SNP leadership election

[Malcolm]

I’m seeing various twitter chat about bankruptcy… it’s twitter chat though.

[Ally Bongo]

48 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

I am still struggling to understand the over the top push to have humza placed into FM there must be a reason behind it 

Assuming the majority of MSPs/MPs did not know how bad the finances & membership were we can discount wanting Humza to win because he knew where all the bodies were buried and protection

In their eyes it was the best choice of three - Forbes's religious beliefs meant they couldn't support her because of the damage The Greens and the LGBTI+ brigade of the SNP membership would do to them and the party

I see Wings has done a piece on Angus Robertson's Progress Scotland - another Ponzi scheme

[hampden_loon2878]

2 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

Assuming the majority of MSPs/MPs did not know how bad the finances & membership were we can discount wanting Humza to win because he knew where all the bodies were buried and protection

In their eyes it was the best choice of three - Forbes's religious beliefs meant they couldn't support her because of the damage The Greens and the LGBTI+ brigade of the SNP membership would do to them and the party

I see Wings has done a piece on Angus Robertson's Progress Scotland - another Ponzi scheme

Looking extremely grim

[slasher]

Disillusionment is already setting in.

We’ve already fucked it for ourselves, the arguments over whose fault it is are pointless.

We need to accept its over before we can begin to build again.

We need either Alba under Salmond to gain traction or hope someone new comes along on his level.

Above all the infighting has to stop.

Unite the clans or forget it.

The yoons are laughing and confident for the first time I can remember in a long time 😣

[Caledonian Craig]

10 hours ago, mcguffin said:

That article is about how happy people are in Denmark. No mention of GRR. Am I missing something?

Denmark have a GRR bill and have had one for several years. This report stayes how socially welcoming and sense of community the country. Sadly, that must be beyond Scotland and more in particular the UK.

[Malcolm]

30 minutes ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Denmark have a GRR bill and have had one for several years. This report stayes how socially welcoming and sense of community the country. Sadly, that must be beyond Scotland and more in particular the UK.

fine have the GRR….  If it’s meaningless.  But they should revoke the equality act and stop biological men having access to womens spaces.  

Humans born as men are not women - don’t expect the human race to ignore facts.  For example when some trans women want to go around waffling shit about their periods that don’t actually exist for them good luck to them, don’t expect the rest of of us not to believe they are a bunch of crackpots.

 

[phart]

1 hour ago, Malcolm said:

fine have the GRR….  If it’s meaningless.  But they should revoke the equality act and stop biological men having access to womens spaces.  

Humans born as men are not women - don’t expect the human race to ignore facts.  For example when some trans women want to go around waffling shit about their periods that don’t actually exist for them good luck to them, don’t expect the rest of of us not to believe they are a bunch of crackpots.

 

"Don't expect the human race to ignore facts" is perhaps the single funniest lack of awareness statement written here i've read.

That's of course assuming you are here on good faith, which you aren't.

 

[Malcolm]

3 minutes ago, phart said:

"Don't expect the human race to ignore facts" is perhaps the single funniest lack of awareness statement written here i've read.

That's of course assuming you are here on good faith, which you aren't.

 

each to their own.  I have no problem with folk believing what they like - just don’t enforce these views on me.
 

 

[phart]

24 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

each to their own.  I have no problem with folk believing what they like - just don’t enforce these views on me.
 

 

What's specifically do you feel is being enforced on you?

[vanderark14]

29 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

each to their own.  I have no problem with folk believing what they like - just don’t enforce these views on me.
 

 

Who's forcing any of these views on you?

 

[hampden_loon2878]

there cant be any doubt what has happened to our party, it has been sabotaged to a point it will take years to recover, if it ever does @aaid what is your honest assessment of the position we find ourselves in? do you at all feel betrayed by those who were supposed to be trying to gain Scotland her independence?

 

Alba have some rockets in the party however, salmond has given independence supporters another alternative incase something very bad happens to the SNP, he should be commended for that, i still struggle to understand the logic of the SNP 1/2 at the last election, 

[Malcolm]

31 minutes ago, phart said:

What's specifically do you feel is being enforced on you?

 

26 minutes ago, vanderark14 said:

Who's forcing any of these views on you?

 

The equality act and GRR will force people to treat trans women as real women which they are not.  Access to safe spaces. They want to compete in womens sporting events even though they are men,  if it’s born a man it’s a biological man.  You can all carry on calling them what you like.

If the greens and snp have their way it will be a hate crime for calling a trans a man which biologically of course they are. Cant change your chromosomes.

[vanderark14]

4 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

 

The equality act and GRR will force people to treat trans women as real women which they are not.  Access to safe spaces. They want to compete in womens sporting events even though they are men,  if it’s born a man it’s a biological man.  You can all carry on calling them what you like.

If the greens and snp have their way it will be a hate crime for calling a trans a man which biologically of course they are. Cant change your chromosomes.

• Here is an idea - treat them as human beings. 
• What does access to safe spaces mean? Can you elaborate?
• It will be up to each individual sporting body as to whether a trans woman can compete against other woman. I think athletics and Rugby have already seem sense and said they cannot compete against women

 

[mcguffin]

4 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

This report stayes how socially welcoming and sense of community the country. Sadly, that must be beyond Scotland

You may be right. I think though that one of the reasons for the sense of community in Denmark and other Scandinavian countries is that they're independent countries?   (Whether or not they have gender ID laws similar to ours, or whether or not they decide to drop them in a year or two, I suspect Denmark, Finland and the like will remain happy and self-confident peoples).

[PapofGlencoe]

1 hour ago, vanderark14 said:

• Here is an idea - treat them as human beings. 
• What does access to safe spaces mean? Can you elaborate?
• It will be up to each individual sporting body as to whether a trans woman can compete against other woman. I think athletics and Rugby have already seem sense and said they cannot compete against women

 

The second bullet has "the sky is blue, can you elaborate?" vibes to me.

For a start it's already elaborated in your own third point.

And the first hasnt been in contention by anyone serious from day one of this nonsense.

It would appear sports have now got their brains in gear but let's not pretend women have not been unfairly vilified to achieve what's now being touted as common sense.

[PapofGlencoe]

38 minutes ago, mcguffin said:

You may be right. I think though that one of the reasons for the sense of community in Denmark and other Scandinavian countries is that they're independent countries?   (Whether or not they have gender ID laws similar to ours, or whether or not they decide to drop them in a year or two, I suspect Denmark, Finland and the like will remain happy and self-confident peoples).

There are plenty happy and welcoming communities in Scotland and plenty sad and lonely people in Denmark. 

Depsite our grumbles go outside and walk about in a park, go to a concert, go fishing with your pals if we're still allowed.  It's not all doom and gloom here.  I don't think we need characterise it as such.

We saw solidarity during the pandemic in my area of Scotland in deeply meaningful ways.  maybe we don't always shout about it, another trait, but it does exist.

[PapofGlencoe]

3 minutes ago, PapofGlencoe said:

There are plenty happy and welcoming communities in Scotland and plenty sad and lonely people in Denmark. 

Depsite our grumbles go outside and walk about in a park, go to a concert, go fishing with your pals if we're still allowed.  It's not all doom and gloom here.  I don't think we need characterise it as such.

We saw solidarity during the pandemic in my area of Scotland in deeply meaningful ways.  maybe we don't always shout about it, another trait, but it does exist.

On this note have a good day all tambers, it's sunny.  I don't see much ill will really even when we disagree.  I like this board for that reason.

Might be being a bit snarky for a laugh but no badness. When it comes to indy, even on a long game, if the unionists win shortly.. they will be very uneasy governing a country that wants to be at the very least a nation with a strong sense of itself. They will be wrong to equate SNP defeat with us being billy Brits...I fancy they will over reach themselves and piss off Scots in the process.  There will be a second wind, it's just a while away.  Might not be around to see it mind you.

And even if it doesn't, our community will still exist and be as argumentative as ever.. 😃

[Malcolm]

1 hour ago, vanderark14 said:

• Here is an idea - treat them as human beings. 
• What does access to safe spaces mean? Can you elaborate?
• It will be up to each individual sporting body as to whether a trans woman can compete against other woman. I think athletics and Rugby have already seem sense and said they cannot compete against women

 

first bullet - completely agree, trans people should be treated as equally as anyone else. Unqualified agreement.

Second bullet - toilets, prisons, etc, anywhere that says “women only”, it’s not hard.

third bullet - it shouldn’t be.  Women should never have to compete against men.

 

[vanderark14]

19 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

first bullet - completely agree, trans people should be treated as equally as anyone else. Unqualified agreement.

Second bullet - toilets, prisons, etc, anywhere that says “women only”, it’s not hard.

third bullet - it shouldn’t be.  Women should never have to compete against men.

 

So we've established nothing is getting forced upon you. 

Sport is getting its act together and realising its fuck up when it comes to women's sport.

So what exactly is causing you to lose your shit over this bill?

 

[TDYER63]

11 hours ago, slasher said:

Disillusionment is already setting in.

We’ve already fucked it for ourselves, the arguments over whose fault it is are pointless.

We need to accept its over before we can begin to build again.

We need either Alba under Salmond to gain traction or hope someone new comes along on his level.

Above all the infighting has to stop.

Unite the clans or forget it.

The yoons are laughing and confident for the first time I can remember in a long time 😣

Yeah it is looking like this. And you are right, the infighting isn’t helping at all. And I don’t even see most of it as I am not on social media.

However if Alba were to become really relevant then Salmond would need to step aside as the face of the party. Whatever some people’s admiration of him on here he is just not popular enough in Scotland as a whole . At the same time I cannot see who would successfully create another party. 

If the SNP were to disappear,  what decent MP’s or MSP’s get on well enough with Salmond to move to Alba ? This is a genuine question, I do not know how many of them feel towards him. 

If the SNP remained in existence but lost their stronghold, I just cannot see them and Alba working together unfortunately. There is too much ill feeling. 
 

[TDYER63]

27 minutes ago, PapofGlencoe said:

On this note have a good day all tambers, it's sunny.  I don't see much ill will really even when we disagree.  I like this board for that reason.

Might be being a bit snarky for a laugh but no badness. When it comes to indy, even on a long game, if the unionists win shortly.. they will be very uneasy governing a country that wants to be at the very least a nation with a strong sense of itself. They will be wrong to equate SNP defeat with us being billy Brits...I fancy they will over reach themselves and piss off Scots in the process.  There will be a second wind, it's just a while away.  Might not be around to see it mind you.

And even if it doesn't, our community will still exist and be as argumentative as ever.. 😃

‘Like’ button. 

[Orraloon]

 

https://news.stv.tv/politics/tory-msp-stephen-kerr-apologises-after-suggesting-trans-people-have-learning-difficulties

[Malcolm]

7 minutes ago, vanderark14 said:

So we've established nothing is getting forced upon you. 

Sport is getting its act together and realising its fuck up when it comes to women's sport.

So what exactly is causing you to lose your shit over this bill?

 

i don’t agree that men should be able to change their birth certificates to say they were born a sex different to their actual biological sex. It’s just nonsense. I also disagree that young kids should be indoctrinated that trans is a typical way of life. It’s a tiny minority.  It should be respectfully mentioned so kids are aware but in relation to the proportion of the population that live that way.  

appreciate lots of the issues are actually caused by the equality act.  

 

[slasher]

11 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

Yeah it is looking like this. And you are right, the infighting isn’t helping at all. And I don’t even see most of it as I am not on social media.

However if Alba were to become really relevant then Salmond would need to step aside as the face of the party. Whatever some people’s admiration of him on here he is just not popular enough in Scotland as a whole . At the same time I cannot see who would successfully create another party. 

If the SNP were to disappear,  what decent MP’s or MSP’s get on well enough with Salmond to move to Alba ? This is a genuine question, I do not know how many of them feel towards him. 

If the SNP remained in existence but lost their stronghold, I just cannot see them and Alba working together unfortunately. There is too much ill feeling. 
 

I get Alex is a divisive character of course I do. Surely all the stakeholders here see the bigger picture though. Can’t any of them recognise that the prize of indy should come above all else? If they can’t they should get out of politics or join the Labour Party!

[hampden_loon2878]

Who would have believed protest song would be written about clearances being forced onto the highland people by a Scottish government, mental,, good song as weel 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tzW8EYDDE0