phart Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 The problem is HMRC employ people not offices so not really relevant how many offices there are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunchy Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 The thing is, Scunnered, why does anyone have to be to blame? It's engineering - things are designed to do what is required at the lowest possible cost compatible with not failing under specified loading conditions. An engineer (and i refer to professional engineers here, not your TV repair man who is actually a technician, not an engineer) is sometimes described as someone who can do for a penny what any fool can do for a pound. There has been a structural failure which is almost certainly due to increased loading for which the bridge was not designed. When you increase loading, something is going to give. In our society it's all about "who can we blame?". What they should be asking is "How can we fix it and can we learn anything from this to reduce the chances of anything else failing in the future". Unfortunately we are living in a blame culture where no doubt we will in due course be getting spam emails asking us "are you due compensation for the stress (see what i did there, fellow engineers?) caused by the forth Road Bridge being closed?". Sometimes things go wrong because of factors not foreseen - like much heavier vehicles. You can't forecast the oil price next week, so how can you forecast the weight of an HGV in 50 years' time? This incident is not the fault of the SG, but don't let the facts get in the way of a good mainstream media smear attempt, eh? Well said sir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louch Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 It's been common knowledge for years that bridge was overloaded, had the preventative maintenance schedule been revised to reflect this and the at risk parts would have been changed before they failed. As as seen now, If you removed the part you would need the bridge closed, as without it the bridge is unsafe , as it is now with a broken part. So would need the bridge closed as per now. So fail to see how fixing then is different from fixing now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 Alibi an apologist for government mistakes and funding cuts. A scourge on others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac1 Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 Alibi an apologist for government mistakes and funding cuts. A scourge on others. Your posts are a scourge on my eyes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toepoke Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 So fail to see how fixing then is different from fixing now? Not hugely different but for a planned closure the bridge users would have had a bit of notice at least. Plus I expect it's costing a lot to get a huge engineering team out there at short notice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scunnered Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 Alibi an apologist for government mistakes and funding cuts. A scourge on others. My thoughts too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antidote Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 Alibi an apologist for government mistakes and funding cuts. A scourge on others. Remove Alibi and insert Alan and you will be 100% correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antidote Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 (edited) My thoughts too... Your comrade's thoughts too. http://wingsoverscotland.com/the-visionary/ http://wingsoverscotland.com/long-to-reign-over-us/ Edited December 11, 2015 by antidote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 Wings Over Scotland! Gullible people crowd funding the retirement of a failed computer game reviewer with personality defects. A genius. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scunnered Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 Your comrade's thoughts too. http://wingsoverscotland.com/the-visionary/ http://wingsoverscotland.com/long-to-reign-over-us/ Boy... That sure showed me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antidote Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 Wings Over Scotland! Gullible people crowd funding the retirement of a failed computer game reviewer with personality defects. A genius. A web site that backs up its claims with proof. Better than being gullible to a state run by an Eton boy pig shaqqer, along with an establishment that is under investigation for paedophile activities and many jailed for fraud, all overseen by a head of state that has many family problems. How's Andrew's alleged paedophile case coming along anyway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antidote Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 Boy... That sure showed me I'm sure he's holding a banner saying 'workers republic' there. Now, where have I heard that before? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scunnered Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 I'm sure he's holding a banner saying 'workers republic' there. Now, where have I heard that before? I've heard many many people say it... Some with principles, and many many like Mr. Darling. Or is it Sir Darling? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 When people use paedophilia to make a tenuous political argument you really appreciate how nationalism destroys political debate and reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antidote Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 When people use paedophilia to make a tenuous political argument you really appreciate how nationalism destroys political debate and reason. Oh dear that is rich coming from you with your unsubstantiated thread on Natalie McGarry where you were using rule Britannia newspapers to try and score points. So, in your mind, the paedophilia didn't happen and it's not truthful ? See that's the difference with the website that you just tried to rubbish is that they back up their claims with proof, proof that you can research yourself, whereas you rely on the establishment media that feeds you any old shoite, shoite that you seem to take in with ease because it suits your warped political thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antidote Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 I've heard many many people say it... Some with principles, and many many like Mr. Darling. Or is it Sir Darling? I think he's in the lords now. No doubt a reward for selling out his country and selling out his principles, if he really had any. Danny Alexander received a knighthood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgowmancity Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 wow so it goes down from 17 to 2 and you thing that deserves a thumbs up... how many staff are losing their jobs, will that be a thumbs up from you? No, the thumbs up was showing that there is a higher percentage of new offices in Scotland than there are offices closing. I was using it to illustrate the out & out lie that there was a "closure of a tax office in Cumbernauld so the jobs could be moved to Croydon" Yes I think it's shit that so many offices are being closed, yes I think it's shit that so many people are losing their jobs, yes I think it was shit that HMRC closed all the IREC's last year & yes I think it's shit there will be no tax office north of the Central belt. From a personal point of view it makes my job a lot more difficult as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 Oh dear that is rich coming from you with your unsubstantiated thread on Natalie McGarry where you were using rule Britannia newspapers to try and score points. So, in your mind, the paedophilia didn't happen and it's not truthful ? See that's the difference with the website that you just tried to rubbish is that they back up their claims with proof, proof that you can research yourself, whereas you rely on the establishment media that feeds you any old shoite, shoite that you seem to take in with ease because it suits your warped political thinking. There is no comparison between an MP dodgy accounting practices, "it was resting in my account" ala father ted, which was reported by her fellow female nationalists and the absolutely heinous crime of peadophilia. There has been many accusations but no proof. Tom Watson MP has had to apologise for his finger pointing which has not been proven. It's a disgusting crime and anyone who commits the crime is not human imho so to use it for some political point scoring makes me very uncomfortable and also weakens any investigation and even the crime itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antidote Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 No, the thumbs up was showing that there is a higher percentage of new offices in Scotland than there are offices closing. I was using it to illustrate the out & out lie that there was a "closure of a tax office in Cumbernauld so the jobs could be moved to Croydon" Yes I think it's shit that so many offices are being closed, yes I think it's shit that so many people are losing their jobs, yes I think it was shit that HMRC closed all the IREC's last year & yes I think it's shit there will be no tax office north of the Central belt. From a personal point of view it makes my job a lot more difficult as well. Is there job losses in Scotland's HMRC? Yes. Is there jobs being created in Croydon HMRC? Yes Make your own mind up at what's happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antidote Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 There is no comparison between an MP dodgy accounting practices, "it was resting in my account" ala father ted, which was reported by her fellow female nationalists and the absolutely heinous crime of peadophilia. There has been many accusations but no proof. Tom Watson MP has had to apologise for his finger pointing which has not been proven. It's a disgusting crime and anyone who commits the crime is not human imho so to use it for some political point scoring makes me very uncomfortable and also weakens any investigation and even the crime itself. Is there a crime for dodgy practices? As for accusations of paedophilia-see Labour's Janner, Cyril Smith, to name, but 2. Tom Watson had to apologise for accusing only some of the accused. I do believe you when you say this crime sickens you, but not to talk about it happening at westminster, imo, is just a serious as the crime itself and let's any future perpetrator have a free reign. That's probably why alleged cases have been going on for many years now. Westminster have done nothing about it even though members have been caught or there have been strong rumours. Now what about all the criminals sitting in westminster some on assault convictions, wilful fire raising and of course the ex members who have been jailed. What about Darling's flip flopping his home? The list is quite extensive. This list is very long too. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2697947/Chilling-day-Special-Branch-swooped-seize-ANOTHER-dossier-VIP-abusers-16-MPs-names-mentioned-1984-report-paedophile-lobby-s-influence-Westminster.html http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/margaret-thatcher-knew-paedophile-torys-5669409 http://www.tpuc.org/blair-covering-up-paedophile-scandal/ Your whole comment sounds as though it is apologising for westminster's troubles and you go and accuse someone else of being an apologist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgowmancity Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 Is there job losses in Scotland's HMRC? Yes. Is there jobs being created in Croydon HMRC? Yes Make your own mind up at what's happening. There's a shit load more jobs being lost closer to Croydon than Cumbernauld, but you just ignore all them & choose Cumbernauld being closed as the reason for new jobs in Croydon un####inbelievable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alibi Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 It's been common knowledge for years that bridge was overloaded, had the preventative maintenance schedule been revised to reflect this and the at risk parts would have been changed before they failed. Nonsense. What maintenance do you do to a steel member in a truss? All you can do is paint it. You can't repair something that isn't broken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davierobbsagod Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 I have no option but to drive to edinburgh tomorrow from Aberdeen is the traffic likley to be as bad at the weekend ? I was thinking of driving to Dunblane and then cutting across from there or even driving to Glasgow and cut across from there. I'll be leaving neep city about 9ish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alibi Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 (edited) Alibi an apologist for government mistakes and funding cuts. A scourge on others. No, Alan. I am a chartered civil engineer. I don't claim to be a specialist in the engineering of large suspension bridges but I have sufficient knowledge to comprehend what has happened here, unlike it seems about 99% of the mainstream media. If you had said that the frequency of inspections had been reduced from six monthly to once every 5 years to save money you might have had a valid point, but you didn't (and they weren't). From time to time things break and you need to fix them. Unless the loadings being applied meant that a member was known to be so overstressed that its built in factor of safety had been reduced below an acceptable level (engineering judgement needed for that, not political judgement), and bear in mind that failure theoretically occurs when the factor of safety dips below 1.0, there would be no reason to replace a non-failed component. It's a sort of corollary of "If it ain't broke, don't fix it". The SG has not made any mistakes here, and in fact they appear to have been right in their decision to construct a new, presumably stronger, bridge. They should have been clearer about the reasons for needing another bridge - i was myself slightly critical of their decision at the time as I thought there were more important priorities Incidentally, from where do you think Scotland's funding cuts originate? Wouldn't be Westminster by any chance? Edited December 11, 2015 by Alibi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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