Squirrelhumper Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 12 minutes ago, thplinth said: So you think he has made up that whole interaction with the policeman pal?Ā š Given theres 800 suicides a year in Scotland a year then they cant get many call outs if suicides make up for the most call outs.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Of Paisley Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 4 minutes ago, Squirrelhumper said: Agreed. Usually that or football.Ā Unless she can latch onto football when Scotland win 26 minutes ago, TDYER63 said: Some sort of lockdown is inevitable. There have been loads of cancellations here too. My emails are full of messages from restaurants saying ā last minute availabilityā. Its an absolute shit situation. Had our Christmas night out a week past on Friday in a really popular restaurant in Glasgow and it was very quiet.Ā The public are not going to put up with this for much longer. There will need to be evidence of serious bed shortages for people to adhere to any more lock downs. I am beginning to think people have forgot how to socialise which in itself is a concern.Ā Ā Ā The opening part of your second paragraph is absolutely bang on. Given that the hospital numbers are still way below the peak of January and 2.5million people triple jagged, there is no justification for this nonsense.Ā As I write, 220m further funding from The Treasury. So if you want a pre-Christmas pint, make hay while the sun shines this week.Ā Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thplinth Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 Scotland has one of the highest suicide rates in Europe. https://archive.md/lUieb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thplinth Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 2019 I think was also a record year (since 2011). So the reduction in 2020 being seen as any kind of 'success' is shallow to say the least. Loon was of course talking about 2021 not 2020 data. So much sophistry going on it is unreal.Ā š Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDYER63 Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 28 minutes ago, King Of Paisley said: Ā Are you in the hospitality industry?Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Of Paisley Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, TDYER63 said: Are you in the hospitality industry?Ā No.Ā I suppose my comments last night were sheer frustration. I concede that Sturgeon doesn't want us under lockdown. But my sheer frustration is that every time a new variant appears we react like rabbits in yhe headlights. We simply cant live like this indefinitely.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDYER63 Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 52 minutes ago, vanderark14 said: We had our night out last Friday too. I was surprised at the lack of people in town, it was still busy but not the usual huge crowds you expect at Christmas.Ā Last year didn't bother me but if I'm honest I'll be gutted if we have to lockdown over all or part of the festive period. We made a lot of plans over Christmas and New year with people we've not seen alot lately.Ā I'm sure I'll get over it The worry is folk continue to just get over it. There is no shame in admitting you ( i am meaning generally here not you specifically) are gutted. I feel there is a bit of an expectation still that everyone should just accept its for the greater good and to sound pissed off is selfish.Ā I think we have to just go for it at some point, though the middle of winter may not be the best time. The folk not wearing masks pisses me off I have to say but generally I am at a stage where I think we need to move on.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDYER63 Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 1 minute ago, King Of Paisley said: No.Ā I suppose my comments last night were sheer frustration. I concede that Sturgeon doesn't want us under lockdown. But my sheer frustration is that every time a new variant appears we react like rabbits in yhe headlights. We simply cant live like this indefinitely.Ā I can understand how you feel and tend to agree.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Of Paisley Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 9 minutes ago, TDYER63 said: I can understand how you feel and tend to agree.Ā I just think we are all at the end of our tether. Just when we are starting to enjoy meeting our mates at the pub for a blether over a pint or going to a racous Hampden and revel in watching the lads turning over the Danes it lmost feels like going back to square one.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDYER63 Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 3 minutes ago, King Of Paisley said: I just think we are all at the end of our tether. Just when we are starting to enjoy meeting our mates at the pub for a blether over a pint or going to a racous Hampden and revel in watching the lads turning over the Danes it lmost feels like going back to square one.Ā I do think any upcoming restrictions will be short lived but its the uncertainty of whether Ā or not these circuit breakers will ever end is the problem..People are living their lives with no way of planning anything at all.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Of Paisley Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, TDYER63 said: I do think any upcoming restrictions will be short lived but its the uncertainty of whether Ā or not these circuit breakers will ever end is the problem..People are living their lives with no way of planning anything at all.Ā I don't trust them with this circuit breaker guff. Remember last October school holidays when they shut down for what was meant to be a short time. It went on until May this year.Ā I don't believe for a minute this will be a short lived lockdownĀ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjd1972 Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 10 minutes ago, King Of Paisley said: I don't trust them with this circuit breaker guff. Remember last October school holidays when they shut down for what was meant to be a short time. It went on until May this year.Ā I don't believe for a minute this will be a short lived lockdownĀ That's my big fear.Ā These lockdowns are open ended, it could be we won't get a sniff of a pint until summer if last year is anything to go by. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDYER63 Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 23 minutes ago, King Of Paisley said: I don't trust them with this circuit breaker guff. Remember last October school holidays when they shut down for what was meant to be a short time. It went on until May this year.Ā I don't believe for a minute this will be a short lived lockdownĀ I just dont think NS will get away with a long lockdown , there will be a rebellion . I could be wrong though.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Of Paisley Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 1 minute ago, TDYER63 said: I just dont think NS will get away with a long lockdown , there will be a rebellion . I could be wrong though.Ā If she tries a long lockdown she is finished. She was the one who repeatedly said that vaccination is the only way out of this. We have all complied yet face the prospect of zero social interaction.Ā Any goodwill towards her is fast draining away.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 There isn't enough info yet about severity. South Africa has a totally different age profile which is one of the main indicators of severe outcome. I haven't the foggiest idea what the best course is to chart through this. Lockdowns move the peak rather than eliminate the peak, it's also probably too late, we're already at testing capacity so reported cases are no longer accurate. Talking about celebrity dentists is just rhetoric as well, the head of Denmarks covid team is stating the same thing about cases there. Denmark's projections show the wave so fully inundating the country, that even a lessened strain will deliver an unprecedented blow. Scientists caution that the knowledge of omicron remains imprecise. Denmark's virus modelers have many scenarios, not just one. But even in a middle-of-the-road scenario, Danish hospitals will soon face a daily flow of patients several times beyond what they've previously seen. "This will overwhelm hospitals," Grove Krause said. "I don't have any doubt about it." They will shut down some things, not full lockdown. Bars etc are being restricted in several countries. Netherlands enforced a lockdown Chris Witty also saying the same sort of thing. Let's look at Whitty's credentials: BA in Physiology, DSc in medical science, BM BCh in Medicine, DTM&H in Tropical Medicine and Hygiene, MSc in Epidemiology, LLM in Medical Law, MBA, DipEcon in Economics. Consultant doctor, Chief Scientific Advisor, Chief Medical Officer, Professor, researcher. If there is a literal choice between letting hospitality go to the wall or let the NHS collapse. Are folk seriously advocating sacrificing the health service to keep hospitality industry solvent? The government should be funding them instead like the countries above are doing. There is no good choices in this. It's not some parochial political thing, it's a 20 month long global event. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 (edited) We'll see what the 2021 suicide rate is when the figures get published and can revist it then. However there are 460 (123,000 in first 3 quarters of 2021 from 101 data) call outs a day just for public nuisance. So if suicides top that then that would be 167900 suicides in a year up from 803. here's the trendline for last 40 years just to add a bit of data to the discussion. Edited December 19, 2021 by phart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Of Paisley Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, phart said: There isn't enough info yet about severity. South Africa has a totally different age profile which is one of the main indicators of severe outcome. I haven't the foggiest idea what the best course is to chart through this. Lockdowns move the peak rather than eliminate the peak, it's also probably too late, we're already at testing capacity so reported cases are no longer accurate. Talking about celebrity dentists is just rhetoric as well, the head of Denmarks covid team is stating the same thing about cases there. Denmark's projections show the wave so fully inundating the country, that even a lessened strain will deliver an unprecedented blow. Scientists caution that the knowledge of omicron remains imprecise. Denmark's virus modelers have many scenarios, not just one. But even in a middle-of-the-road scenario, Danish hospitals will soon face a daily flow of patients several times beyond what they've previously seen. "This will overwhelm hospitals," Grove Krause said. "I don't have any doubt about it." They will shut down some things, not full lockdown. Bars etc are being restricted in several countries. Netherlands enforced a lockdown Chris Witty also saying the same sort of thing. Let's look at Whitty's credentials: BA in Physiology, DSc in medical science, BM BCh in Medicine, DTM&H in Tropical Medicine and Hygiene, MSc in Epidemiology, LLM in Medical Law, MBA, DipEcon in Economics. Consultant doctor, Chief Scientific Advisor, Chief Medical Officer, Professor, researcher. If there is a literal choice between letting hospitality go to the wall or let the NHS collapse. Are folk seriously advocating sacrificing the health service to keep hospitality industry solvent? The government should be funding them instead like the countries above are doing. There is no good choices in this. It's not some parochial political thing, it's a 20 month long global event. This isnt just about not being able to go for a pint. Its our entire civil liberties that are on the line Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 3 minutes ago, King Of Paisley said: This isnt just about not being able to go for a pint. Its our entire civil liberties that are on the line That's a tad melodramatic for me. Considering the bills that actually just passed parliament and no one mentioned anything on here about them (well apart from me and one other person). Which if civil liberty encroachment was such a dearly held position you'd expect folk to talk about them. However that's just my opinion other folk will have theirs and they're just as valid as mine. As I say I certainly don't know the best course through this, it's beyond my intelligence and knowledge to work out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lamia Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 10 hours ago, hampden_loon2878 said: I tend to agree, where does it stop? Yes protect the vulnerable but give folk the choice.Ā šš¤£š Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lamia Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 Bet all the people who are saying we have all had enough of it to justify not complying with public health measures are the same people who want to shut our borders to refugees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Of Paisley Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 11 minutes ago, Lamia said: Bet all the people who are saying we have all had enough of it to justify not complying with public health measures are the same people who want to shut our borders to refugees. Och, piss off. None of us have brought refugees into it if thats what you are insinuatingĀ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 Watching the news there, Netherlands in total lockdown, Germany closing their borders. It's not just here where governments are taking knee jerk reactions.Ā Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Of Paisley Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 12 minutes ago, Toepoke said: Watching the news there, Netherlands in total lockdown, Germany closing their borders. It's not just here where governments are taking knee jerk reactions.Ā Ā Completely over the top Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 14 hours ago, phart said: They ran scenarios, not projections on what various numbers mean in context of cases/hospitalisations etc, and what day restrictions would have to come in etc. We've missed all the deadlines for that anyway. Measured data for omicron in Denmark (the country that sequences the highest percentage of cases so has the best data on which covid variant each positive is) has infection hospitalisation rate between 0.6% and 1.5% however that's atm it's spreading in younger ages first. We currently had 80k 7 day average cases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart Posted December 19, 2021 Share Posted December 19, 2021 IĀ vacillate between it being a lot "milder" due to booster/vaccine and previous infection so might not be too bad, to we've still not enough data and NHS already under a lot of pressure and covid causes problems with isolation protocol as well in key services etc. So still can be pretty grim and the mildness might be an artifact of the age profile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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