New 5th Tier potentially incoming...

[morrie21]

6 hours ago, N4Footsoldier said:

I don't really have a dog in this race but I find the whole thing to be a fascinating subject.

Effectively Scottish football on a domestic and international stage (save for a few exceptions) has regressed over the past 3 or 4 decades. Realistically the competitive landscape of football has changed over this time as football becomes more widely played and resourced internationally across an increasing number of jurisdictions much larger than the population we have. There are also multiple economic and social factors both domestically and internationally across different generations that also contribute.  There is clearly this competitive angle to be considered, naturally trying to model off of similar sized countries that have continually punched above their weight. Considerable steps have been taken in recent years through youth development in my opinion through Performance Schools etc, but the adaptation of the club and league system will always prove to be a thorny subject. 

Conversely, we have a deep cultural heritage to football and the concept of community-based clubs, old traditional venues and generational stories of supporting your local club, attending the game with your family/father etc etc. However there is no way to restructure the leagues to prioritize competition without jeopardizing the financial viability of the clubs which maintain this cultural heritage. For example we have seen the cost of running B teams, costs of travel for part time clubs, financial outlay of ensuring facilities are up to scratch etc.

So really there is no one size fits all model. I do feel for the SFA when trying to push things like this because there will never be a consensus, and actually I would go as far as crediting them with pulling out a proposal which might only be backed by a maximum of 51% of clubs when there would be crippling side effects for the other 49%.

The SFA deserve zero credit and none of your sympathy for this. They have done absolutely nothing over recent years to progress player development, yet when the ugly sisters of Glasgow pipe up they bend over backwards to accommodate them which resulted in this rushed and poorly thought out proposal.

Mulraney, Maxwell et al are a shower and should be ousted insted of being voted in for future years, as they just were.

I'm sure when this issue returns in 5-6 months time the SFA blazers will be pleased to have your sympathy.  

[vanderark14]

13 hours ago, morrie21 said:

The SFA deserve zero credit and none of your sympathy for this. They have done absolutely nothing over recent years to progress player development, yet when the ugly sisters of Glasgow pipe up they bend over backwards to accommodate them which resulted in this rushed and poorly thought out proposal.

Mulraney, Maxwell et al are a shower and should be ousted insted of being voted in for future years, as they just were.

I'm sure when this issue returns in 5-6 months time the SFA blazers will be pleased to have your sympathy.  

Have you seen their latest debacle, this lot really aren't fit for purpose 

 

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/sport-opinion/opinion-out-of-touch-scottish-football-blazers-must-do-better-after-baffling-decisions-4174839

 

[morrie21]

6 hours ago, vanderark14 said:

Have you seen their latest debacle, this lot really aren't fit for purpose 

 

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/sport-opinion/opinion-out-of-touch-scottish-football-blazers-must-do-better-after-baffling-decisions-4174839

 

Yeah, I noticed that yesterday as I was taking a look at the groups drawn out for the League Cup qualifiers. The administrators of Scottish football are a shambles.

[N4Footsoldier]

On 6/8/2023 at 5:19 PM, morrie21 said:

The SFA deserve zero credit and none of your sympathy for this. They have done absolutely nothing over recent years to progress player development, yet when the ugly sisters of Glasgow pipe up they bend over backwards to accommodate them which resulted in this rushed and poorly thought out proposal.

Mulraney, Maxwell et al are a shower and should be ousted insted of being voted in for future years, as they just were.

I'm sure when this issue returns in 5-6 months time the SFA blazers will be pleased to have your sympathy.  

In fairness, and I suppose it comes down to perspective, Rangers and Celtic are directly responsible for an hugely disproportionate amount of revenue created within the Scottish game. Like it or not, the powers that be will always more heavily weight their input more than a swathe of other members. That is just the sad reality of running a business. I think it's no secret that the SFA are a money making machine, with large amounts of it hoarded internally.

Like I said there are trade offs between finances, internationally competitive football and tradition that will always be working against one another. SFA in a way are damned if they do or damned if they don't.

[vanderark14]

I see the EPL are considering a spending Cap to maintain a competitive balance in the league, interesting.................a league who has concerns about its competitiveness. Its better than the scottish model of "Celtic and Rangers are the biggest and thats just the way it is"

[N4Footsoldier]

1 hour ago, vanderark14 said:

I see the EPL are considering a spending Cap to maintain a competitive balance in the league, interesting.................a league who has concerns about its competitiveness. Its better than the scottish model of "Celtic and Rangers are the biggest and thats just the way it is"

I'm not sure I really see the connection. Especially given I wouldn't call Rangers or Celtic particularly big spenders in the grand scheme of things. An EPL spending cap is probably something like £200m, which might make sense even from a prudence over FPP argument never mind competitive balance. What would you cap for the SPFL be? £5m, £10m? At that scale it's totally arbitrary.

Not sure what the suggested equivalent solution would be. If there was an equivalent demand for clubs other than Rangers or Celtic in terms ability for revenue generation things would be different. But there isn't so they are not.

[vanderark14]

16 minutes ago, N4Footsoldier said:

I'm not sure I really see the connection. Especially given I wouldn't call Rangers or Celtic particularly big spenders in the grand scheme of things. An EPL spending cap is probably something like £200m, which might make sense even from a prudence over FPP argument never mind competitive balance. What would you cap for the SPFL be? £5m, £10m? At that scale it's totally arbitrary.

Not sure what the suggested equivalent solution would be. If there was an equivalent demand for clubs other than Rangers or Celtic in terms ability for revenue generation things would be different. But there isn't so they are not.

I had a quick look online so if this is wrong its down to not spending enough time researching as I don't have the time

This is what the EPL are proposing but have not implemented 

Premier League clubs are considering introducing a spending cap that would "link the amount any club can spend on wages to how much television money is paid to the lowest-placed team." The proposal -- called “anchoring” -- would restrict the top teams to spending, for example, four times the amount the bottom club

Dundee United recieved £1,289,200 in Prize/TV money last season which would mean the max spend on wages could be four times this - £5,156,800

Celtics wage Bill is in the regions of £20,000,000 at the moment. 

 

I am guessing the EPL are proposing this because the financial gap between CL clubs and non CL clubs is about to grow with an expected 33% rise in CL revenue for 2024/25 season. 

 

[EddardStark]

Rangers have withdrawn from the Lowland League. 
 

https://rng.rs/3oWTRdD

Hope we have an alternative lined up. 

Edited June 14, 2023 by EddardStark

[vanderark14]

9 hours ago, EddardStark said:

Rangers have withdrawn from the Lowland League. 
 

https://rng.rs/3oWTRdD

Hope we have an 

Toys out of pram

 

[vanderark14]

That statement is absolute gold, particularly the part where rangers pretend to give a flying fuck about scottish player development and the national team 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[SamP]

1 hour ago, vanderark14 said:

That statement is absolute gold, particularly the part where rangers pretend to give a flying fuck about scottish player development and the national team 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Cynical!!  I have just read it but looks like toys out of the pram stuff.

[Toepoke]

Pretty clear from that statement (as if it wasn't already) that Maxwell and the SFA have been doing Rangers bidding on this proposal. 

 

[SamP]

I am still a believer (maybe naive) that the SFA are impartial.  Yes Rangers and Celtic will have a big say.  But do we really believe that the chairmen/women of the other clubs don't get a say.  If they don't then that is their fault but I don't believe that.  More transparency for the customers i.e. fans should be happening.

[vanderark14]

21 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Pretty clear from that statement (as if it wasn't already) that Maxwell and the SFA have been doing Rangers bidding on this proposal. 

 

 

21 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Pretty clear from that statement (as if it wasn't already) that Maxwell and the SFA have been doing Rangers bidding on this proposal. 

 

this part below is intriguing - which teams are they referring to and how can the cofirm the B Teams were some how responsible for this

Indeed, all 10 teams who contributed most to the development of players for last year’s World Cup have B teams operating in national senior leagues.

 

[vanderark14]

 

The SFA/Rangers don't go into detail on anything, their research seem to be googling which european leagues run B team which some how = better for the national team.

[SamP]

5 minutes ago, vanderark14 said:

 

The SFA/Rangers don't go into detail on anything, their research seem to be googling which european leagues run B team which some how = better for the national team.

So what is your answer to solve this VA?  Something needs to change we are all agreed on that.  As another poster said on here the SFA are damned if they do and damned if they don't.  There is no harm in looking what is happening in other countries.  There is no easy solution but to me the game and our national team, bringing on Scottish kids should be a priority.

[Toepoke]

Just bring back the bloody reserve league! Worked fine for decades.

 

[SamP]

20 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Just bring back the bloody reserve league! Worked fine for decades.

 

Correct

[vanderark14]

22 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Just bring back the bloody reserve league! Worked fine for decades.

 

I don't think this is about the National team, I can't see anything that shows a direct link between the creation of B teams and a better National side. 

I also thought the performance schools were going to the next big thing for the national side

[morrie21]

5 hours ago, Toepoke said:

Pretty clear from that statement (as if it wasn't already) that Maxwell and the SFA have been doing Rangers bidding on this proposal. 

 

Correct. Must of the wording in the Rangers statement here is lifted directly from the document the SFA sent to all the clubs. Lazy in the way the proposal was put together and now lazy in the way Rangers FC have removed their B team from the Lowland League.

The Lowland League would operate better within the pyramid if all the B teams jumped ship as it would then open up for expansion to 18 teams with a two up two down system plus a playoff from the leagues below.

[SamP]

I agree with Maxwell.  All clubs should be involved in the future of Scottish Football.  Lot's of Junior clubs have bigger supports than the like of Livingston.  

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/ian-maxwell-claims-celtic-rangers-30314235