Texas Pete Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 23 hours ago, Malcolm said: I think var has been implemented to give uefa the opportunity to further the most financially advantageous teams A couple of grand in a brown envelope placed in the referees dressing room would have the same effect and would be less obvious. It has worked for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exile Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 8 hours ago, scotlad said: That last paragraph reminded me of this: https://youtu.be/dYBj_qAJtRA Ha ha, yes, I did have that in mind. People talk of the great Liverpool sides of the 70s, not so much Leeds Utd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exile Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 Just now, exile said: Ha ha, yes, I did have that in mind. People talk of the great Liverpool sides of the 70s, or Nottingham Forest; not so much Leeds United. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 6 hours ago, Texas Pete said: The world champions are not top tier? I think you might need to brush up on your international football. im aware of France’s recent achievements, you could argue similar for Spain .... I used the word pedigree to suggest longevity of achievement. I’m thinking over the past 60 or so years, those that I consider consistently are near the top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Malcolm said: im aware of France’s recent achievements, you could argue similar for Spain .... I used the word pedigree to suggest longevity of achievement. I’m thinking over the past 60 or so years, those that I consider consistently are near the top. Fair enough but Argentina haven’t won anything of note for 35 years unless you count the Copa America (which I don’t) and even then they last won that in 1993. They have also won the same number or world cups as France. I’m not sure you can legitimately count Argentina as a top tier country but not France. As much as I hate to admit it I would need to put England above Belgium and Denmark They’ve won the World Cup and have also been to semis and now a final of major tournaments in the last 30 or so years. You could argue Denmark are above them due to winning Euro 92 (which they didn’t even qualify for) but Belgium have won hee haw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Texas Pete said: Fair enough but Argentina haven’t won anything of note for 35 years unless you count the Copa America (which I don’t) and even then they last won that in 1993. They have also won the same number or world cups as France. I’m not sure you can legitimately count Argentina as a top tier country but not France. As much as I hate to admit it I would need to put England above Belgium and Denmark They’ve won the World Cup and have also been to semis and now a final of major tournaments in the last 30 or so years. You could argue Denmark are above them due to winning Euro 92 (which they didn’t even qualify for) but Belgium have won hee haw. Denmark winning Euro 92 was a stunning achievement by any standards. And that'll be Belgium who were runners up in Euro 80, and third in WC 86 and 18 (beating England to achieve it in the latter case) - ahead of England in all three of those tournaments? You've not really thought this through have you? Edited July 9, 2021 by Barney Rubble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 To me a top tier country is Argentina, Brazil, Germany, Italy, England, Portugal, Spain, France, Netherlands, belguim(although they haven't always been) . Then there are maybe another 4 or 5 countries who go through spells where they are in the top tier. Like Croatia and Denmark are top tier right now imo. I would say there are about 14/15 top tier nations at any given time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncan II Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 43 minutes ago, Texas Pete said: Fair enough but Argentina haven’t won anything of note for 35 years unless you count the Copa America (which I don’t) and even then they last won that in 1993. They have also won the same number or world cups as France. I’m not sure you can legitimately count Argentina as a top tier country but not France. As much as I hate to admit it I would need to put England above Belgium and Denmark They’ve won the World Cup and have also been to semis and now a final of major tournaments in the last 30 or so years. You could argue Denmark are above them due to winning Euro 92 (which they didn’t even qualify for) but Belgium have won hee haw. If you don’t count the Copa America, then all they have a chance of winning is the World Cup. Bit harsh you not counting the Copa America. Others would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 Just now, mccaughey85 said: To me a top tier country is Argentina, Brazil, Germany, Italy, England, Portugal, Spain, France, Netherlands, belguim(although they haven't always been) . Then there are maybe another 4 or 5 countries who go through spells where they are in the top tier. Like Croatia and Denmark are top tier right now imo. I would say there are about 14/15 top tier nations at any given time. Ukraine were certainly top tier material 2005 - 2008. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 2 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said: Ukraine were certainly top tier material 2005 - 2008. I am guessing you meant this for the other thread buddy. Tbh I can see why they might of been considered by some ppl to be a top tier team but I am not sure, what was their rankings at that time? Not that I am suggesting that's the criteria, just interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 1 minute ago, mccaughey85 said: I am guessing you meant this for the other thread buddy. Tbh I can see why they might of been considered by some ppl to be a top tier team but I am not sure, what was their rankings at that time? Not that I am suggesting that's the criteria, just interested. No, fully intended for this thread. No mistake, they were a top-tier side at the time, and not just because of Shevchenko. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParisInAKilt Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 17 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said: Ukraine were certainly top tier material 2005 - 2008. I know they got to the World Cup QF but didn’t make Euro 08. Is that enough to be top tier material? Even we made them look ordinary at Hampden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 5 minutes ago, ParisInAKilt said: I know they got to the World Cup QF but didn’t make Euro 08. Is that enough to be top tier material? Even we made them look ordinary at Hampden. In the interests of balance, had a look at their record in detail: Including WC 2006, 2006 - 2008 all games (34) Lost to Spain, Italy x 2 , France, Scotland and Netherlands - no other losses. Several decent draws (Italy, France), but no victories against high ranked sides. So in fairness, perhaps their ranking was skewed by WC 2006 performance. Still taking it as a significant scalp for Scotland at that time though - because it was!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 30 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said: No, fully intended for this thread. No mistake, they were a top-tier side at the time, and not just because of Shevchenko. Ok fair enough, I have never mentioned anything about Ukraine in this thread so why you would randomly bring them up is strange. They never qualified for 2004 and 2008 euros. They had a great wc 2006 but apart from that I wouldn't say they were a top tier nation. I also don't remember them being considered a top nation around that time and it wasn't considered a massive upset that we managed to beat them. Compare that with the two France games where we really didn't expect to get anything then I would say they were not a top nation during that period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said: Ok fair enough, I have never mentioned anything about Ukraine in this thread so why you would randomly bring them up is strange. They never qualified for 2004 and 2008 euros. They had a great wc 2006 but apart from that I wouldn't say they were a top tier nation. I also don't remember them being considered a top nation around that time and it wasn't considered a massive upset that we managed to beat them. Compare that with the two France games where we really didn't expect to get anything then I would say they were not a top nation during that period. OK have it your way. Ukraine were absolute non-entities and our result against them, despite their status at that time, can be discounted. Does that sound better? Edited July 9, 2021 by Barney Rubble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 30 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said: OK have it your way. Ukraine were absolute non-entities and our result against them, despite their status at that time, can be discounted. Does that sound better? Lol now you've taken the huff, I never said any of that, the point of the thread was to discuss the times we have beaten top nations over the last 20 years. Personally I wouldn't class Ukraine as a top nation but I respect your opinion that you think they were. Also for some reason you have dragged our discussion over to this thread which had nothing to do with our victory over Ukraine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 2 hours ago, Texas Pete said: Fair enough but Argentina haven’t won anything of note for 35 years unless you count the Copa America (which I don’t) and even then they last won that in 1993. They have also won the same number or world cups as France. I’m not sure you can legitimately count Argentina as a top tier country but not France. As much as I hate to admit it I would need to put England above Belgium and Denmark They’ve won the World Cup and have also been to semis and now a final of major tournaments in the last 30 or so years. You could argue Denmark are above them due to winning Euro 92 (which they didn’t even qualify for) but Belgium have won hee haw. Aye, I know..... there is some poetic licence and internal bias involved! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 16 hours ago, Barney Rubble said: Denmark winning Euro 92 was a stunning achievement by any standards. And that'll be Belgium who were runners up in Euro 80, and third in WC 86 and 18 (beating England to achieve it in the latter case) - ahead of England in all three of those tournaments? You've not really thought this through have you? Of course Denmark winning in 92 was an amazing achievement but does that put them a level above a team than won the World Cup 26 years earlier and may well win the Euros tomorrow? I didn’t say England are better than Belgium at the moment. They have won the World Cup though and have also finished fourth at two World Cups and at least second at the Euros. Anyone that thinks Belgium has a better footballing pedigree than England is deluded and clearly hasn’t thought it through and possibly needs to take the tartan tinted specs off. England could have won 2 major trophies in a little over 24 hours. Belgium have zero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 16 hours ago, duncan II said: If you don’t count the Copa America, then all they have a chance of winning is the World Cup. Bit harsh you not counting the Copa America. Others would. Yeah it maybe is a bit harsh but I certainly wouldn’t count the Copa America in the same bracket as the Euros. They normally need to invite teams to it to make it interesting. It’s incredible that Argentina haven’t won it 28 years, especially if they are this amazing team that are a level above France as some have suggested. Maybe they’ll win it on Monday morning. Messi just be choking to win it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 14 hours ago, Malcolm said: Aye, I know..... there is some poetic licence and internal bias involved! 😂😂😂 Fair enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killiefaetheferry Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 4 hours ago, Texas Pete said: Yeah it maybe is a bit harsh but I certainly wouldn’t count the Copa America in the same bracket as the Euros. They normally need to invite teams to it to make it interesting. It’s incredible that Argentina haven’t won it 28 years, especially if they are this amazing team that are a level above France as some have suggested. Maybe they’ll win it on Monday morning. Messi just be choking to win it. It's tonight and I've been trying to get a sleep to survive for the 01.00am kick off 😂. Live on bbc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killiefaetheferry Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 Thoughts on the England defensive formation? Same as against Denmark? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Russell's Lovechild Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 Wasn't our plan to win the 2022 world cup🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Pete Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 5 hours ago, killiefaetheferry said: It's tonight and I've been trying to get a sleep to survive for the 01.00am kick off 😂. Live on bbc. So it is. It was listed after the Euros final on Skybet so I thought it was this time tomorrow. Result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkbluegas Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 Just wondering what everyone watches on Tv this evening. On such occasions me and the dog have gone out for a good walk but it’s it’s very hard to ignore living down south. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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