Indyref 2 (2)

[TDYER63]

7 minutes ago, AlfieMoon said:

“Buck stops with me” from Yousaf gave the BBC the soundbite and headline they need. Sounds weak as fvck. 
 

The absolute minimum that is required by any leader of the SNP is real strength of character . It is not like any ordinary party,  it has to battle the might of the entire Westminster system who find a common bond in this fight . 

Humza flip flops and is totally unconvincing. Its a bad day when you cant even convince those on your own side. 

  

 

 

[Ally Bongo]

1 hour ago, aaid said:

So be like a pro-Indy version of the post-Brexit Tories because that’s exactly what’s you’re describing.

Only in the minds of the NuSNP otherwise nothing like that

[hampden_loon2878]

1 hour ago, aaid said:

So be like a pro-Indy version of the post-Brexit Tories because that’s exactly what’s you’re describing.

no be like the snp that got us a majority at holyrood

[aaid]

8 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

Only in the minds of the NuSNP otherwise nothing like that

The Tories have done all the things you’ve mention in the last half a dozen years.

Ditch the Sturgeon era.  They openly plotted against ditched three PMS.  
 

Get rid of any MPs that aren’t true-believers, remember when Johnson removed the whip from all those Tory wets that meant they couldn’t stand as MPs in 2019.  He even sacked Winston Churchill’s grandson.

 Get rid of the woke stuff - the 2017 Tory manifesto had a commitment to implement GRR.

Which bit of populism would you like to be a bit more, more racist, more misogynistic, more homophobic because every single party that has a populist agenda is one or more of those.

[aaid]

6 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

BRING BACK ALEX SALMOND

What you really want

[aaid]

53 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

The absolute minimum that is required by any leader of the SNP is real strength of character . It is not like any ordinary party,  it has to battle the might of the entire Westminster system who find a common bond in this fight . 

Humza flip flops and is totally unconvincing. Its a bad day when you cant even convince those on your own side. 

  

TBF, to Humza he said that before the vote, you can’t accuse him of flip flopping on that one. 

[hampden_loon2878]

8 minutes ago, aaid said:

What you really want

what i want is independence and this bunch of incompetent arssholes will never in a million years deliver it,, the only thing of note they managed to do successfully is make sure salmonds character was destroyed, what a record to have

[hampden_loon2878]

9 minutes ago, aaid said:

TBF, to Humza he said that before the vote, you can’t accuse him of flip flopping on that one. 

so you ever going to admit i was right

[aaid]

9 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

so you ever going to admit i was right

Right on what?  I called this as a likely loss for the SNP back in June

[duncan II]

1 hour ago, Ally Bongo said:

1 Ditch the Sturgeon era

2 New Leader

3 New Cabinet

4 New Strategists

5 Move elected woo woo MSPs/MPs that don't have Independence as their priority to the shadows

6 Independence front and centre at all times and attack the BBC/MSM

7 Be more populist

 

The alternative is wipe out at the next elections and a minimum of 5 years in the Wilderness going through points 1-7

 

Your points 5 and 6 are so badly needed it's  obvious. Point 5 - get them so far too fuck. Point 6 - front and centre, always. This should not need pointed out.

It's infuriating. Bring the adults back.

[aaid]

10 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

what i want is independence and this bunch of incompetent arssholes will never in a million years deliver it,, the only thing of note they managed to do successfully is make sure salmonds character was destroyed, what a record to have

If what you want is independence then the it might surprise you to known that in the last three Holyrood election, the list vote - which is the key one, the party you want to vote for - the pro-Indy vote SNP + Greens has been 48.4%, 48.3%, 48.4%.   The total number of pro-Indy seats has been 71, 69, 71.

Being "more like the SNP that won a majority" doesn't actually change anything.   If you want independence what you need to do is convince more people to vote Yes. 

[Ally Bongo]

33 minutes ago, aaid said:

Being "more like the SNP that won a majority" doesn't actually change anything.   If you want independence what you need to do is convince more people to vote Yes. 

It's obvious from last night that the Yes voters stayed at home

[hampden_loon2878]

52 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

It's obvious from last night that the Yes voters stayed at home

And under the current regime, it will stay that way 

[mariokempes]

1 hour ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

And under the current regime, it will stay that way 

100%

[Dave78]

As the old truism goes, 'political parties don't win elections, governments lose them'

Some introspection needed among the SNP high heid yins.

 

5 hours ago, aaid said:

A new poll out today shows majority support for independence.

Seems like the Scottish electorate like independence, they just seem to dislike the SNP right now.

Problem is, they dislike the other pro-independence parties even more.

How do you square this particular circle?

Answers on a postcard to ...

It's a conundrum, certainly.

I've said to you before that i've been wondering if the SNP need to spend some time in opposition (while Labour are in charge), only for them to sweep back on an indyref2 second wind, a decade or so in the future.

What are your thoughts on that point, and the conundrum above?

[hampden_loon2878]

43 minutes ago, Dave78 said:

As the old truism goes, 'political parties don't win elections, governments lose them'

Some introspection needed among the SNP high heid yins.

 

It's a conundrum, certainly.

I've said to you before that i've been wondering if the SNP need to spend some time in opposition (while Labour are in charge), only for them to sweep back on an indyref2 second wind, a decade or so in the future.

What are your thoughts on that point, and the conundrum above?

That would only work if we were effective in opposition, there are far different needs from an opposition leader to a leader,, Kate Forbes would do well in as leader but she hasn’t the grit for opposition leader, I can’t pin point any snp politicians who would have that bite for opposition leader.. the party has gone tame 

[Dave78]

11 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

That would only work if we were effective in opposition, there are far different needs from an opposition leader to a leader,, Kate Forbes would do well in as leader but she hasn’t the grit for opposition leader, I can’t pin point any snp politicians who would have that bite for opposition leader.. the party has gone tame 

I'm intrigued by that. Opposition leaders always have an easier job than actually leading a government. Why do you believe she wouldn't have the grit?

[aaid]

1 hour ago, Dave78 said:

As the old truism goes, 'political parties don't win elections, governments lose them'

Some introspection needed among the SNP high heid yins.

 

It's a conundrum, certainly.

I've said to you before that i've been wondering if the SNP need to spend some time in opposition (while Labour are in charge), only for them to sweep back on an indyref2 second wind, a decade or so in the future.

What are your thoughts on that point, and the conundrum above?

If I knew the answer to that question do you think I’d be wasting my time on here?

One thing though, anyone who claims to support independence and who votes for a unionist party believing that it won’t matter is a mug.  

[Caledonian Craig]

Just now, aaid said:

 

One thing though, anyone who claims to support independence and who votes for a unionist party believing that it won’t matter is a mug.  

Spot on.

Why wpuld Labour in power and messing things up make a difference. We have been through this cycle before and you still have the brainwashed for generations yoons who still truly believe everuthing Britain has ever done is pure and just.They will never yield to the reality of its corrupt history.

[Toepoke]

3 minutes ago, aaid said:

One thing though, anyone who claims to support independence and who votes for a unionist party believing that it won’t matter is a mug.  

A few of them just interviewed on the news there.

 

[Dave78]

 

 

11 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Spot on.

Why wpuld Labour in power and messing things up make a difference. We have been through this cycle before and you still have the brainwashed for generations yoons who still truly believe everuthing Britain has ever done is pure and just.They will never yield to the reality of its corrupt history.

As to why it'd make a difference, well mainly, it's easier to be in opposition than government.

The current SNP is tired and out of steam. The indy polling has stagnated and the anti-democratic Westminster won't play ball with an indyref (thanks Nicola). The only way to change the picture is with a 2nd wind/resurgence, and that isn't going to come from the current SNP.

[Dave78]

29 minutes ago, aaid said:

 

One thing though, anyone who claims to support independence and who votes for a unionist party believing that it won’t matter is a mug.  

I imagine Labour activists said the same about socialism, as they watched their voters drip away to the SNP.

[brant grebner]

Humza Yousaf is an unelected fake Yes fuckwit who was put in office by GCHQ.

Everyone still left in the SNP is a dogshit fake Yes cunt.

The party is full of spives, spies, pedos, perverts, cross-dressers, English, and entitled middle-class private school career politician pricks who voted No in 2014 but are apparently now "No to Yes" but don't want to even mention independence until they've nonced every kid in Scotland

Get them all tae fuck.

[exile]

Seems to me all parties have to ask themselves why they lost votes and learn from it/act on it. If the SNP can do that and Labour don't they have a chance of winning the seat back.

[Dave78]

2 minutes ago, exile said:

Seems to me all parties have to ask themselves why they lost votes and learn from it/act on it. If the SNP can do that and Labour don't they have a chance of winning the seat back.

It's pretty obvious where the political zeitgeist has moved in politics over the last 5 years or so. It's been away from the SNP (i.e. to the right).

I agree completely with HL when he says the SNP should always be a centrist party, and Nicola has moved the dial away from there.