Indyref 2 (2)

[Hertsscot]

47 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

I cant and i wont vote SNP at the next election,, as a member it is a hard thing to do however i honestly 100% believe that thumping at the next election is the best thing not only for the SNP, but for independence in the long run,, the worst thing possible would be for the result to be just good enough to keep the idiots in charge of the party,, sturgeon and her legacy eh?

Can I just ask why, if you're so disillusioned with the SNP, that you're still a member? Would it not be better to resign and explain why you're not going to vote for them?

44 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

remember when i was getting a bit of stick for saying the trans bullshit would not be forgotten about in a few weeks? another one to mark off my list as being on the money,, next one will be labours resurgence that i called when they were polling at 2 seats

I agree the SNP have been very naive about trans issues and how they've been weaponised. However I don't think there's any resurgence in Labour's popularity. If they win more seats in the UK it won't be because of any great love of Starmer. Here in Scotland, Labour (who only pretend to be Scotland's friends) will only benefit from voter apathy and the SNP not getting the vote out. Having said that there was a report last week that Labour still hadn't got a candidate for a third of Scottish seats! Personally I've yet to meet anyone who's told me they're switching from SNP to Labour.

[StirlingEgg]

I don’t understand the logic or reasoning behind "only if the SNP get a thumping" or "they need to be annihilated to have a clearout". It baffles me as much as "Christ died for our sins" though that's a very different discussion! There is no lesson that can be learned where some independence phoenix will be allowed to rise. The UK govt, British State and right wing press would ensure that independence and possibly even the Scottish parliament would be stamped down or very much diminished.

I ended up on some 2014 thread on here last night where there was a post referendum quote from Alan Little about all the doom threatened by the No side. It's inarguably turned out worse that those threats by remaining in the Union. We should be highlighting that and the prospect of more damaging Tories returning after Labour. 

[vanderark14]

Just now, StirlingEgg said:

I don’t understand the logic or reasoning behind "only if the SNP get a thumping" or "they need to be annihilated to have a clearout". It baffles me as much as "Christ died for our sins" though that's a very different discussion! There is no lesson that can be learned where some independence phoenix will be allowed to rise. The UK govt, British State and right wing press would ensure that independence and possibly even the Scottish parliament would be stamped down or very much diminished.

I ended up on some 2014 thread on here last night where there was a post referendum quote from Alan Little about all the doom threatened by the No side. It's inarguably turned out worse that those threats by remaining in the Union. We should be highlighting that and the prospect of more damaging Tories returning after Labour. 

Couldn't agree more with this.

 

[Caledonian Craig]

1 hour ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

I cant and i wont vote SNP at the next election,, as a member it is a hard thing to do however i honestly 100% believe that thumping at the next election is the best thing not only for the SNP, but for independence in the long run,, the worst thing possible would be for the result to be just good enough to keep the idiots in charge of the party,, sturgeon and her legacy eh?

Utter tosh.

A thumping for the SNP is a thumping for independence hopes and gives even less credibility to those of us who ache, crave and desire Scottish independence every day of our lives. 

If you actually believe what you are posting resign your membership as that sends a bigger message to the SNP otherwise you are no more than a snake in the grass. Do as your hero did and resign and become a fully fledged member of Alba.

I am happy with voting SNP as it prevents me being a supporter of this sham of a union. If you are happy voting for a unionist party and are not voting for a pro-independence party (at the very least) then you have no place on this thread.

I know the SNP has problems but you stick with it. The other option - knuckle under to your unionist masters.

[vanderark14]

This thread really does mirror scotland for the last 300 years. 

 build a huge platform for independence (2014) and then start in fighting and blow the chances to smithereens 

 

[TDYER63]

12 hours ago, Malcolm said:

independence was the only policy that the snp had that remotely interested me and was why I previously voted for them.  Now they have removed it and lurched to the far left I have no reason to consider voting for them.  As I said numerous times my ideal party would be a right wing nationalist party that was pro European  but it doesn’t exist.

Well it looks like the 2014 vote did you a favour as Alex Salmond would have disappointed anyone who was looking for a right wing government. You crack on with the Tories and Reform Uk 👍

[TDYER63]

2 hours ago, StirlingEgg said:

I don’t understand the logic or reasoning behind "only if the SNP get a thumping" or "they need to be annihilated to have a clearout". It baffles me as much as "Christ died for our sins" though that's a very different discussion! There is no lesson that can be learned where some independence phoenix will be allowed to rise. The UK govt, British State and right wing press would ensure that independence and possibly even the Scottish parliament would be stamped down or very much diminished.

I ended up on some 2014 thread on here last night where there was a post referendum quote from Alan Little about all the doom threatened by the No side. It's inarguably turned out worse that those threats by remaining in the Union. We should be highlighting that and the prospect of more damaging Tories returning after Labour. 

It’s more than just those ‘Nicola supporters’ that are blinded by partisanship. 

[TDYER63]

The worst thing any independence supporter could do is not vote at all. If you dont want to vote SNP then vote Alba , anything that still reflects the desire for independence. The greens are too vague , voting for them would never be seen as a definite vote for independence. 
A decent swing to Alba would give the SNP a boot up the arse without it looking like the desire for independence is gone. AS would make sure of that , he is hardly a shrinking violet. 

[Orraloon]

1 minute ago, TDYER63 said:

The worst thing any independence supporter could do is not vote at all. If you dont want to vote SNP then vote Alba , anything that still reflects the desire for independence. The greens are too vague , voting for them would never be seen as a definite vote for independence. 
A decent swing to Alba would give the SNP a boot up the arse without it looking like the desire for independence is gone. AS would make sure of that , he is hardly a shrinking violet. 

I'm not sure too many folk will have that option.

[hampden_loon2878]

2 hours ago, Hertsscot said:

Can I just ask why, if you're so disillusioned with the SNP, that you're still a member? Would it not be better to resign and explain why you're not going to vote for them?

I agree the SNP have been very naive about trans issues and how they've been weaponised. However I don't think there's any resurgence in Labour's popularity. If they win more seats in the UK it won't be because of any great love of Starmer. Here in Scotland, Labour (who only pretend to be Scotland's friends) will only benefit from voter apathy and the SNP not getting the vote out. Having said that there was a report last week that Labour still hadn't got a candidate for a third of Scottish seats! Personally I've yet to meet anyone who's told me they're switching from SNP to Labour.

I will not resign as i believe in independence, when the shit truly hits the fan after the fourth coming GE,, those of us who have not used the snp to further some ideological policies need to be there to build the party back up,, i also believe the party has been compromised and influenced towards policies that hurt the party and independence,, i have been right about pretty much everything since salmond stepped down, and i am right about this

[hampden_loon2878]

2 hours ago, Caledonian Craig said:

Utter tosh.

A thumping for the SNP is a thumping for independence hopes and gives even less credibility to those of us who ache, crave and desire Scottish independence every day of our lives. 

If you actually believe what you are posting resign your membership as that sends a bigger message to the SNP otherwise you are no more than a snake in the grass. Do as your hero did and resign and become a fully fledged member of Alba.

I am happy with voting SNP as it prevents me being a supporter of this sham of a union. If you are happy voting for a unionist party and are not voting for a pro-independence party (at the very least) then you have no place on this thread.

I know the SNP has problems but you stick with it. The other option - knuckle under to your unionist masters.

no i will not resign as i believe that plays into the hands of those in the party who have driven the party down the wrong path,, there are sinister forces at work within the party, make no mistake on that,, again, i have been correct on pretty much everything since 2014,,i am not alone in thinking this, some very senior figures of the party are now coming to this conclusion,, sometimes a step back to go forward is required

[hampden_loon2878]

2 hours ago, vanderark14 said:

This thread really does mirror scotland for the last 300 years. 

 build a huge platform for independence (2014) and then start in fighting and blow the chances to smithereens 

 

its been sabotaged pal, absolutely no question about it

[hampden_loon2878]

14 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

The worst thing any independence supporter could do is not vote at all. If you dont want to vote SNP then vote Alba , anything that still reflects the desire for independence. The greens are too vague , voting for them would never be seen as a definite vote for independence. 
A decent swing to Alba would give the SNP a boot up the arse without it looking like the desire for independence is gone. AS would make sure of that , he is hardly a shrinking violet. 

if alba stand in my area they will get my vote, 

[TDYER63]

8 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

I'm not sure too many folk will have that option.

Fair point, have they announced how many candidates they are putting up and where? 

[TDYER63]

2 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

if alba stand in my area they will get my vote, 

I think like some others that you should resign. That sends a much bigger signal than pretending to support them then not voting for them. There is nothing stopping you rejoining the party to reshape it. 
You would be able to say ‘ I told you so’. Remaining in the party looks like you are sitting on the fence . 

[hampden_loon2878]

1 hour ago, TDYER63 said:

I think like some others that you should resign. That sends a much bigger signal than pretending to support them then not voting for them. There is nothing stopping you rejoining the party to reshape it. 
You would be able to say ‘ I told you so’. Remaining in the party looks like you are sitting on the fence . 

Dont take this the wrong way, but no one on here is in a position to advise either way, i have my reasons and i believe i will be proven right again,, i knew a lad who resigned in the heat of the moment after Forbes resigned, he tried to join right awa after realizing he made a mistake, thats him now rejoined after a year of battling to get back in

[Orraloon]

1 hour ago, TDYER63 said:

I think like some others that you should resign. That sends a much bigger signal than pretending to support them then not voting for them. There is nothing stopping you rejoining the party to reshape it. 
You would be able to say ‘ I told you so’. Remaining in the party looks like you are sitting on the fence . 

I don't. That just crazy talk. You can't change the party from the outside. You have to be in the party to have any chance of changing their policies. 

[Orraloon]

3 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Dont take this the wrong way, but no one on here is in a position to advise either way, i have my reasons and i believe i will be proven right again,, i knew a lad who resigned in the heat of the moment after Forbes resigned, he tried to join right awa after realizing he made a mistake, thats him now rejoined after a year of battling to get back in

I'm in total agreement with this. I don't pay much attention to folk, who are not even party members, whinging about who the leader is, and what the SNP policies should or shouldn't be. It is quite rightly down to members of the party to decide on these things. You can't influence these things if you don't even have a vote. If you are inside the party at least you can have a wee bit of influence, even if it does seem like you are banging your head against a brick wall at times. 

[hampden_loon2878]

13 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Dont take this the wrong way, but no one on here is in a position to advise either way, i have my reasons and i believe i will be proven right again,, i knew a lad who resigned in the heat of the moment after Forbes resigned, he tried to join right awa after realizing he made a mistake, thats him now rejoined after a year of battling to get back in

meant to say Forbes lost ###

[TDYER63]

11 minutes ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

Dont take this the wrong way, but no one on here is in a position to advise either way, i have my reasons and i believe i will be proven right again,, i knew a lad who resigned in the heat of the moment after Forbes resigned, he tried to join right awa after realizing he made a mistake, thats him now rejoined after a year of battling to get back in

No offence taken, you have your reasons. I just personally dont think it makes any sense to be a member of a party and vote for another party. Some may say that is more than a little strange. 

 

11 minutes ago, Orraloon said:

I don't. That just crazy talk. You can't change the party from the outside. You have to be in the party to have any chance of changing their policies. 

How is that change going so far ? What changes have been influenced? 

[Hertsscot]

1 hour ago, hampden_loon2878 said:

I will not resign as i believe in independence, when the shit truly hits the fan after the fourth coming GE,, those of us who have not used the snp to further some ideological policies need to be there to build the party back up,, i also believe the party has been compromised and influenced towards policies that hurt the party and independence,, i have been right about pretty much everything since salmond stepped down, and i am right about this

Thanks for taking the time to reply. The party has obviously lost a lot of members, something that I had hoped those higher up would have been concerned about. I don't know how many bothered to give reasons when they resigned. You'd think that people would want to know!

Edited April 2 by Hertsscot

[Orraloon]

7 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

No offence taken, you have your reasons. I just personally dont think it makes any sense to be a member of a party and vote for another party. Some may say that is more than a little strange. 

 

How is that change going so far ? What changes have been influenced? 

You can't change things if you don't try. 

[TDYER63]

1 minute ago, Orraloon said:

You can't change things if you don't try. 

I agree. That is why I am still in the party and why I go to every bloody meeting no matter how frustrating it is and deliver shed loads of leaflets that may or may not make a blind bit of difference. I have recently delivered tons of YES ‘independence ‘ leaflets for the SNP , despite what some folk might think there is actually some action on independence. I voted for Kate Forbes , probably the only active person in my branch who did. I was as pissed off as the next person when she didn’t win and bloody raging at the open support Humza was given by MP’s and MSP’s. 

However,  if I was so disenchanted with everything to the point I intended voting for another party at the election I would resign and I would make it very clear why. 

[Orraloon]

13 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

I agree. That is why I am still in the party and why I go to every bloody meeting no matter how frustrating it is and deliver shed loads of leaflets that may or may not make a blind bit of difference. I have recently delivered tons of YES ‘independence ‘ leaflets for the SNP , despite what some folk might think there is actually some action on independence. I voted for Kate Forbes , probably the only active person in my branch who did. I was as pissed off as the next person when she didn’t win and bloody raging at the open support Humza was given by MP’s and MSP’s. 

However,  if I was so disenchanted with everything to the point I intended voting for another party at the election I would resign and I would make it very clear why. 

You should get your name down as a candidate for the next local government elections. Only 3 years away. Get your interest known early.

[Grim Jim]

I second that.   You seem to have your head screwed on.

You'll want to delete all your old harvesting posts though before the press dig those up.