:

The board of Celtic wouldn't let Jock Stein on the board.  They offered him a position in Celtic Pools.  Only because he was a protestant.  These are facts and an indication of the club that never stops. The greatest manager Celtic ever had and religion bias stopped it.  One of my heroes in football and got treated disgracefully.  But the simple won't understand that.

Willie Maley wasn't offered a place on the board, Jimmy McGrory wasn't offered a place on the board? What were the reasons for them not being appointed?
 

 

[Squirrelhumper]

35 minutes ago, aaid said:

I’m not saying that any of the above isn’t true but, I think it actually goes a bit further back to that to around the period when Rangers was sold to Whyte, then got worse under Green.  As far a politicians are concerned, a friend of mine was at school - Inverness Royal Academy, the IRA ironically enough - and he says he wouldn’t have known a football if one hit him on the head.

If anyone can actually trace the first year that Armed Forces day - or before that when they started to go over the top with Remembrance Sunday - became a thing at Ibrox, it’ll be around that time.

Irvine Royal Academy used to have right staunch lads i knew. 

Everyone called it the IRA just to annoy them, 

[aaid]

10 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said:

Irvine Royal Academy used to have right staunch lads i knew. 

Everyone called it the IRA just to annoy them, 

I remember it was universally called that, a bit like “the Joes” or “the Jimmy” in Kilmarnock.

[PapofGlencoe]

On 5/7/2023 at 11:22 AM, TDYER63 said:

Sandwiches? Please do not tell me they were cucumber washed down with a glass of Pimms ? I hope you washed your mouth out afterwards young man 😁

Joking aside, if folk are fairly ambivalent about the monarchy then a day out is a day out.
Personally I would rather gouge my eyes out with a hot poker, attending a royal affair is akin to attending a Tory fundraiser in my eyes. Not because its only Tories that are royalists, its more the wealth and snobbery that is associated with both factions. 

I mentioned before on here that years ago I went to an Orange lodge, my husband’s boss attended invited us and the place was a stone’s throw from where we lived. I agreed as I thought a night was a night out. Fuck. It was the worst night I have spent in my entire life. Got chucked out at the end for not singing GSTQ which was the highlight of the night . Never again will I attend anything I disagree with just for a day or night out. 

I'm afraid so...

I can't imagine ever going to an Orange Lodge, have no reason to be anywhere like it and can't imagine I ever will.  It seems to be a dying institution but I don't really know.  

I can't say i was in my comfort zone with all the Union Jacks but it would be easy to dismiss all those in attendance as conservative, rangers supporters as it suits a certain pro-independence narrative.  The reality, in my view, was grannies and families just having a quiche and a blether, enjoying the day to come together as a community.  Will there be some feeling particularly pro-British, undoubtedly but not all.  It didn't come up.

I think some unionists believe Scotland is a region and we should abolish the Scottish parliament.  They think Scotland is their Scotland.  Some independence supporters view the nation in their own lens.  Both are fantasy.  The truth is obviously in the middle and we share the nation together.  Play Scotland as it is, not how you'd want it to be.

What does get me is, just use the saltire to keep most happy.  In a country where half the place supports a separate state and the other against, use the saltire as the flag by far the most identify with.  Overt use of the union jack is a provocative act in my opinion, especially from those who've only washed in here 5 mins ago...  

I think people want to get on with their lives, live in their neighbourhood without being constantly accosted with political messages beit Yes or UJs.  Different if it's obvious Scotland wants to be one way or the other. 

I would be very happy for Scotland to remain part of the commonwealth alongside other similar countries.  I don't think an anti-British attitude will win Scotland's independence.  2014 nearly won because it was positive, if it gets negative I foresee it all going a bit south.

[SamP]

1 hour ago, Squirrelhumper said:

Willie Maley wasn't offered a place on the board, Jimmy McGrory wasn't offered a place on the board? What were the reasons for them not being appointed?
 

 

Only going by what I read in books.  Seemingly Hibs never appointed a protestant on to their board either until I think 1951.  Changed days now for the better including Rangers.  But you cannot change the 90 minute bigots fans minds.  I still don't believe that anyway.  An excuse imo.  A bigot is a bigot. Not just for 90 minutes.  On the relevance of this topic though.  I am no royalist.  But if their new King makes them happy then there are worse things going on in the world.

[Squirrelhumper]

1 hour ago, aaid said:

I remember it was universally called that, a bit like “the Joes” or “the Jimmy” in Kilmarnock.

Aye, my mum taught at all 3 of them!

[Squirrelhumper]

16 minutes ago, SamP said:

  But you cannot change the 90 minute bigots fans minds.  I still don't believe that anyway.  

You certainly can't when the club actively tries to appease them. 

[SamP]

16 minutes ago, SamP said:

Only going by what I read in books.  Seemingly Hibs never appointed a protestant on to their board either until I think 1951.  Changed days now for the better including Rangers.  But you cannot change the 90 minute bigots fans minds.  I still don't believe that anyway.  An excuse imo.  A bigot is a bigot. Not just for 90 minutes.  On the relevance of this topic though.  I am no royalist.  But if their new King makes them happy then there are worse things going on in the world.

And not bothered about malley etc or whataboutery.  Jock Stein was/is a hero of mine.  Ask any Celtic supporter, it was a disgrace the way he was treated by that club.

[SamP]

1 minute ago, Squirrelhumper said:

You certainly can't when the club actively tries to appease them. 

Clubs boards do that though.  Souness tried to break that mold but that would never happen.  It must be something when the 90% of Rangers and Celtic players come here now.  I bet they cannot believe it and would want to move on asap.

[phart]

3 hours ago, Freeedom said:

The met have always been institutionally racist, sexist, homophobic, authoritarian etc. They're not here to protect people, they are here to keep us all in our place and protect the interests of capital and the establishment. The lower your rung is in society the worse you are likely to have been treated by them. It's only in the last decade or so that some of the white middle class (myself included) have come to realise exactly how they operate.

As people have gotten more angry, the government has become more authoritarian and fascist to clamp down on any kind of dissent and as a consequence we've seen clubs like Rangers and their supporters follow suit.

 

I read about in the "Untouchables: Dirty cops, bent justice and racism in Scotland Yard"

Pretty interesting seeing how MET and IPCC are a revolving door, plus with Lawrence and other high profile cases.

[Freeedom]

2 hours ago, phart said:

I read about in the "Untouchables: Dirty cops, bent justice and racism in Scotland Yard"

Pretty interesting seeing how MET and IPCC are a revolving door, plus with Lawrence and other high profile cases.

Thanks, I'll check that out

[TDYER63]

On 5/9/2023 at 3:37 PM, PapofGlencoe said:

I'm afraid so...

I can't imagine ever going to an Orange Lodge, have no reason to be anywhere like it and can't imagine I ever will.  It seems to be a dying institution but I don't really know.  

I can't say i was in my comfort zone with all the Union Jacks but it would be easy to dismiss all those in attendance as conservative, rangers supporters as it suits a certain pro-independence narrative.  The reality, in my view, was grannies and families just having a quiche and a blether, enjoying the day to come together as a community.  Will there be some feeling particularly pro-British, undoubtedly but not all.  It didn't come up.

I think some unionists believe Scotland is a region and we should abolish the Scottish parliament.  They think Scotland is their Scotland.  Some independence supporters view the nation in their own lens.  Both are fantasy.  The truth is obviously in the middle and we share the nation together.  Play Scotland as it is, not how you'd want it to be.

What does get me is, just use the saltire to keep most happy.  In a country where half the place supports a separate state and the other against, use the saltire as the flag by far the most identify with.  Overt use of the union jack is a provocative act in my opinion, especially from those who've only washed in here 5 mins ago...  

I think people want to get on with their lives, live in their neighbourhood without being constantly accosted with political messages beit Yes or UJs.  Different if it's obvious Scotland wants to be one way or the other. 

I would be very happy for Scotland to remain part of the commonwealth alongside other similar countries.  I don't think an anti-British attitude will win Scotland's independence.  2014 nearly won because it was positive, if it gets negative I foresee it all going a bit south.

In my defence the orange lodge fiasco was 30 yrs ago ! 
I agree with some of what you say, and there is nothing wrong with pensioners , or anyone else, having a wee tea party but lets not forget what they are celebrating. I am sure these people are aware of the poverty in the UK but still choose to fly a wee flag and turn a blind eye to the cost of this one day. They would be moaning their heads off if the money was spent on some inept government idea . 
Then there was the great Volunteering Day , to try and give this whole circus a worthwhile purpose. The eager beavers happy to clean the streets for HRH then go back to doing fook all. . 
Anti British attitude may not win Scotland independence but I will not put up and shut up for an unelected monarchy I do not agree with.