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15 minutes ago, Malcolm said:


yeah, and no matter your views on Tommy, the reported London Met Police treatment of him yesterday is quite shocking.  Man pepper sprayed and lifted simply for standing doing nothing just cos the met don’t like him being there.

We really are in dangerous territory now - the public don’t believe that Sadiq Khan’s met police are being even handed in applying the law.  I can see from twitter comments that this is giving rise to comments like “we are in a battle for Britain now”.  We are seeing support for British nationalism rise significantly.

horse shit

 

In a statement, the Met Police said: “We have been in frequent contact with the organisers of the march in recent days.“They have been clear about their concerns that the man’s attendance, and that of those who were likely to accompany him, would cause fear for other participants.“The same view has been voiced by others.“As a result, he was spoken to and warned on more than one occasion that his continued presence in the area was likely to cause harassment, alarm and distress to others.“He was directed to leave the area but refused to do so.”

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I'm fed up hearing all the skilled and unskilled rhetoric. It's just a handy phrase again that doesn't really stand up to scrutiny and definitely not as an immigration policy. Everything falls apart and causes problems very quicky when jobs seen as 'unskilled' stop happening. This is whether through strike action or labour shortage. Basically roles that are necessary but might be hard going or unpleasant. Care workers, support workers, removal porters, school cleaners, refuse collectors...

The awful stories from care homes and children's homes highlight that there are people employed there that are definitely not suited to the environment. Low paid roles that are regarded as unskilled - appalling when those are our most vulnerable citizens. We need a massive shift in attitude which starts with the removal of media ignorance stirring. 

Going on about illegal and legal is pointless too. There are no legal routes. Migration has increased because of Brexit. 

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I havent seen the story but just from reading the above I find it hard ti believe that English police have the power to lift / move on somebody for who they are rather than what they are doing. Regardless of how other people might feel.

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8 hours ago, vanderark14 said:

horse shit

 

In a statement, the Met Police said: “We have been in frequent contact with the organisers of the march in recent days.“They have been clear about their concerns that the man’s attendance, and that of those who were likely to accompany him, would cause fear for other participants.“The same view has been voiced by others.“As a result, he was spoken to and warned on more than one occasion that his continued presence in the area was likely to cause harassment, alarm and distress to others.“He was directed to leave the area but refused to do so.”

 


its not for the met police or khan to decide who should  or should not be allowed to attend these events. He was sitting eating his breakfast.

 

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13 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

 


its not for the met police or khan to decide who should  or should not be allowed to attend these events. He was sitting eating his breakfast.

 

They didn't decide, they responded to concerns from the organisers about his attendance.

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1 hour ago, vanderark14 said:

They didn't decide, they responded to concerns from the organisers about his attendance.


So they did decide then.  It’s a free country- he should be able to go where he wants.  Plenty people had concerns about the pro Palestinian gatherings on Remembrance weekend but the met police didn’t stop that.

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1 minute ago, Malcolm said:


So they did decide then.  It’s a free country- he should be able to go where he wants.  Plenty people had concerns about the pro Palestinian gatherings on Remembrance weekend but the met police didn’t stop that.

They acted on concerns from the organisers, perfectly legitimate to do so. Are you honestly defending Robinson? Do you honestly think he was there just having breakfast?

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4 hours ago, vanderark14 said:

Robinson was told by organisers he was not welcome at the march but he went anyway. Police asked him to leave and he refused

Nobody to blame but himself for getting arrested and charged AGAIN

 

I have zero time for Robinson but under what law can / should he be arrested?  Its a slippery slope imo.

Watch him like a hawk and then the minute he steps out of line, arrest him with zero tolerance but he has to do something illegal 1st.

There are provisions already in the law where parties can apply to have an order in place to prohibit somebody attending a function / approaching a person. As far as im aware these werent sought or in place.

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7 hours ago, vanderark14 said:

Robinson was told by organisers he was not welcome at the march but he went anyway. Police asked him to leave and he refused

Nobody to blame but himself for getting arrested and charged AGAIN

 

Usually I am quite vocal about my dislike of Tommy Robinson and his right wing supporters but I don't think it's justifiable for him to be arrested for simply attending a protest or march. 

The organisers should really accept that if they hold a protest or march in the street then they might end up getting ppl that they dislike attending. Same with the police. 

It's incidents like this that make Tommy and his right wing supporters seem like victims and helps legitimise their views. 

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3 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

I have zero time for Robinson but under what law can / should he be arrested?  Its a slippery slope imo.

Watch him like a hawk and then the minute he steps out of line, arrest him with zero tolerance but he has to do something illegal 1st.

There are provisions already in the law where parties can apply to have an order in place to prohibit somebody attending a function / approaching a person. As far as im aware these werent sought or in place.

Yeh I agree and I also dislike Tommy as well but I fail to see what hes done wrong here.

Now he can set up another gofundme page and rinse his stupid supporters for "legal fees".

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7 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

I have zero time for Robinson but under what law can / should he be arrested?  Its a slippery slope imo.

Watch him like a hawk and then the minute he steps out of line, arrest him with zero tolerance but he has to do something illegal 1st.

There are provisions already in the law where parties can apply to have an order in place to prohibit somebody attending a function / approaching a person. As far as im aware these werent sought or in place.

He's not just been arrested, he's been charged so the police believe a law has been broken. 

He's due to appear un court in January. 

EDIT - he's been charged with failing to complain with a direction to disperse

I watched the video. He wad asked to move on because the organisers didn't want him their. He then starts shouting like a little spoiled child about freedom of speech and him being a journalist. Most people would move on, he didn't. He wanted a show and he wanted the show to be about him not about the march.

The only people who will think he's a victim are morons

 

Edited by vanderark14
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1 hour ago, vanderark14 said:

He's not just been arrested, he's been charged so the police believe a law has been broken. 

He's due to appear un court in January. 

EDIT - he's been charged with failing to complain with a direction to disperse

I watched the video. He wad asked to move on because the organisers didn't want him their. He then starts shouting like a little spoiled child about freedom of speech and him being a journalist. Most people would move on, he didn't. He wanted a show and he wanted the show to be about him not about the march.

The only people who will think he's a victim are morons

 


you are 100% wrong on this.  It’s a free country and not up to protestors or the met police or khan to decide who can and can’t be out in public..  

he was absolutely right to complain about being dispersed, why shouldn’t he be there? He wasn’t breaking any laws?

What if Tommy decides that any Muslims near him were causing him fear and distress, should the police go and arrest them?  What if I decide that any Aberdeen fans in my vicinity are causing me fear and distress, should the police disperse  arrest them? That’s how ridiculous this is.

 

 

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5 hours ago, mccaughey85 said:

Usually I am quite vocal about my dislike of Tommy Robinson and his right wing supporters but I don't think it's justifiable for him to be arrested for simply attending a protest or march. 

The organisers should really accept that if they hold a protest or march in the street then they might end up getting ppl that they dislike attending. Same with the police. 

It's incidents like this that make Tommy and his right wing supporters seem like victims and helps legitimise their views. 

Absolutely right.  We are in a dangerous place when the state decides who can be out in public and who can air their views.  Next minute we are china or North Korea.

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The argument is being framed in a disingenuous way by you Malcolm, no one is arguing about who can be "out in public".

He was already served a section 35 dispersal order. A law which has been in place for a decade or so. He was then arrested for breaching it. No idea what his parole conditions are from his last conviction where he was in danger of collapsing a trial against child abusers. The guy is a serial agitator , no idea if that gets taken into account, need more information i guess.

It isn't a free country in that anyone can go anywhere at anytime whenever they want and never has been.

So again just a made up argument.

 

Now whether he should have been served a dispersal order will depend on circumstances that will come out in the trial and we'll be better placed to judge that.

"It's a free country" isn't even an argument.

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1 hour ago, Malcolm said:


you are 100% wrong on this.  It’s a free country and not up to protestors or the met police or khan to decide who can and can’t be out in public..  

he was absolutely right to complain about being dispersed, why shouldn’t he be there? He wasn’t breaking any laws?

What if Tommy decides that any Muslims near him were causing him fear and distress, should the police go and arrest them?  What if I decide that any Aberdeen fans in my vicinity are causing me fear and distress, should the police disperse  arrest them? That’s how ridiculous this is.

 

 

The police and the protesters did not decide anything - THE LAW DID. 

Asking known trouble makers to disperse is nothing new or even banning people from specific areas to ensure they don't cause trouble is nothing new. You've been completely duped or in your case you want to believe and extreme right wing racist is some how a victim here. 

He was asked to leave because he wasn't welcome at the march. He was asked to leave, he refused. If you have a problem with that law, thats fine but this again is not the fault of the police and sure as fuck not the protesters fault. IF I was a protester in that march, theres no way I would want that utter cretin anywhere near my cause. They don't get to choose which laws to follow and which laws not to follow. 

 

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51 minutes ago, vanderark14 said:

The police and the protesters did not decide anything - THE LAW DID. 

Asking known trouble makers to disperse is nothing new or even banning people from specific areas to ensure they don't cause trouble is nothing new. You've been completely duped or in your case you want to believe and extreme right wing racist is some how a victim here. 

He was asked to leave because he wasn't welcome at the march. He was asked to leave, he refused. If you have a problem with that law, thats fine but this again is not the fault of the police and sure as fuck not the protesters fault. IF I was a protester in that march, theres no way I would want that utter cretin anywhere near my cause. They don't get to choose which laws to follow and which laws not to follow. 

 


so anyone who has previously broken the law was not allowed to be there? What defines a known troublemaker? What law did he break by being there? Was there anyone else there that was a “known troublemaker” in your words? Who decides what a known troublemaker is?

 

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4 minutes ago, Malcolm said:


so anyone who has previously broken the law was not allowed to be there? What defines a known troublemaker? What law did he break by being there? Was there anyone else there that was a “known troublemaker” in your words? Who decides what a known troublemaker is?

 

Well its like football hooligans who have their passports taken away. This is done to prevent them carrying on as they did before and logical to assume this is the same reasoning as to why the police asked Robinson to leave. I mean come on what was he doing there anyway - just happened to end up there? Akin to a football hooligan just happening to find himself hanging around outside a football ground on match day.

 

Edited by Caledonian Craig
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1 hour ago, phart said:

The argument is being framed in a disingenuous way by you Malcolm, no one is arguing about who can be "out in public".

He was already served a section 35 dispersal order. A law which has been in place for a decade or so. He was then arrested for breaching it. No idea what his parole conditions are from his last conviction where he was in danger of collapsing a trial against child abusers. The guy is a serial agitator , no idea if that gets taken into account, need more information i guess.

It isn't a free country in that anyone can go anywhere at anytime whenever they want and never has been.

So again just a made up argument.

 

Now whether he should have been served a dispersal order will depend on circumstances that will come out in the trial and we'll be better placed to judge that.

"It's a free country" isn't even an argument.

 

15 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Well its like football hooligans who have their passports taken away. This is done to prevent them carrying on as they did before and logical to assume this is the same reasoning as to why the police asked Robinson to leave. I mean come on what was he doing there anyway - just happened to end up there? Akin to a football hooligan just happening to find himself hanging around outside a football ground on match day.

 

@Malcolm read these posts. Absorb the information and stop being ignorant

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A bunch of pro-palestinian protestors have been arrested in the same manner. 6 folk were arrested from a pro-palestinian group 2 days ago under section 35 as well. Not a peep.

Of course as soon as it happens to Tommy Robinson (Stephen Christopher Yaxley-Lennon) it suddenly becomes a problem for a sub-set of people.

Whether folk are victims of being led by the nose by media( i just read headlines then decide to opine on complex subjects) or perhaps it's a case of tribalism (it's only bad when it happens to my side) who knows.

 

Edited by phart
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