killiefaetheferry Posted November 17, 2019 Share Posted November 17, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, bazmidd said: Never seen Halkett play is he any good then? Fuck knows, but this Hacklett guy sounds the fucking business. Granny rule is it? Edited November 17, 2019 by killiefaetheferry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rscot Posted November 17, 2019 Author Share Posted November 17, 2019 1 minute ago, bazmidd said: Is he better than Souttar? Where, as a centre half? Or as a def mid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted November 17, 2019 Share Posted November 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, killiefaetheferry said: Fuck knows, but this Hacklett guy sounds the fucking business. Granny rule is it? 😂😂😂😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghtresa Posted November 17, 2019 Share Posted November 17, 2019 People talk about right back, centre back, striker being problem positions, but this is our biggest deficiency IMO. The only way round it I can see is to play 5 at the back with jack in front. A back 4 just leaves us too open down the middle. I'm desperate for Clarke to be successful and believe he should be given more time than previous managers were afforded, but I'm worried his stubbornness on this issue ultimately may be his undoing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rscot Posted November 17, 2019 Author Share Posted November 17, 2019 (edited) What I can say is that last season Livingston played a back 3 with Halkett in the centre of the 3 organising the back line. Livingston had 14 clean sheets, a goal difference of -2, averaging a loss of 1.15 goals per game over the season. The back line consisted of Kelly(gk) Gallagher. Halkett. Lithgow Kelly gone to QPR Gallagher gone to Motherwell, just won 1st cap for Scotland Halkett gone to Hearts and believe it or not may well still be their top goalscorer. Injured out to January. He scored 7 goals in 40 games last season, all 7 goals in the league. He was the captain of Livingston and organiser of the defence. Edited November 17, 2019 by Rscot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gonzohiggy Posted November 17, 2019 Share Posted November 17, 2019 8 minutes ago, ghtresa said: People talk about right back, centre back, striker being problem positions, but this is our biggest deficiency IMO. The only way round it I can see is to play 5 at the back with jack in front. A back 4 just leaves us too open down the middle. I'm desperate for Clarke to be successful and believe he should be given more time than previous managers were afforded, but I'm worried his stubbornness on this issue ultimately may be his undoing. 5 at the back and a defensive midfielder 😬 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rscot Posted November 17, 2019 Author Share Posted November 17, 2019 (edited) In the group games during this qualifier Scotland have only managed 2 clean sheets, both against San Marino, that means we need to score at least 2 goals to win a match against teams like Cyprus. Edited November 17, 2019 by Rscot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry george Posted November 17, 2019 Share Posted November 17, 2019 We have Mulgrew who has played the role for both Celtic and for Scotland and played it very effectively. It's true, at 33 he's getting on a bit but pace was never part of his game and we can maybe get a year or two out of him before McTominay's ready to drop into that role. I've always prefererred him as a midfield anchor rather than a centre half. It's a sensible option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rscot Posted November 17, 2019 Author Share Posted November 17, 2019 (edited) 18 minutes ago, henry george said: We have Mulgrew who has played the role for both Celtic and for Scotland and played it very effectively. It's true, at 33 he's getting on a bit but pace was never part of his game and we can maybe get a year or two out of him before McTominay's ready to drop into that role. I've always prefererred him as a midfield anchor rather than a centre half. It's a sensible option. Perhaps not the most popular choice, but I think if I was Clarke I’d be tempted to call him up again for the role. Especially for the Nations League games next year. I’d totally forgot that Mulgrew played as a Defensive Midfield Centre. Edited November 17, 2019 by Rscot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandyb Posted November 17, 2019 Share Posted November 17, 2019 (edited) McTom at centre back with McKenna. Robertson and Tierney as full backs. Man U thought McTom would be a CB and Jose played him there. He’s big, strong, aggressive, right footed and good in the air. He’s also a leader. A lot better than what we have and we have a few for CM. Edited November 17, 2019 by sandyb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohadeer Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 10 hours ago, Rscot said: As a defensive midfielder, I don’t know he’s never played there, but I think he maybe able to. He’s mobile enough, probably decent enough on the ball to do the basics ok, which is all I’d expect. But he is very aggressive, good in the tackle, strong, threat at set pieces. As a centre half he is decent, in a back 4 we probably have better, but in a back 3 he’s good in the middle, he is a leader / organiser. That’s your suggestion for playing in our midfield? At international level? You’re suggesting a defender, who has played one season in the SPL, and by your own admission, never played in midfield before?! I mean, by all means, if we want to rack up another 20 years of not qualifying for major finals, that would be the kind of selection that would go a long way to achieving that! Where did you pull that suggestion from? A. You’re a Hearts fan. B. You’re Craig Halkett’s father. C. You’re Craig Halkett. (And just in case the suggestion didn’t make us laugh enough, you even called him Craig ‘Hacklett’ for added comedy value.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mccaughey85 Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 7 hours ago, sandyb said: McTom at centre back with McKenna. Robertson and Tierney as full backs. Man U thought McTom would be a CB and Jose played him there. He’s big, strong, aggressive, right footed and good in the air. He’s also a leader. A lot better than what we have and we have a few for CM. Pretty sure mctominay wasn't very good at CB and man utd gave up on that idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dark_Knight Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 (edited) 50 minutes ago, mccaughey85 said: Pretty sure mctominay wasn't very good at CB and man utd gave up on that idea. Yep. Against West Ham. In fairness, he was any worse than his two defensive partners in that match. McTominay is not a centre back. He's not an anchorman, either. If you look at the stats they tell you that he's the most fouled player in the EPL and he's completed the most dribbles. His natural game is getting the ball and striving forward with it. He's an old fashioned box to box midfielder. Edited November 18, 2019 by The_Dark_Knight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalgety Bay TA Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 9 hours ago, sandyb said: Man U thought McTom would be a CB and Jose played him there. Nope. Mourinho played him there to prove a point to the board for not buying him a proper CB. Think they got hosed that game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rscot Posted November 18, 2019 Author Share Posted November 18, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, dohadeer said: That’s your suggestion for playing in our midfield? At international level? You’re suggesting a defender, who has played one season in the SPL, and by your own admission, never played in midfield before?! I mean, by all means, if we want to rack up another 20 years of not qualifying for major finals, that would be the kind of selection that would go a long way to achieving that! Where did you pull that suggestion from? A. You’re a Hearts fan. B. You’re Craig Halkett’s father. C. You’re Craig Halkett. (And just in case the suggestion didn’t make us laugh enough, you even called him Craig ‘Hacklett’ for added comedy value.) If you read all my posts I suggested that Mulgrew would be a possibility once another poster stated he has played there. But we can’t expect to get anywhere while we are needing to score at least 2 goals a game against anyone other than the very lowest seeded teams. I imagine it wouldn’t take much for you to find something funny. You probably still think that singing a stupid song from “Sound of Music” is hilarious. It was maybe funny one time, 30 years ago mate. Edited November 18, 2019 by Rscot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyD Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 The Cyprus game again highlighted that defensive mid the key weak area of our team. We have a lot of 'reputation' players we've put in there.. Jack, McGregor, McGinn, McLean.. none of them can do that job tho. None of them are defensive enough, tho fortunately we've found a better spot for McGinn and he's doing well as a number 10. McGregor was absent for long period against Cyprus, no real energy from him, and managed to lose his marker for the ball thru that the guy mis-controlled when in 1v1, and got robbed on the ball facing his own goal because he just lingered on it too long, which resulted in a shot on goal for them. Just not good enough, especially given the level of the opposition. As for Jack. He just seems wildly unaware of anything that's going on around him and refuses to actually mark. Drifting off while ball watching as his man came around the back for the header at the back post that looked like it was in. Half jogging back when he could easily have closed the space to the man he should be picking up as it was swung across to a man left free at the back post (because the centerbacks had to cover for Jack). Not holding him responsible for their goal, but he was one of the 5 marking 4 that left Efrem in acres of space to score. Not guilty, but certainly not innocent. Both of them were way below the standard required, not even doing the basics. That we keep going to the same dry well over and over is just depressing, be it McGregor, Jack or McLean. They simply aren't defensively good enough to play a defensive role. Unfortunately there's no shining candidates to take the places. McTominay is one, I think we all agree he should be one of the two. But the other is really just picking the least bad option. For me Armstrong is Mr Consistent. Always puts effort in, seems to be a started for his club now, can break from deep and also brings quality dead balls. Shinnie should be able to do the job. Broken into the Derby side and doing well by all accounts. Yes, he was bad in Kazakhstan at left back. So let's not play him at left back. McCrorie.. might be an option if he wasn't playing right back in League One. One other slightly left field option is Liam Palmer.. He played center mid before be became a right back. For me it's a last resort situation, as he's doing ok at right back at the moment and should probably just be left to get on with it there. We need a change, and for me it's pretty depressing that Clarke can't see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceudmilefailte Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 3 hours ago, The_Dark_Knight said: Yep. Against West Ham. In fairness, he was any worse than his two defensive partners in that match. McTominay is not a centre back. He's not an anchorman, either. If you look at the stats they tell you that he's the most fouled player in the EPL and he's completed the most dribbles. His natural game is getting the ball and striving forward with it. He's an old fashioned box to box midfielder. Mctominay is our best centre back, our best anchorman and our best box to box midfielder. It's a matter of how much importance you place on each position and who the alternatives are. Could be our best right back too but that is not a very important position Conceding goals has become more important than scoring them so we can leave him out of playing striker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevenmcn Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 16 hours ago, bazmidd said: No way should we be sacrificing McGregor or McTominay if both are fit against any sides seeded or ranked below us. These two compliment each other well and long term could be a very good Midfield partnership. Remind me again which game it was that those two ran show in midfield? Cause for the life of me, I can't remember the last time a Scotland midfield dominated a game against any reasonable opposition, even though it's our strongest department. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dark_Knight Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 47 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said: Mctominay is our best centre back, our best anchorman and our best box to box midfielder. It's a matter of how much importance you place on each position and who the alternatives are. Could be our best right back too but that is not a very important position Conceding goals has become more important than scoring them so we can leave him out of playing striker Nice. So we clone McTominay? People know my thoughts about how I think we should set up defensively, so I'm not going to go there. If we can manage to do that, with McTominay in central midfield, given license to stretch his legs, I think there's something there. One thing is for sure, though, McGinn is better playing as a second striker than an anchorman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaid Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 56 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said: Mctominay is our best centre back, our best anchorman and our best box to box midfielder. It's a matter of how much importance you place on each position and who the alternatives are. Could be our best right back too but that is not a very important position Conceding goals has become more important than scoring them so we can leave him out of playing striker Is he any good between the sticks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceudmilefailte Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 1 hour ago, The_Dark_Knight said: Nice. So we clone McTominay? People know my thoughts about how I think we should set up defensively, so I'm not going to go there. If we can manage to do that, with McTominay in central midfield, given license to stretch his legs, I think there's something there. One thing is for sure, though, McGinn is better playing as a second striker than an anchorman. So you don't agree that McTominay would be our best defensive midfielder if that was where we played him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dark_Knight Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 2 hours ago, ceudmilefailte said: So you don't agree that McTominay would be our best defensive midfielder if that was where we played him. It would depend who the second anchorman was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyD Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, The_Dark_Knight said: It would depend who the second anchorman was. Robertson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dark_Knight Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 Just now, andyD said: Robertson. Then no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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