New SNP leader

[duncan II]

9 hours ago, exile said:

So you don't want indy sidelined, but your first question of a candidate would be nothing to do with independence at all. 

To be fair, it would be a strong indicator if the person was a sane human being or one more concerned with being seen as bein "progressive" (a word now lost meaning) and terrified of upsetting what is effectively a cult.

[phart]

42 minutes ago, duncan II said:

To be fair, it would be a strong indicator if the person was a sane human being or one more concerned with being seen as bein "progressive" (a word now lost meaning) and terrified of upsetting what is effectively a cult.

So we shouldn't have a leader that follows a dogma?

 

[duncan II]

23 minutes ago, phart said:

So we shouldn't have a leader that follows a dogma?

 

One that lets that dogma override the preferred direction of travel of the majority of the citizens, no.

[phart]

8 minutes ago, duncan II said:

One that lets that dogma override the preferred direction of travel of the majority of the citizens, no.

How do you ascertain the "preferred direction of travel of the majority of citizens"?

 

More poll data about the election. https://www.ipsos.com/en-uk/john-swinney-preferred-snp-voters-wider-public-more-likely-say-kate-forbes-would-be-best-first-minister

Edited May 1 by phart

[phart]

The whole point of representative democracy is that we have representatives who are embodied with the will of their constituents. Who then vote on things.

 

So when the majority of the parliament votes on something then you have the "preferred direction of travel of the majority of citizens" . Rather than polling everyone about everything all the time.

 

However whipping up a moral crisis and engaging in culture wars is a political tactic. As we've seen here on how folk think it is of such importance it should be the first question asked.

 

Personally I hope Forbes have the same faith in herself as others do and takes the job cause then we're going to see how little difference it makes, when sh'e suddenly under the spotlight in a completely unfair way.

[Squirrelhumper]

11 hours ago, exile said:

So you don't want indy sidelined, but your first question of a candidate would be nothing to do with independence at all. 

Or maybe he wants proof that the candidate is actually serious on indy and won't spend valuable time on unworkable, unpopular,  virtue signalling policies?

Edited May 1 by Squirrelhumper

[Squirrelhumper]

8 minutes ago, phart said:

 

 

Personally I hope Forbes have the same faith in herself as others do and takes the job cause then we're going to see how little difference it makes, when sh'e suddenly under the spotlight in a completely unfair way.

I'm pretty sure she won't end up in the back of a police car if she's elected. 

[Alibi]

12 hours ago, exile said:

So you don't want indy sidelined, but your first question of a candidate would be nothing to do with independence at all. 

Given the damage that allowing the toxic Greens to dictate policy has caused, and indeed given the neutering of the SNP NEC as a representative body under Sturgeon's watch, then yes, it is of vital importance so that we can see if they're going to keep digging the hole they've got themselves in, with stuff like gender issues and wood burning stoves taking priority over everything else, especially indy.

I note that Kelly Given seems to be popping up all over the place on radio at the moment - she was initially saying that Jenny Gilruth was the only sensible choice for leader, but has since dropped that line to avoid ridicule and is backing Swinney.  Call Kaye this morning is like a roll call of all the yoons - all of whom if pressed go for Swinney.  That tells you all you need to know.  If Swinney returns to the front line, it should not be as FM or leader.

I would assume that all candidates are pro-indy, though these days you can't guarantee that - Kirsty Blackman for instance and there are a few others who want to park it for years.

[phart]

1 hour ago, Squirrelhumper said:

I'm pretty sure she won't end up in the back of a police car if she's elected. 

2 out of 4 leaders is not bad.

[phart]

What's the answer to what is a "woman" by the way? Or indeed what is a "man". Since there is obviously a right and wrong answer.

[Orraloon]

1 hour ago, Squirrelhumper said:

I'm pretty sure she won't end up in the back of a police car if she's elected. 

Not as dedicated to the independence cause as most of the Catalan Government then? If she isn't prepared to go to prison for the independence cause then she won't be nearly Braveheart enough for some folk. 🤣

[Orraloon]

4 minutes ago, phart said:

What's the answer to what is a "woman" by the way? Or indeed what is a "man". Since there is obviously a right and wrong answer.

This could take a while. 😉

[phart]

8 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

This could take a while. 😉

Maybe the TAMB can prevail where modern biological taxonomy has failed.

I've always liked this exchange about the subject.

[Orraloon]

Swinney is just teasing us now. Part of him is clearly thinking that this is a fantastic opportunity for him but another part of his brain is telling not to be so fuckin daft.

[Orraloon]

1 minute ago, phart said:

Maybe the TAMB can prevail where modern biological taxonomy has failed.

I've always liked this exchange about the subject.

I think we know who won that "cock waving" competition. 🤣

[phart]

Folk were raring to go off the back of Sturgeon, before all the mess hit. Now it is a poisoned challice , folk might moan about Swinney but he might be the only one really wanting to do the job.

[StirlingEgg]

1 hour ago, phart said:

Folk were raring to go off the back of Sturgeon, before all the mess hit. Now it is a poisoned challice , folk might moan about Swinney but he might be the only one really wanting to do the job.

With Forbes aged 34 with a young family, it can't be that tempting a job. The nonsense against her has already started; you'd think she had been preaching to everyone or protesting outside abortion clinics the way folk are talking. Instead she's been asked deliberately hot potato questions and answered them. As you've already pointed out, it'll be the same for anyone. This constant looking for a publicity weak spot in a person and exploiting it doesn't help with any of the 'getting on with the day job' that they're all het up about. 

[scotlad]

6 minutes ago, StirlingEgg said:

With Forbes aged 34 with a young family, it can't be that tempting a job. The nonsense against her has already started; you'd think she had been preaching to everyone or protesting outside abortion clinics the way folk are talking. Instead she's been asked deliberately hot potato questions and answered them. As you've already pointed out, it'll be the same for anyone. This constant looking for a publicity weak spot in a person and exploiting it doesn't help with any of the 'getting on with the day job' that they're all het up about. 

It is mad how a wee Christian young mammy fae the heilans is being painted as some kind of far-right fundamentalist monster. 🤣

I'd hope if - IF - she gets the job the stuff about religion would soon be forgotten. Unfortunately the media are capable of keeping slurs going for as long as necessary. The SNP's opponents sense that it's weakening and they don't want anyone strengthening it, regardless of the consequences.

[Dave78]

3 hours ago, phart said:

 

 

More poll data about the election. https://www.ipsos.com/en-uk/john-swinney-preferred-snp-voters-wider-public-more-likely-say-kate-forbes-would-be-best-first-minister

Very interesting stuff in there.

Forbes is popular with older small 'c' conservative rural voters. That certainly fits the profile of your average TAMBer! 😁

If the yoons are touting Swinney, this will be why. Forbes will be much more likely to do damage to the Tory seats in the north east and borders.

 

 

 

The calculation i think smart SNP members will have to make, is what will the price be of shifting the party to the centre-right with Forbes. Tricky one....

The data below on popularity by 2014 indyref vote is something to consider:

 

 

[Haggis_trap]

It has to be Kate Forbes.
The SNP needs to move on from both Salmond and Sturgeon

She ticks all the boxes:

• Cambridge graduate
• young, female
• smart and articulate
• economically literate (worked for Barclays)

The only reason UK media make a fuss about the church she attended is because they are petrified of someone competent.  Hopeful there are enough reasonable / sensible members left in the party to elect the right person.

[phart]

9 minutes ago, Dave78 said:

Very interesting stuff in there.

Forbes is popular with older small 'c' conservative rural voters. That certainly fits the profile of your average TAMBer! 😁

If the yoons are touting Swinney, this will be why. Forbes will be much more likely to do damage to the Tory seats in the north east and borders.

 

 

 

The calculation i think smart SNP members will have to make, is what will the price be of shifting the party to the centre-right with Forbes. Tricky one....

The data below on popularity by 2014 indyref vote is something to consider:

 

 

What's that first graph? Net favourability by age group then has rural and urban?

I do agree they appeal to different parts within the party and definitely outwith. Liking someone more but never switching to a yes vote doesn't do much.

I don't have a twitter account so I can't really see what these mean.

[hampden_loon2878]

A bit disgusted at the attacks on Forbes, she is a nice genuine, honest person with beliefs,, if she is not the new snp leader, independence if finished, there will be defections however we need clear of that folk 

[Dave78]

17 minutes ago, phart said:

What's that first graph? Net favourability by age group then has rural and urban?

 

Aye, he got the title wrong...

 

17 minutes ago, phart said:

I do agree they appeal to different parts within the party and definitely outwith. Liking someone more but never switching to a yes vote doesn't do much.

 

Indeed.

Though i doubt the SNP establishment will have the potential impact on the Yes vote in their minds as a priority. It's about trying to avoid losing lots of seats in the coming elections.

[DoonTheSlope]

We’ve had a Muslim FM and have a Hindu PM but under no circumstances should a member of the Free Church of Scotland lead a Scottish party according to some

 

Edited May 1 by DoonTheSlope

[TDYER63]

53 minutes ago, Haggis_trap said:

It has to be Kate Forbes.
The SNP needs to move on from both Salmond and Sturgeon

She ticks all the boxes:

• Cambridge graduate
• young, female
• smart and articulate
• economically literate (worked for Barclays)

The only reason UK media make a fuss about the church she attended is because they are petrified of someone competent.  Hopeful there are enough reasonable / sensible members left in the party to elect the right person.

I have a branch meeting tonight. I hadn’t intended going but If I can steer the conversation away from how many pound shilling and pence are in the branch account I am going to try and change some opinions . I made it abundantly clear Humza was not going to cope , but they all voted for him. 
The only way, as you say, to stand a chance is to break from ‘continuity candidates’  . It might not work, but the party are left with few choices.