Parklife Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Can you point to the FA paying any money directly to Jack Warner ? Who sold the tickets and kept the profits from that game? Who sold the TV rights to it? It was a bribe to play T&T so that Warner could cream some cash in for himself. Let's not pretend it was some noble cause to build a school or shite like that. The English FA have almost no credibility on this issue, so to see them taking the moral high ground is hilarious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 By their very nature, until exposed, bribes are secret affairs. Agreed what was secret about playing in Trinidad or funding a school? As for the watches I assume every voting member got one ? Again not exactly secret but presumably the FA were trying to play within the rules. I have no issue with Russia keeping the WC and England should only get it if the process is re run for whatever reason and they bid again with the best bid. Qatar however is a completely different kettle of fish IMHO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Wooooaaahhhhh there. Who's excusing or justifying deaths of people? Err you in saying that you have no issue with Qatar keeping the World Cup. It's the primary reason why they should be stripped of it today. Throwing jack warner a few million to vote for them pales into insignificance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Who sold the tickets and kept the profits from that game? Who sold the TV rights to it? It was a bribe to play T&T so that Warner could cream some cash in for himself. Let's not pretend it was some noble cause to build a school or shite like that. The English FA have almost no credibility on this issue, so to see them taking the moral high ground is hilarious. In which case every single match an international team plays away from home as a friendly is a bribe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanderer Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 In which case every single match an international team plays away from home as a friendly is a bribe. Depends on if the FA accepted their appearance fee for agreeing to the match (they would be the away team, so would be due a fee for the game). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parklife Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Err you.If you want to have a serious discussion i'm open to it. If you want to be a khunt and make shit up then you can get to fvck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaid Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 While not being naive enough to assume that the Russian bid was completely clean - I doubt any bid could claim that - I can see lots of reasons, footballing, economic, political for the 2018 bid being awarded to Russia. I don't recall huge shock to the Russian announcement when it was made outwith the English media complaining about it being unfair as they didn't win it. Qatar I think is another matter and should be looked at again. Publishing the Garcia report in full would be a start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Depends on if the FA accepted their appearance fee for agreeing to the match (they would be the away team, so would be due a fee for the game). And presumably they can set that fee from £1 to £1m . What any FA choose to receive as a match fee is down to them and them alone. If I was trying to win someone over I'd charge them £1 if I wasn't I would price accordingly. If you think that's a bribe that's fine we'll agree to disagree. I see it as good business sense . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 . If you want to have a serious discussion i'm open to it. If you want to be a khunt and make shit up then you can get to flip. Do you think Qatar should be hosting the 2022 wc ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parklife Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Do you think Qatar should be hosting the 2022 wc ? Do i think they should have been awarded it? No. Do i think they should be stripped of it? No. Do i think something should be done to improve working conditions? Yes. I work on a construction site every day. For you to try and say i don't care about people dying on them is insulting and offensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanderer Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 And presumably they can set that fee from £1 to £1m . What any FA choose to receive as a match fee is down to them and them alone. If I was trying to win someone over I'd charge them £1 if I wasn't I would price accordingly. If you think that's a bribe that's fine we'll agree to disagree. I see it as good business sense . I think most nations have their fee's set already with regards to their world rankings and caliber of squad you can bring (Argentina and Brazil charge £1m straight up to get them to even start talking). Its still a bribe to be looked on favorably, but not as under the table as other bids..... its like your boss at Christmas time going around all the clients with a bottle of whisky to be looked upon favorably when the new jobs are released in the following year by sweetening your chances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShedTA Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Qatar were awarded a contract and have spent billions of pounds fulfilling it. Even if there was scope to void the contracts (which i'm sure i read there isn't) then i'd question the value in doing so. The funniest part of the conversation (not by you) is talk of awarding it to England. Yeah, England who bribed folk for votes should get it. Good one Parkie, if Qatar were awarded the contract due to bribery then there is every reason to take it away from them. same with any country if its proven. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Do i think they should have been awarded it? No. Do i think they should be stripped of it? No. Do i think something should be done to improve working conditions? Yes. I work on a construction site every day. For you to try and say i don't care about people dying on them is insulting and offensive. And I think it's offensive that large numbers of people have died and continue to be treated as a slave labour and will in all probability continue to die. No doubt a few will get shiny portakabins to sleep in but in the main most are fecked and for that reason alone they should be stripped of it today. Throw in their attitude towards homosexuality and various other (in my opinion) Stone Age views and that's reason enough without the bent bid and no mention of playing it in winter. Fifa should take some of those coke millions and pay those blokes fair back home. With all due respect if you believe Qatar will improve working conditions for all those workers and pay them a living wage I believe you are deluding yourself they will do the bare minimum. Strip them of the WC and let the poor feckers go home because I bet most of them want to Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 I think most nations have their fee's set already with regards to their world rankings and caliber of squad you can bring (Argentina and Brazil charge £1m straight up to get them to even start talking). Its still a bribe to be looked on favorably, but not as under the table as other bids..... its like your boss at Christmas time going around all the clients with a bottle of whisky to be looked upon favorably when the new jobs are released in the following year by sweetening your chances. To quote mr bridger "everybody in the world is bent" it's where you draw the line that counts ! For me the FA didn't bribe anyone we'll agree to disagree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Work should stop in Qatar immediately. If Fifa are serious in cleaning up their act then the 2022 bidding process will be repeated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 It's been almost 2 years since i first knew about the slave labour problem in this world cup. A lot should have been sooner. Seems only to be coming to a head now though. Probably media lead now, folk parrotting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanderer Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 (edited) To quote mr bridger "everybody in the world is bent" it's where you draw the line that counts ! For me the FA didn't bribe anyone we'll agree to disagree And where do you draw the line? Just because the FA were more subtle in how they sweetened members of the voting committee (rather than go out and accidentally misplace brown envelopes in convenient places) does not mean that they can take the moral high ground because a WC that they and nobody is in Europe were bidding for was very suspect that the Russian bid was the same (IIRC Englands own member of the voting committee didn't even vote for the England FA and two other bids were looked upon favorably), esepcially since they are happy to accept money from the Qatar FA for the use of St Georges Park, while they are questioning their world cup bid. As I said earlier on, if Australia had won 2022, then we would have heard nothing else about it and would be back to the drawing board for the FA for when the next European WC is up for grabs. Edited June 3, 2015 by wanderer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parklife Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 And I think it's offensive that large numbers of people have died and continue to be treated as a slave labour and will in all probability continue to die. And so do i. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaid Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 And presumably they can set that fee from £1 to £1m . What any FA choose to receive as a match fee is down to them and them alone. If I was trying to win someone over I'd charge them £1 if I wasn't I would price accordingly. If you think that's a bribe that's fine we'll agree to disagree. I see it as good business sense . I don't see any problem with England playing a friendly in T&T as part of their campaign to get the WC and not taking a match fee for the match as they would normally do for a "normal" away friendly. That is as long as the revenue accrued by playing that match flows directly into the accounts of the T&T FA and is used to improve the game in general in that country. However, given that the reputation of the T&T FA and in particular Jack Warner then it would be reasonable to assume that wasn't the case. So while the FA probably haven't broken any rules directly and haven't handed over a brown envelope, they're not in a position to take any moral high ground. To put this into context, around the same time, Scotland played a friendly against T&T at Easter Road and Jack Warner asked that their match fee be paid directly to him. Presumably it was only going to be resting in his account. To their credit the SFA told him to "get tae" and paid the fee to the T&T FA as per protocol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 To be fair the middle-east is going to look, really different by 2022. Israel is probably going to start a war with Hezbollah this summer, either via ISIS or like 2008, in an attempt to scupper the Iran Nuclear deal. ISIS has taken another city in Iraq , the Saudi's are still bombing Yemen with reports of Cluster bombs being used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 I don't see any problem with England playing a friendly in T&T as part of their campaign to get the WC and not taking a match fee for the match as they would normally do for a "normal" away friendly. That is as long as the revenue accrued by playing that match flows directly into the accounts of the T&T FA and is used to improve the game in general in that country. However, given that the reputation of the T&T FA and in particular Jack Warner then it would be reasonable to assume that wasn't the case. So while the FA probably haven't broken any rules directly and haven't handed over a brown envelope, they're not in a position to take any moral high ground. To put this into context, around the same time, Scotland played a friendly against T&T at Easter Road and Jack Warner asked that their match fee be paid directly to him. Presumably it was only going to be resting in his account. To their credit the SFA told him to "get tae" and paid the fee to the T&T FA as per protocol. I have never claimed England were claiming the moral high ground. They played the game they lost I can cope with that. Russia played it better. Qatar on the other hand is massively different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 And so do i. Then we agree. i just think FIFA should go further and strip the hosting off of them immediately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albathebrave Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Parklife apart from spending billions on hosting the world cup as you say, what other reasons are there for qatar to be awarded the world cup? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jagtag Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Russia have been well overdue a world cup. They are a massive footballing nation. I can't see them losing it. Qatar on the other hand should never have been given it and I hope they have it taken away from them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ally Bongo Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Can you imagine what Putin might do if it's taken away from Russia ! Anyway it's only 3 years away - too late to take it off them Qatar is a different story regardless of whether their bid was won fairly or by bribery The number of deaths should have called a halt to it being staged there months ago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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