gonzohiggy

Good performance I thought. Some really nice build up play. Was impressed by Barron, Cameron and Conway in particular.

Souttar and Jack are in and out. Turnbull and Forrest are out far more than they are in and are no more than squad players. Not exactly a resounding endorsement of Scottish players in the premiership. Celtic and Rangers have a huge catchment area and a huge pull for young players, it’s inexcusable for them to not produce players ready for their first team. Even the ones you highlight - 3/4 of them were signed from other Scottish clubs. I think rangers are more culpable as I actually see a couple of players who should be involved now but who aren’t. Young players improve rapidly when given opportunities- just look at mcausland (I know he’s N Irish)

Don’t disagree it’s been a factor just feel like more could be done so that it’s not. I think it’s more about not having enough of the technical types available within budget. England is just next door so there’s an endless supply of big strong types but technical players are in far shorter supply. Integration of youths would greatly assist this because you can produce your own.

Pitches can be an issue but I think that’s too easy an out for clubs. If clubs chose to invest in a forward thinking manager, they would need to invest in a pitch aligned with that. Motherwell, hibs, rangers are playing on bowling greens even in January.

Totally agree. There’s no coach in our top league other than Ange / Rogers who adopts a more modern, possession based style of play. There are clubs in the lower leagues Airdrie and Queens Park but none in the premiership. English clubs aren’t great at it either but you look at what De Zerbi has done at Brighton (ignoring their incredible recruitment) and it’s blown people away in general and gets them results. Also agree re the national team we are good just now but if we don’t address the premiership and issues I’ve noted we’ll be back to being crap again in no time.

We should definitely do better. I firmly believe that the players are there and I also think the performance schools are fantastic for player development. Where I think we fall down in player development is: 1) the players at youth level are taught to play out from the back, possession based style with ball on ground generally. The best ones then get in and around first team level but the game they meet at that level is totally different and they are ill prepared. I’ve seen every club in the premiership this season in person and other than Celtic, the only team who passed the ball on the ground were Dundee. Every other team is filled with 6ft plus guys built like brick s**t house but who are limited football players. These players are often not Scottish. This tendency towards brawn before brain in my opinion prevents enough technical young players getting a chance but also even when they do they aren’t getting experience of playing football the right way at the top level. Going a step beyond, this is why our clubs have traditionally struggled in Europe - they can’t keep the ball and the kick and rush style doesn’t work against the slower European build up. 2) the clubs don’t place enough emphasis on playing their young players. Many would rather bring in someone from England on loan than give one of their own a shot. I’ve seen it with Kilmarnock this season - brought Andy Dallas on loan from Barnsley when 18 y/o Bobby Wales was already there. The league or SFA even needs to mandate the use of homegrown players in match day squads more than currently. Forget the B team nonsense. no doubt lots more issues than these but both frustrate the life out of me.

I don’t agree with your take on Gilmour. Yes it’s been his best season so far but he’s played a fair amount of games in EPL at 22 and not all this season. He’s an elite level talent. Yes he’s had some difficult times and a dreadful loan move which made very little sense from the outside but As I said in earlier thread the best players eventually find their way through. Gilmour is probably a bit of an outlier as he really is an unbelievable talent who I think would be playing at the top level regardless of his route there.

I stayed 3 years before coming back up the road. Retired this year so have had a long playing career just not at the level I would have thought as a kid but still some great memories. I mentioned earlier about having the full package to become a good professional - technical, physical, game intelligence and mental. I had the first three but was sorely lacking in the 4th which meant that (with hindsight) I was never really cut out for being a top professional. You need to have total / unshakable self belief and I only had that when circumstances around me were perfect which they rarely are. In terms of the current crop of young players - I don’t think they are much different really to 20 years ago. At 16 you think you are the best and can make it wherever you go whether that’s Man Utd or at Hamilton. It’s very difficult for a kid from Scotland to turn down a move to a top EPL club. The money is more in a week than in a month in Scotland and my experience is everything is better coaching / facilities the lot. I think that’s where having football experience in your family can help where advice can help you pick the right club, not necessarily the biggest name or the most money. I personally think the Scottish Premiership clubs are generally really really poor at developing their own. I’m not sure if that’s down to pressure on managers or the players aren’t good enough or it’s too physical for them but the clubs are missing a trick by not having at least 3 of their own youth in the first team. Just look at what happens when the boys get a chance, Lennon miller or David Watson for example this season they improve rapidly when they play.

I feel fairly well qualified to talk on this topic having moved at 16 from an SPL club to an English premier league club. There are parts from previous posters I agree with and others I don’t. Generally no one player is the same and player’s development is not linear. I would say that first team football is essential at the right stage in a players development and with the right club. Most players will stay at their parent club from 16 until at least 18. The coaching at the top professional clubs is excellent, the boys are still boys and are developing physically and mentally and they benefit from being around their peers. For a player who has obvious talent such as Doak a loan could be beneficial but he’s also barely 18 and prior to his injury he’ll have been training with world class players and getting unbelievable day to day experience of working with salah. That is an unbelievable opportunity for a young player and at his age is more beneficial to his potential of being an elite player than going on loan to SPL or championship at the moment. Having said that, there’s a point where that learning needs to be put into practice and he starts to get real experience in first team football. That could be a loan next season for him. There was talk earlier about clubs “hoarding” young players. This is absolutely the case and it’s getting worse with kids signing at 8 years old but my overriding experience / feeling is that the best players (ie those who have the correct combination of technical ability, mentality, game intelligence and physical ability) invariably find a way to their level regardless of how many players they are competing with. It may take longer but they’ll find a way through. McGaughey85 makes a valid point in the sense that at a certain point a young player needs to be playing senior football. When that happens totally depends on their own situation physically/ mentally / technically as well their position within their own club.

Didn’t watch the first half but he was sensational in the second half.

Agree that seems most likely. I do think he’d do well for the right EPL team though. Everton might be a decent fit although he’d likely be an impact player

Perhaps with hindsight but if he took the view of concentrating on the Euros he could get injured in January, miss the euros and his big money move. It’s a tough one but footballers generally follow the money.

I think he and most 28year olds with the sort of career he has had will prioritise the money before the Euros. That’s not even the choice for him though as he’ll fully expect to keep doing what he is currently at his new club. Important to remember he was part time and working as a PT when at Ayr not too long ago.

If a club of suitable stature comes in for him and fee agreed with hearts eg Old Firm or EPL / Big Championship he’ll be off. It would be great from a Scotland supporters perspective if he keeps doing what he is at the moment but given he is 28 this is his last chance for a move which will provide life changing money. He is probably on 6-8k a week at the moment but moving to Everton, Wolves, Southampton or even Rangers he’ll be on at least £15-20k and on 4 year deal.

I understand on the frustration part - I likewise think Ferguson should have had more time but suspect his time will come soon enough. Re Shankland - I think there’s a bit of a misconception that he is a Kris Boyd type player ie a goal scorer who does little else. Yes he’s a great finisher but he has terrific instincts and movement. He’s always getting across defenders or making good runs which combined with his shooting ability technically results in regular goals. I think he’s more than capable of occupying defenders in much the same way as Dykes. Look at his recent goal against Hibs - jumps into the defender while isolated to create a half chance which he takes brilliantly. He doesn’t have the same explosiveness as Adams granted so won’t have the same success running channels. Ive seen him in the flesh twice this season and he had stood out an absolute mile and it’s been more for his all round game rather than his goals.