Indyref 2 (2)

[hampden_loon2878]

Snp MPS could not be arsed turning up to the Grangemouth closure debate,, it’s unreal how the party have changed, and not for the better 

[Ally Bongo]

40 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Snp MPS could not be arsed turning up to the Grangemouth closure debate,, it’s unreal how the party have changed, and not for the better 

I'm not so sure this is the biggest gotcha it appears to be

There was hardly any cunt there from any parties so what good it would have done i don't know

[mariokempes]

And before any of you consider a vote for the SNP. . Read the latest wingsoverscotland .. and weep. 

 

Utter incompetent gender bender fukwits. 

Apart from that look at the quality of their ministers  ? Fucking astonishing stupidity. 

[Malcolm]

2 hours ago, mariokempes said:

And before any of you consider a vote for the SNP. . Read the latest wingsoverscotland .. and weep. 

 

Utter incompetent gender bender fukwits. 

Apart from that look at the quality of their ministers  ? Fucking astonishing stupidity. 

first word I think of when I think snp.  Incompetence.

[scotlad]

3 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

Newly elected spunkstain Michael Shanks to deliver speech at Scotland in Union's "burns supper" night

This is what the SNP foisted on us and it will be the same with Torquil Crichton and others

I thought Labour didn't believe in 'divisive constitutional politics' (or whatever their current soundbite is), so why send someone to speak at an event set up by a group who are all about constitutional politics? 🤔

Unless he's going to show up and tell them how bad they all are, before getting tore into his haggis, neeps and tatties. 

2 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

I'm not so sure this is the biggest gotcha it appears to be

There was hardly any cunt there from any parties so what good it would have done i don't know

Probably not much in a practical sense, but at least it might have given the impression that they care a jot about the local economy and the people who stand to lose their jobs, let alone the much wider ramifications of Scotland losing its only oil refinery.

[StirlingEgg]

Wonder when the penny will drop for folk now voting Labour in Scotland. 

The guy has already shown himself up by going along with the 'humanitarian pause' nonsense instead of a ceasefire. 

. 

[Hertsscot]

2 hours ago, StirlingEgg said:

Wonder when the penny will drop for folk now voting Labour in Scotland. 

The guy has already shown himself up by going along with the 'humanitarian pause' nonsense instead of a ceasefire. 

. 

Starmer's only real attraction is he's not leader of the Conservative Party tho' in times past he might have been a good fit. He lacks the personal charisma of Blair, appears to have few principles and certainly hasn't the vision or boldness to tackle Basketcase Britain and bring about the transformation the UK needs.

 

[StirlingEgg]

1 hour ago, Hertsscot said:

Starmer's only real attraction is he's not leader of the Conservative Party tho' in times past he might have been a good fit. He lacks the personal charisma of Blair, appears to have few principles and certainly hasn't the vision or boldness to tackle Basketcase Britain and bring about the transformation the UK needs.

 

Starmer turned out to be quite a disappointment overall. He's clearly preferable to the wee miserly scrote that is Sunak but thought he'd be more thorough or get right to the point, particularly in the likes of PMQs. Maybe as Director of Public Prosecutions he was in a more reactionary role. Now he has to be proactive balanced with reacting to issues too. The gutter press are always snapping at his heels so it's more like he's trying to manage them rather than the interests of the rest of us. 

Ps in the prev post I meant the Labour guy that won the Rutherglen seat! If he just goes along with Labour down South then will folk realise it was a pointless swing?.. 

Edited January 11 by StirlingEgg

[Ally Bongo]

24 minutes ago, StirlingEgg said:

 

Ps in the prev post I meant the Labour guy that won the Rutherglen seat! If he just goes along with Labour down South then will folk realise it was a pointless swing?.. 

The problem is that Swanks won the seat due to the SNP vote staying at home and not because of any upsurge in Labour votes

So basically those that have always voted Labour will still vote Labour regardless - along with tactical Unionists

If there was another by-election in Rutherglen tomorrow the same folk that voted for him will vote for him again

 

Edited January 11 by Ally Bongo

[StirlingEgg]

12 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

The problem is that Swanks won the seat due to the SNP vote staying at home and not because of any upsurge in Labour votes

So basically those that have always voted Labour will still vote Labour regardless - along with tactical Unionists

If there was another by-election in Rutherglen tomorrow the same folk that voted for him will vote for him again

 

Do you think it could go back the other way again in a 'normal' election? It's just the way it was portrayed as though Labour were making a comeback in Scotland. 

On another note, we should start referring to things differently to get a message across. We've been caught out before with words or terms getting twisted or misused eg Once in a Generation and the Scottish Nationalist Party. Perhaps refer to the block grant as our Partial Tax Rebate and our budget/spending on areas like health as UK Influenced Budget or something. The UK Diminishing Factor...

[Ally Bongo]

42 minutes ago, StirlingEgg said:

Do you think it could go back the other way again in a 'normal' election? It's just the way it was portrayed as though Labour were making a comeback in Scotland. 

On another note, we should start referring to things differently to get a message across. We've been caught out before with words or terms getting twisted or misused eg Once in a Generation and the Scottish Nationalist Party. Perhaps refer to the block grant as our Partial Tax Rebate and our budget/spending on areas like health as UK Influenced Budget or something. The UK Diminishing Factor...

The way it's looking is that the SNP are not doing anything to make those that stayed at home to go out and vote for them

If anything it's getting worse with one crisis leading to another

example - Humza spending a large chunk of FMQ's answering questions about the post office scandal when he should be emphasising that it has fuck all to do with the Scottish Government as the Post Office is reserved and highlight the folly of unionism considering Scots Law and English Law

But not Humza - he wants the Union to sort it out

He is allowing British Labour to lump the SNP in with the Tories

The SNP are far too defensive and despite calls for them to change and be more populist, like your suggestions, they double down

Edited January 11 by Ally Bongo

[StirlingEgg]

23 minutes ago, Ally Bongo said:

The way it's looking is that the SNP are not doing anything to make those that stayed at home to go out and vote for them

If anything it's getting worse with one crisis leading to another

example - Humza spending a large chunk of FMQ's answering questions about the post office scandal when he should be emphasising that it has fuck all to do with the Scottish Government as the Post Office is reserved and highlight the folly of unionism considering Scots Law and English Law

But not Humza - he wants the Union to sort it out

He is allowing British Labour to lump the SNP in with the Tories

The SNP are far too defensive and despite calls for them to change and be more populist, like your suggestions, they double down

I see what you mean but it's difficult to get out of that defensive trap when they are on the attack all the time. It looks evasive and feeds into the "blaming Westminster for all our problems" narrative (even though WM are very much relevant at the very least to all manner of ongoing issues). You'd think it would be obvious that this scandal has heehaw to do with the Scottish govt but as always it's a bit of a bandwagon going round in circles with everyone now chipping in with "something must be done!". 

I heard a govt guy on the radio yesterday say something about the mass quashing of convictions & worried  about folk getting exonerated who were actually guilty. Ffs the genuinely guilty have been pretty much exonerated for the last 20 odd years. What a brass neck. 

[Alibi]

5 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

The way it's looking is that the SNP are not doing anything to make those that stayed at home to go out and vote for them

If anything it's getting worse with one crisis leading to another

example - Humza spending a large chunk of FMQ's answering questions about the post office scandal when he should be emphasising that it has fuck all to do with the Scottish Government as the Post Office is reserved and highlight the folly of unionism considering Scots Law and English Law

But not Humza - he wants the Union to sort it out

He is allowing British Labour to lump the SNP in with the Tories

The SNP are far too defensive and despite calls for them to change and be more populist, like your suggestions, they double down

Spot on.  Yousaf is utterly hopeless.  No leadership qualities at all.  We needed a strong leader and we got that loser.  he has no strategic vision.  Sleepwalking into an electoral gubbing and hasn't got the nous to attack Labour on the numerous points of weakness (they are pro-brexit ffs, as well as anti indy and anti referendum), to get some momentum going.  He just creates apathy, and we need better than that.

[hampden_loon2878]

Ian blackfords some boy  🤣 

Edited January 12 by hampden_loon2878

[Ally Bongo]

38 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Ian blackfords some boy  🤣 

What's he done apart from trot out the neocon lines ?

[Ally Bongo]

Humza's election pitch is soul destroying

[hampden_loon2878]

14 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

What's he done apart from trot out the neocon lines ?

It will all come out in the wash by the look of it. Nea a goood look from what av heard, maybe just a rumour

[TDYER63]

On 1/9/2024 at 8:52 PM, StirlingEgg said:

I find their emails quite informative but it's that contradiction, one of many, with Scotland’s politics where straightforward answers are demanded of complex issues. Therefore not enough folk read up on the context or any background to proposals or issues noted by the likes of Believe in Scotland. Proposals are all they can be regardless of whether coming from SNP, Alba or whoever. 

Not sure if it was Ally or Alibi but someone said something about the SNP being split 50/50 which is maybe a reflection of Scotland too. Those demanding answers and others demanding action; neither of which can be met within current UK framework. 

You can take an arse to the toilet but you can't make it shit! 

I think their info is fairly easy to absorb and presented in a way that catches the eye, people will just not read screeds of pages of white paper type jargon . And the fact they are not a political party means they will not be automatically discounted by anti SNP/ Alba people.

If people are looking for a cast iron proven document that independence will bring them riches galore then we may as well give up now as you need to be able to put something into practice before proving its worth. All you can do is present them with facts on Scotlands potential and hope that more than 50% have the ability to recognise this and the desire to go for it. Everything new in life comes with a degree of risk , risk is what creates progress. People of Scotland can either stick in this Union which, without any shadow of a doubt, has moved backwards , or they move onwards and upwards. 

As you say, you can take the arse to the toilet but you cant make it shit. 

[TDYER63]

21 hours ago, Ally Bongo said:

Humza's election pitch is soul destroying

I really find him so insincere. I have posted above about people needing to see the potential for Scotland but I feel that Humza will never encourage people, merely by way of his delivery. If he cant enthuse people who are already won over then there is not a hope in hell of him bringing over anyone who is undecided.
It might just be me though . 

[TDYER63]

10 hours ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

It will all come out in the wash by the look of it. Nea a goood look from what av heard, maybe just a rumour

Loon, anyone could put out stuff like this. 

Oh that Alex Salmond is some boy. It will come out in wash by the look of it. 

It did. And he was innocent.

[Ally Bongo]

26 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

I really find him so insincere. I have posted above about people needing to see the potential for Scotland but I feel that Humza will never encourage people, merely by way of his delivery. If he cant enthuse people who are already won over then there is not a hope in hell of him bringing over anyone who is undecided.
It might just be me though . 

It isnt and probably why Aaid has given up defending the indefensible

[scotlad]

On 1/12/2024 at 1:29 PM, Ally Bongo said:

Humza's election pitch is soul destroying

I had hoped it might be a bit more radical than "kiCk tHe tOriEs OUt!". That doesn't inspire me, and I'm about as firm a Yes voter as anyone, so like TDyer says, I can't see it inspiring anyone who's on the fence. File under 'Disappointed but not surprised'.

If you're a voter and all you're interested in is getting the Tories out of power at WM, then voting Labour is the best way to do that. The SNP should stand for more than that. Actually, they should stand for something else altogether.

I'll be voting SNP, but if I didn't have a good candidate to vote for I might seriously be considering just sitting this one out.

[hampden_loon2878]

10 hours ago, TDYER63 said:

Loon, anyone could put out stuff like this. 

Oh that Alex Salmond is some boy. It will come out in wash by the look of it. 

It did. And he was innocent.

Aye, yer maybe right. Had a wee dram when my mate from Skye messaged me regarding him and got a bit ahead of myself a posted, shite you can’t delete posts now 🙈. But I will say, he’s all about Ian and the “rumours” reinforce that.him and sturgo will go down as the two who sunk independence,  just type into twitters as it’s now circulating on there. 

[Ally Bongo]

[Hertsscot]

5 hours ago, scotlad said:

I had hoped it might be a bit more radical than "kiCk tHe tOriEs OUt!". That doesn't inspire me, and I'm about as firm a Yes voter as anyone, so like TDyer says, I can't see it inspiring anyone who's on the fence. File under 'Disappointed but not surprised'.

If you're a voter and all you're interested in is getting the Tories out of power at WM, then voting Labour is the best way to do that. The SNP should stand for more than that. 

Agreed. I used to get fed up with people chanting that sort of stuff at AUOB marches. We know what the Tories are and don't expect anything from them. It's Labour who have disappointed in the past and will continue to do so. We need out of an unequal union, not a slightly less worse version of the same.