dandydunn Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 26 minutes ago, daviebee said: Aye I'd have nightmares every night before we were due to play them. 20 years old as well. He's going to be some machine. Why the hell can't we produce guys like that? Because Scottish kids aren’t allowed to play and progress in football anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErsatzThistle Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 4 minutes ago, dandydunn said: Because Scottish kids aren’t allowed to play and progress in football anymore. We are amazing at turning talented 18/19 year old attacking midfielders into very average defensive midfielders by the time they are 23. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parklife Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 24 minutes ago, SWMM82 said: Never said he was anything special, I just don’t rate McKenna. Porteous has played every minute of the season so far for a Hibs side that have started the season well and been solid at the back. Scotland u21s don’t concede many goals either and his leadership at the back is a major factor in that. I don’t think it’s bonkers to say he should be considered.... especially when we are so lacklustre at centre half. His team got beat off McKenna's last game out too. Fluking a win vs st Johnstone thanks to an awful offside call and beating a few likely bottom 6 teams isn't that much to shout about. I have no issue with him being considered. He may improve and I'll be wrong. Claiming he's a superior centre back to McKenna at this stage however, is bonkers to me. Hes 21 years old (just two years younger than McKenna) and has barely played any football. He's a huge amount to prove. If he manages more than 20 games this season between red cards and injuries, maybe he'll do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dandydunn Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 28 minutes ago, ErsatzThistle said: We are amazing at turning talented 18/19 year old attacking midfielders into very average defensive midfielders by the time they are 23. I’m more specifically on about grassroots. Kids are held back by not being allowed to play competitive football, not being allowed to head a ball, being discouraged of celebrating winning, being allowed to take a penalty at the end of the game so they e a chance of scoring and feeling like they’ve contributed (even though they just got humped 7-0) We took the kids down to a tournament in Blackpool last year, the matches were 9 a side, the format that most kids play throughout Europe, it was our first games at that level because we’re a year behind everyone else thanks to ridiculous sfa rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 20 hours ago, ErsatzThistle said: Isn't Souttar more of a defensive midfielder anyway ? Circumstances forced him to play at centre back when he isn't out injured. Anyway, he's just suffered yet another major injury (I think his third in as many years ?) and will be out for several months. In fact one more injury like that might force him to retire very early. He's on the way back now and I think CB was always his first position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 Now then, imagine if a Scotland manager fielded a team with a right back playing on the left, with 3 centre backs and two defensive midfielders in front and his 2 most creative players on the bench, what do you think would be the reaction? Especially if he didn't win the game. Well, that's exactly what Gareth Southgate did last night and he's getting pelters. Whereas at least we won our away game. Maybe Clarke is trying to force Israel into a false sense of security - if they are basing their tactics on getting Zahravi in behind McTom on the right, then they could come unstuck. Just saying.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedlegs Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 4 minutes ago, Third Lanark said: Now then, imagine if a Scotland manager fielded a team with a right back playing on the left, with 3 centre backs and two defensive midfielders in front and his 2 most creative players on the bench, what do you think would be the reaction? Especially if he didn't win the game. Well, that's exactly what Gareth Southgate did last night and he's getting pelters. Whereas at least we won our away game. Maybe Clarke is trying to force Israel into a false sense of security - if they are basing their tactics on getting Zahravi in behind McTom on the right, then they could come unstuck. Just saying.... pure Dickovism but it might just work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz7 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 (edited) Like everyone else under whelmed with our last 2 games but and its a big but we are top of group. What I took from it was that 343 does not work as our 2 centre mids in 1st game jack and mcgregor and 2nd mclean and fleck were over ran. if doing this i think it needs a 352 with mcburnie and dykes up front and going a bit longer. What I want though is back to a 433 as this allows as others say robertson to have someone in front of him id go with Marshall Tierney Cooper Mckenna Robertson Mctominay Jack Mcginn Christie Dykes Fraser Jack looked the best of our midfielders over last 2 games and as he is main player at rangers his confidence is up to receive ball anywhere hopefully gilmour gets back in chelsea team and he will take his position and run our midfield. What i really noticed was that although we say our midfield is strong fleck and mclean looked really poor and i feel not good enough. mcgregor is out of form and there is not much between him and jack but at this time jack is better.. This team has only 1 player (tierney) outwith his natural position and clarke has to play him there as he is not good enough ala Ronaldo obviously to have a full team designed for him and robertson to be playing. That team imo would beat israel easily but also we are up against it versus norway due in the main to haaland as all the rest are similar in players to us i feel but he is just exceptional. As always im optimistic but also do believe clarke is out his depth and our media got him the job because he got kilmarnock 3rd in our league which is laughable. No one will convince me that players from manchester united liverpool and arsenal etc and even glasgow big 2 will have total respect for him. Edited September 9, 2020 by gaz7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 39 minutes ago, gaz7 said: As always im optimistic but also do believe clarke is out his depth and our media got him the job because he got kilmarnock 3rd in our league which is laughable. No one will convince me that players from manchester united liverpool and arsenal etc and even glasgow big 2 will have total respect for him. As a player he was voted into Chelsea's all time XI, as a coach he's had success working with some of the best players in the world. I think it's safe to say the squad will have the utmost respect for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErsatzThistle Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 3 hours ago, Third Lanark said: He's on the way back now and I think CB was always his first position. It was announced two weeks ago that he needs yet another operation on his achilles. He's going to be a while coming back from that. Dundee Utd fans on here who saw him in action say that defensive mid was natural position. I'll take their word for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz7 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 5 hours ago, Toepoke said: As a player he was voted into Chelsea's all time XI, as a coach he's had success working with some of the best players in the world. I think it's safe to say the squad will have the utmost respect for him. Doubted he was in Chelsea's best 11 and a quick google showed he wasn't. Even if some journalist had named him in it the players now wouldn't even know him I'd imagine. I remember him coz I'm 48 but today's players wont. Yes hes been coach at a lot of big clubs but I will counter that and say theres a reason that hasn't been the case for the last roughly10 years. His recent seemingly successful time at kilmarnock is to the players I'm talking about nothing andas it should be. Also the reason I believe now the 2 Irelands will be poor in the near future as they have 2 nobodies as manager. Michael o'Neill got lucky previously as he had a premiership back 4 and no superstars who had been used to poor performances and results but were proud and then built momentum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErsatzThistle Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 Do people now realise what a good keeper David Marshall is and how vital he is to Scotland ? I'd even go so far as to say that at the moment he's as vital to our XI as John McGinn is. I've noticed he also bawls out and orders around our defenders a lot more than he did several years ago when he became a regular. He wasn't even fully fit for these two games (that's why I thought McLaughlin would have been in with a good chance of playing) but still pulled off some great saves. We'd never have got those points the other day if it wasn't for big Marsh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orraloon Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 20 minutes ago, ErsatzThistle said: Do people now realise what a good keeper David Marshall is and how vital he is to Scotland ? I'd even go so far as to say that at the moment he's as vital to our XI as John McGinn is. I've noticed he also bawls out and orders around our defenders a lot more than he did several years ago when he became a regular. He wasn't even fully fit for these two games (that's why I thought McLaughlin would have been in with a good chance of playing) but still pulled off some great saves. We'd never have got those points the other day if it wasn't for big Marsh. I agree, He doesn't get the credit he deserves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 59 minutes ago, gaz7 said: Doubted he was in Chelsea's best 11 and a quick google showed he wasn't. Have a look here... https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/the-chelsea-centenary-xi.227734/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz7 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 2 minutes ago, Toepoke said: Have a look here... https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/the-chelsea-centenary-xi.227734/ Lol c'mon that was in 2005 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 15 minutes ago, gaz7 said: Lol c'mon that was in 2005 . And? It was the club's team of their first 100 years. Now he might not be in their next one in 2105 but we won't be around to find that out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirk Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 36 minutes ago, Toepoke said: Have a look here... https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/the-chelsea-centenary-xi.227734/ I went to check too to be fair, never realised he had spent as long at Chelsea as a player tbh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz7 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 21 minutes ago, Toepoke said: And? It was the club's team of their first 100 years. Now he might not be in their next one in 2105 but we won't be around to find that out. Yes on some random board but most of players in our team will not have heard of him I'd imagine other than maybe billy gilmour. The utmost respect which was your 1st point I dont believe would be true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 26 minutes ago, gaz7 said: Yes on some random board but most of players in our team will not have heard of him I'd imagine other than maybe billy gilmour. The utmost respect which was your 1st point I dont believe would be true. I doubt its lack of respect for Clarke that's the problem. He played for Chelsea and hes been assistant manager to mourinho at Chelsea as well as managing West brom to their best ever league finish. The only guy who has achieved alot more than him career wise is robertson and he's not the sort to be disrespectful to a manager. There are plenty of managers out there who had very mediocre careers but still command respect as a manager. I think most of the players will know who Clarke is and his career as a manager and player. I am no expert on Clarke but I knew his history before he took over the scotland job and I respected his career(playing and manager). We are not talking about a guy who played for East Fife then managed killie. He has had a relatively successful career at top level football. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 31 minutes ago, gaz7 said: Yes on some random board but most of players in our team will not have heard of him I'd imagine other than maybe billy gilmour. The utmost respect which was your 1st point I dont believe would be true. It wasn't some random board it was the official Chelsea website. Here's another link to the archive... https://archive.vn/20120630230056/http://www.chelseafc.com/page/LatestNews/0,,10268~862299,00.html Anyway that's by the by, how many players have a lot of knowledge about their manager's playing career? I'd wager it's in the minority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz7 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 20 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said: I doubt its lack of respect for Clarke that's the problem. He played for Chelsea and hes been assistant manager to mourinho at Chelsea as well as managing West brom to their best ever league finish. The only guy who has achieved alot more than him career wise is robertson and he's not the sort to be disrespectful to a manager. There are plenty of managers out there who had very mediocre careers but still command respect as a manager. I think most of the players will know who Clarke is and his career as a manager and player. I am no expert on Clarke but I knew his history before he took over the scotland job and I respected his career(playing and manager). We are not talking about a guy who played for East Fife then managed killie. He has had a relatively successful career at top level football. Yep I agree with some of your points and I respect his career due to me being 48. What I'm meaning is players will have a lot more respect for instance a ryan Giggs or Graeme souness due to their career than steve Clarke. Anyway we could go on and on forever I just hope he proves me wrong as I have said previously we do have the players imo to be a lot better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, gaz7 said: Yep I agree with some of your points and I respect his career due to me being 48. What I'm meaning is players will have a lot more respect for instance a ryan Giggs or Graeme souness due to their career than steve Clarke. Anyway we could go on and on forever I just hope he proves me wrong as I have said previously we do have the players imo to be a lot better I think most will know he played for Chelsea in the English top flight. If thats not enough for them to respect him given that half our squad play in the spl/championship then they are idiots. I think most will know about his managerial career as well. Hes well respected in football and had a very accomplished career as a player and a manager/assistant manager. I am pretty sure they respect him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErsatzThistle Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 Feckin hell, arguing about Chelsea's greatest ever team on TA specific. Get a grip guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orraloon Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 10 hours ago, Toepoke said: Have a look here... https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/the-chelsea-centenary-xi.227734/ Only one Frank Lampard? Kinda hard to believe. Did the boy doing the counting add their scores together? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orraloon Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 8 hours ago, ErsatzThistle said: Feckin hell, arguing about Chelsea's greatest ever team on TA specific. Get a grip guys. Aye, you're right let's get back to arguing about formations. Can never have enough of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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