Indyref 2 (2)

[aaid]

1 hour ago, Ally Bongo said:

Because ...wait for it ... Independence is bigger than any one person or party

It is obvious to anyone taking notice that the current SNP do not believe that and haven't for some time

Nicola Sturgeon doesn’t look to me that she’ll be leading the charge.   I’m not saying she’s going to stand back completely, she’ll still be doing her bit, but I don’t think she’ll be the one making the decisions.

Alex Salmond doesn’t know when his time is up, he thinks the Yes movement can’t do without him.

I don’t think Nicola Sturgeon not wanting to to have anything to do Alex Salmond is going to make any difference, not least when all Salmond’s acolytes seem to view her as the devil.

[Ally Bongo]

Angus MacNeil expelled from the SNP

And there we have it - wonder how SNP loyalists will spin this one

[Hertsscot]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-66469317

Tory ex environment minister 'forgot' she had £70k worth of shares in Shell. How exactly do you forget that you've got £70k worth of shares?

[aaid]

6 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

Angus MacNeil expelled from the SNP

And there we have it - wonder how SNP loyalists will spin this one

Didn’t he resign ?

[Toepoke]

14 hours ago, aaid said:

Why would Swinney be picked out.  Maybe the author holds a grudge as he was thrown out the SNP in 2004 for repeatedly criticising John Swinney while he was leader.  

Yes I noticed he mentioned Salmond resigning in 2014 meant "Devo-John" returned to an influential position, despite the fact he'd actually held the purse strings for Salmond's entire administration.

 

[Orraloon]

2 hours ago, Hertsscot said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-66469317

Tory ex environment minister 'forgot' she had £70k worth of shares in Shell. How exactly do you forget that you've got £70k worth of shares?

Loose change for these sort of folk.

[PapofGlencoe]

26 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Yes I noticed he mentioned Salmond resigning in 2014 meant "Devo-John" returned to an influential position, despite the fact he'd actually held the purse strings for Salmond's entire administration.

 

great point and agree.

I wonder if there are plants though.  it would make most sense if Wings was a stooge I think.  although can't make my mind up.  Criticism is generally correct in a lot of ways.  however, he's created a larger fracture out of certain issues affecting all countries in Europe and America, but made them particularly Scottish.  without wanting to debate them, it really comes down to the Salmond allegations and the trans stuff, eh?  What a couple of crappy reasons for a fault line in a supposed liberation movement.  

I mentioned it before but there is a great podcast on the BBC about how misinformation can have a ripple effect: The Coming Storm.  I feel you can see parallels with Scotland's movement.  it's interesting as both sides come out dirty.  It wouldn't surprise me if some of the fractures have been seeded with some skill by bad actors on both sides of our cause's divide.  

or it could simply be the snp have been in power too long and have no political talent left.

Edited August 11, 2023 by PapofGlencoe

[Ally Bongo]

10 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

Angus MacNeil expelled from the SNP

And there we have it - wonder how SNP loyalists will spin this one

And the answer is -

3 hours ago, aaid said:

Didn’t he resign ?

 

[aaid]

2 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

And the answer is -

 

Well did he resign or not?

Explain to me how someone can resign the whip but remain in the party.  That seems like a perverse state of affairs.  

[hampden_loon2878]

16 hours ago, aaid said:

Nicola Sturgeon doesn’t look to me that she’ll be leading the charge.   I’m not saying she’s going to stand back completely, she’ll still be doing her bit, but I don’t think she’ll be the one making the decisions.

Alex Salmond doesn’t know when his time is up, he thinks the Yes movement can’t do without him.

I don’t think Nicola Sturgeon not wanting to to have anything to do Alex Salmond is going to make any difference, not least when all Salmond’s acolytes seem to view her as the devil.

Well going by events since he was character assassinated, he may well be right. The Snp certainly could be done with him

[hampden_loon2878]

both “camps” in the SNP are posturing at the moment. The trigger switch will be pushed depending on the result of the by-election. I believe the wheels are in motion to end the Bute house agreement and replace humza but it all hangs on the by-election result. To me, after that by-election would The the perfect time to hit the reset in the party, many of the “wrong” members will jump ships to the greens and then we can start the rebuild 

 

Edited August 11, 2023 by hampden_loon2878

[aaid]

46 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Well going by events since he was character assassinated, he may well be right. The Snp certainly could be done with him

Should Angus MacNeil be treated differently from anyone else, why should he be a special case?

[aaid]

43 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

both “camps” in the SNP are posturing at the moment. The trigger switch will be pushed depending on the result of the by-election. I believe the wheels are in motion to end the Bute house agreement and replace humza but it all hangs on the by-election result. To me, after that by-election would The the perfect time to hit the reset in the party, many of the “wrong” members will jump ships to the greens and then we can start the rebuild 

 

Bet this never happens, like all of Hampden_Loons other predictions*

2017 apart, the one he got right. 

[hampden_loon2878]

7 minutes ago, aaid said:

Bet this never happens, like all of Hampden_Loons other predictions*

2017 apart, the one he got right. 

Like the trans issue will destroy the snp/ sturgeon is a bad one, hamza Will tank the snp,the green coalition is a bad idea, ,, seems a lot more accurate than your sturgeon can do no wrong narrative 

[aaid]

8 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Like the trans issue will destroy the snp/ sturgeon is a bad one, hamza Will tank the snp,the green coalition is a bad idea, ,, seems a lot more accurate than your sturgeon can do no wrong narrative 

Hold on “Hamza”.  I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt that you’ve mistyped that and you’re not a racist like that ukip prick Coburn.

[hampden_loon2878]

1 hour ago, aaid said:

Hold on “Hamza”.  I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt that you’ve mistyped that and you’re not a racist like that ukip prick Coburn.

Good one 👍 yes a spelling mistake but please enlighten me how hamza would be racist?  Nice deflection BTW 

[aaid]

2 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Good one 👍 yes a spelling mistake but please enlighten me how hamza would be racist?  Nice deflection BTW 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/mar/14/ukip-mep-compares-snp-minister-humza-yousaf-terrorist-abu-hamza-allegation

[hampden_loon2878]

34 minutes ago, aaid said:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/mar/14/ukip-mep-compares-snp-minister-humza-yousaf-terrorist-abu-hamza-allegation

8 years ago and am am supposed to remember something so trivial? Give yerself a shack 

[aaid]

4 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

8 years ago and am am supposed to remember something so trivial? Give yerself a shack 

I remembered it, it was quite a bit thing at the time.  

[duncan II]

4 hours ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

8 years ago and am am supposed to remember something so trivial? Give yerself a shack 

No way aaid could build a shed, the civil servant that he is.

[aaid]

19 minutes ago, duncan II said:

No way aaid could build a shed, the civil servant that he is.

That’s quite good but I’ve never worked in the public sector I’m afraid. 

[AlfieMoon]

12 hours ago, PapofGlencoe said:

great point and agree.

I wonder if there are plants though.  it would make most sense if Wings was a stooge I think.  although can't make my mind up.  Criticism is generally correct in a lot of ways.  however, he's created a larger fracture out of certain issues affecting all countries in Europe and America, but made them particularly Scottish.  without wanting to debate them, it really comes down to the Salmond allegations and the trans stuff, eh?  What a couple of crappy reasons for a fault line in a supposed liberation movement.  

I mentioned it before but there is a great podcast on the BBC about how misinformation can have a ripple effect: The Coming Storm.  I feel you can see parallels with Scotland's movement.  it's interesting as both sides come out dirty.  It wouldn't surprise me if some of the fractures have been seeded with some skill by bad actors on both sides of our cause's divide.  

or it could simply be the snp have been in power too long and have no political talent left.

I messaged him in the lead up to 2014 to suggest that his constant attack of Rangers fans was counter-productive and unnecessary when he was running a politics campaign essentially.
 

At a time when others in the Tories and OO, etc. were pulling the strings of that unionist demographic, I didn’t think it helped to have someone who had a fairly strong online presence and was pro-Indy, to be mixing that message with football content and especially to have a go at a large number of voters.  
 

Naturally, he blanked me. 

[duncan II]

52 minutes ago, aaid said:

That’s quite good but I’ve never worked in the public sector I’m afraid. 

Fair enough! Just a silly joke. And I genuinely thought you were (or had been) a civil servant.

[Ally Bongo]

1 hour ago, AlfieMoon said:

I messaged him in the lead up to 2014 to suggest that his constant attack of Rangers fans was counter-productive and unnecessary when he was running a politics campaign essentially.
 

At a time when others in the Tories and OO, etc. were pulling the strings of that unionist demographic, I didn’t think it helped to have someone who had a fairly strong online presence and was pro-Indy, to be mixing that message with football content and especially to have a go at a large number of voters.  
 

Naturally, he blanked me. 

Ironically most of his twitter folk that like and reply to his tweets now have a UJ or Rangers in their bio 

[TDYER63]

On 8/10/2023 at 8:15 AM, Hertsscot said:

It's certainly not impossible that SNP have been compromised but the same has also be said about some of the extreme anti-SNP voices who seem to spend more of their time slagging off the SNP than telling us why we should be leaving the Union.

I guess that just leaves the rest of us Indy supporters of whatever party trying to do our best, trying to tone down the vitriol against other indy supporters, not always thinking the worst of one another, ignoring those who are constantly trying to stir up muck and remembering that 'divide and conquer' is the Empire's way. When we're at one another's throats, there's only one cause that wins-and it's not independence.

Totally agree.

On 8/10/2023 at 4:09 PM, PapofGlencoe said:

 

Interesting article from Campbell Martin.  It's hard to disagree with the idea the state would infiltrate the SNP given the factual events of the past.  If that's a given, it does make you wonder.  But I really struggle to understand why Swinney would be mentioned.  People seem to be forgetting the power of work Swinney, Sturgeon, Robertson, Salmond did during 2012-2014 - i.e. when it mattered most.  They went up against the entire British state and gave them a bloody nose.

It's also as possible they're simply listening to phones and emails as per pegaus in Catalonia and Spanish secret police.  Highly doubt Britain is above that kind of thing.

The ones sniping obsessively at the SNP and attempting to turn the movement in on itself are as likely candidates as any too.

A long time member of our branch is adamant there was a plant in the party about 20 years ago. I wasnt interested at all in politics then but coincidentally I actually knew the person she refers to as he lived in the same small village as me. Not where I currently live. He was outspoken and a bit of a troublemaker even in the village. From what I have been told I have no doubt he was a plant. The SNP member is very credible and  has devoted her life to independence. 

On 8/11/2023 at 9:13 AM, Toepoke said:

Yes I noticed he mentioned Salmond resigning in 2014 meant "Devo-John" returned to an influential position, despite the fact he'd actually held the purse strings for Salmond's entire administration.

 

Oh , there is a rather inconvenient factor for the writer 🙄

Whilst I agree about the infiltration , I think the final paragraph of his piece kinda sums up the real reason for it …

“Finally, I mentioned my books. My life-story is covered in my first book – Was It Something I Said? – including my time in politics and what actually happened during my time in the SNP Whips Office, and as a Member of the Scottish Parliament. My two other books, Outspoken – Part One and Outspoken – Part Two, take us through the eventful last ten-years of Scottish and UK politics, from the Independence Referendum to the present day and the British State capture of the SNP.”