jock strap Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 I don't rate the Thumb any better. Where the bloody hell are our strikers ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappafan Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 His link up play is better than anyone else we have, and none of our available strikers are going to be prolific goalscorers at international level. We rely on goals from the wings and midfield (plenty of other teams too), the problems were more there yesterday than in the middle i.m.o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byrne2711 Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 [quote name="COLT NY" post="204783" timestamp="1441426009 On Fletcher, I thought he had two chances that he should have put away (one ruled offside anyway). That said, he got those chances in a game where the service was appalling. What did Griffiths do? I'd play Fletcher on Monday, but I'd drop Brown and Morrison because in Fletcher and McArthur we have viable replacements waiting to replace them. Fletcher played 90 minutes where as gritthis only had less than 20. I'm not saying either that he would be our saviour but why not give him a chance. Yea Fletcher creates a couple of goals but he doesn't score them aswell which is what a strike really should be doing. I don't know how people can defend him just caus he creates a few goals and brings players into the game when he cannot finish himself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 I don't rate the Thumb any better. Where the bloody hell are our strikers ??? Never thought I'd feel nostalgic for the days of Kenny Miller running about by himself. We badly need Snodgrass fit again... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
girvanTA Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Fletcher cant get a game for a shocking Sunderland team however he is in the first eleven for Scotland in a must win game. Griffiths, McCormack Watt and Rhodes are far better options than Fletcher. Said it for years Fletcher is an absolute donkey with massive lugs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Fletcher cant get a game for a shocking Sunderland team however he is in the first eleven for Scotland in a must win game. Griffiths, McCormack Watt and Rhodes are far better options than Fletcher. Said it for years Fletcher is an absolute donkey with massive lugs I sense your frustration but lets look at the facts here. Fletcher has been a key element to our side as his link up play creates goals for supporting midfielders. None of those other strikers you mention has that added quality. Also he has been in the EPL for several years now which is a higher level any of those players in your list have. That tells me something as well. Griffiths I just do not see as the answer. I won't complain if he gets a chance V Germany as his form merits it but he just doesn't not strike me with any confidence. He has now six caps and no goals and not even looked like scoring for us. Also why has he not got EPL or foreign clubs sniffing around if he is quality as Celtic fans insist? I really hope I am wrong but I don't see him as any sort of a goalscoring machine at international level. McCormack is an interesting one. He scores plenty but again in an inferior league and lots are penalties. As is the case with Griffiths why is he languishing out of the top flight? I see him more as a Faddy-type as well but kind of feel his better years are behind him. Watt is totally unproven and I'd be very surprised if he is chucked into the team anytime soon. He is worth monitoring but again why is he at Charlton and no EPL clubs knocking on his door. Rhodes is a goalscorer more in the poacher mode. He does not suit the style of football we play as we don't create chances for poacher types to thrive plus he adds nothing else to the team as in link up play and why is he still lingering in the lower leagues if he really is so sh1t hot? Fact of the matter is we are woefully weak upfront in terms of options available and I see no knight in shining armour on the horizon. Depressing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
northernscum Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 I think our best, and probably only, chance of getting a result on Monday would be through a set piece. For that reason alone i think Griffiths would be a better option to start than Fletcher. We need to be far more switched on around gaining dangerous set piece opportunities which Griffiths will give us another alternative to Maloney in. This should also rule Brown out for Fletcher or MacArthur for the opposite reasoning, if he continues in the same vein as last night he is a red card waiting to happen and the fast, intelligent, Germans will exploit this from the start. I think all we can hope for is snatching a set piece goal and then face the Alamo for whatever the rest of the game involves! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoofitharder Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Good post Craig.I think you are not giving the English championship enough credit.it is probably the sixth best league in Europe.I think the crux of it is all the players mentioned are different types and as you have stated elsewhere we only have plan A none of these players would have made much difference last night but might if the formation is changed to suit them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
girvanTA Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Difference is between Fletcher and the other forwards that Iv mebtioned is that the others are goal scorers, match winners and exception of Rhodes, quick players. Watt has lots of pace and is direct, Griffiths can shoot from 25 yards and has no fear. Rhodes is a fantastic finisher. They might be playing in lesser leagues however when has that been a problem? These are good players that constantly get overlooked I know what your saying in regards to our system, however what happens when we need to change our system like last night? Chuck on another defender? Chuck on a winger? We should have buried them in first half, Fletcher AGAIN missing his chance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dandydunn Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Without wanting to scapegoat him in particular,he had another great opportunity in the 1st half last night to score with his right foot,but opted to go with his left which made it a helluva more difficult. I'm sure he did it elsewhere in this campaign. A striker that can't use both feet to score from inside 10 yards shouldn't be playing professional football,never mind international football. Imagine I told my boss that I can't do a job as I can only use my left hand to hold a screwdriver, I would be out the door in a second. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Difference is between Fletcher and the other forwards that Iv mebtioned is that the others are goal scorers, match winners and exception of Rhodes, quick players. Watt has lots of pace and is direct, Griffiths can shoot from 25 yards and has no fear. Rhodes is a fantastic finisher. The others are not proven goalscorers at the highest level though and have no extended experience of top flight football at the highest level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
northernscum Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 The others are not proven goalscorers at the highest level though and have no extended experience of top flight football at the highest level. But surely you must accept that his confidence must be absolutely shot to pieces, that, as a striker, is not good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian Craig Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 But surely you must accept that his confidence must be absolutely shot to pieces, that, as a striker, is not good. I'd agree if he was missing chances left right and centre for us but he isn't as the supply of chances for him aren't there and the way we play we use Fletcher more as a link-up player. He holds the ball up and feeds the likes of Naismith and Maloney making runs from midfield. Take him out of the side and play any of the other strikers in his place then you have to change the whole style of play as our current system would fall apart. Generally, we need a Plan B but for the Germany game our Plan A will be better-suited to getting some sort of a result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ta Ta Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 The others are not proven goalscorers at the highest level though and have no extended experience of top flight football at the highest level. Fletcher scored 3 goals and 5 goals in each of the last 2 seasons. He wasn't hugely prolific before that but would average about 10 goals in England. Whilst his link up play was a redeeming feature before, i don't really see that now. Whether it is form, confidence or injuries catching up on him, he is a shadow of the player he was a couple of years ago. Unfortunately he is a Strachan favourite and seemingly undroppable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munro7 Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 The failure to use his right foot infuriates me but that's a symptom of modern day football for you. The guy's a millionaire despite being unable to use one of the two main tools of his trade. However he's still the best option we've got in terms of our system. Like others have said, he brings supporting players into the game well and I'd add his contribution to our first goal in Poland to the assists already mentioned as evidence of that. I also suspect he'd score plenty in the Championship or for Celtic. Like I said in the match thread I don't like people picking a player they don't like as a scapegoat, we failed miserably as a team last night, not because one player had a mare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bannannan Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Naismith must start as main striker,He's not great but our best.Morrison or Maloney in the hole.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnum Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 And a hat trick against Gibraltar. But some folk will try to tell you it's his fault we lost tonight despite the fact he hardly got a sniff! We never had a shot. Hardly see how the striker can be to blame. For risk of seeming like a stuck record, Steven Fletcher has done it again ! - Make a chance look difficult, by going for it with his left foot and making a mess of it, when it was a simple chance on his right. He did exactly the same away to Germany and home to Ireland. The chance from that great ball from Robertson was right on the plate for any half decent striker, and we would and should have been one up, and a totally different game then ! The way he slid actually looked, to me, if he did not believe he was going to get it, and was making a token effort (which kind of describes his general goalscoring ability - or lack of). Until such time as we have a quality striker, we are going to struggle to win these sort of games. I'm not saying Griffiths is a great player, personally I think he's a neep, but I bet he would have scored there, or at least got a connection on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broraboy Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Have thought this for some time now & as the initial post, he is extremely poor IMO Scored against Gibraltar, oh wow ?! Has nice touches and in fairness does link up well But let's answer the question, he doesn't put the ball in the net - the very job he's employed to do !! Is he rank rotten as mentioned? well he's doing a good job of it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dillinger Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Have thought this for some time now & as the initial post, he is extremely poor IMO Scored against Gibraltar, oh wow ?! Has nice touches and in fairness does link up well But let's answer the question, he doesn't put the ball in the net - the very job he's employed to do !! Is he rank rotten as mentioned? well he's doing a good job of it ? So what you're saying is that other than score goals, assist, hold up play and link, he's no done anything this campaign? Right you are! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunchy Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 I think the one of the problems on Friday is we tried to play the same system with the same players no matter if they are match fit or not. IMO we should have changed from our normal 451 to more of a 4411 with Fletch in the hole and a goal scorer as the main striker. Fletches link up play would have been far better used to open up there defence and make room for the goal scorer. I will never question naisys commitment but he just didn't seem the same on Fri so dropping him and using Fletch in more of a number 10 role with some one like Rhodes or griffiths would have been far better I think. Also for those that moan about Rhodes lack of pace just remember our Kenny dalglish was never the quickest but look how many goals he got Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Apart from not being able to use his right foot my biggest problem with Fletcher is he's lazy. Not ideal when you're struggling away from home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnum Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 So what you're saying is that other than score goals, assist, hold up play and link, he's no done anything this campaign? Right you are! I just don't understand why anybody could possibly belief he justifies a place !! Apart from 3 goals against the mighty power of Gibraltar, he has scored 1 other goal in the other 21 Internationals. I don't believe there is any other country in the World that would not have dropped a 'striker' with that rate of goal return, by now. In fact, calling him a striker is a real contradiction. Look at Robbie Keane for Ireland. I believe it's something like 67 goals in 140 odd Internationals. Just under 1 every second game. Now, he can be called a striker, but, sadly Fletcher can't, and I think most Sunderland Supporters would also agree with that. Please don't spew out all this justification about his 'link up play', as several others could do just as good a job of that, as he does. By definition, a striker is there to score goals. He's, lazy, appears arrogant, only has one foot, and has had more than enough chances. We really have to try someone else in that role - they couldn't possibly be any worse ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulS2014 Posted September 7, 2015 Author Share Posted September 7, 2015 Utter p*sh yet again. Reading some of the posts i can't understand those saying Fletcher was to blame for us being p*sh in Georgia. Some of you read what you want on here, i simply said in general he is p*sh and i don't know why he is in Scotland squads all the time. Anyway tonight just backs that up. Except one lay off to Hutton he was utter gash, they guy needs binned. Davie Provan even hinted at it pre match and Strachan was even asked about him in his pre match interview, time this useless was binned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rossy Posted September 7, 2015 Share Posted September 7, 2015 I miss Kenny Miller. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scot scotland scottish Posted September 7, 2015 Share Posted September 7, 2015 Not good enough, not by a long stretch. Strachan needs to see past Fletcher and if that means a change in formation to an old fashioned 2 up top (say Rhodes with Russell 10 yards behind) then so be it. Last season whilst not scoring, Fletcher was doing some fairly decent work outside the box - he's not even doing that now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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