RenfrewBlue Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Banning people for life from all football matches sounds fine in principle, but how do they do it in practice? Without having some incredibly sophisticated system, how can every club/ground know who is on the banned list?This is the problem. If there's no deterrent then folk won't stop.If they can be identified to be banned then why not a personal fine. If you were hit with a £1000 fine for setting off these things then I think you'd stop after getting caught once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TartanJon Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Banning people for life from all football matches sounds fine in principle, but how do they do it in practice? Without having some incredibly sophisticated system, how can every club/ground know who is on the banned list? It does work,kinda.tHe system they use is knowledge of who is on the banned list and cctv in the grounds.I suppose if you wanted to go dressed in a blonde wig and false tits then you might get away with it,and possibly pumped in the bogs at half time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalgety Bay TA Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Never done TITP - but Reading and Glastonbury and numerous others; never seen anything. Mainly because, a bit of dry ice aside on stage - you wouldn't be able to see the gig. Why pay £150 to go to see your favourite band headline and you can;t see them because some twat has been to an Army and Navy surplus store? Not saying what I say because it sounds good at all. Saying it because I believe that in certain cases it could cause an issue - in a venue that is not policed/stewarded well or it's very busy, or there are also strobe lighting and it's disorientating. There were deaths in Spain about 2 years ago when some kids died at a venue when a flare was set off and they stampeded for the only exit. Poor H&S in place made it worse, but people do panic. By your tone, are you suggesting pyros in the crowd at a football or concert are a good thing? Just asking. You have never seen pyro at Glastonbury? Really?! Go and watch Chemical Bros set from last year on iPlayer. You are also exaggerating a fair bit to try and get your point across when you say you "won't be able to see the gig". These things last at most 30 secs to 2 mins for smoke bombs, even the smoke bombs cover a smallish area, they really don't stop you seeing a 90 minute set now do they? I don't mind them at either football or concerts, they don't bother me as much as they seem to bother others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jagtag Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 This is the problem. If there's no deterrent then folk won't stop. If they can be identified to be banned then why not a personal fine. If you were hit with a £1000 fine for setting off these things then I think you'd stop after getting caught once. I see that Celtic are considering a civil action against certain fans to pay any fines imposed by uefa over the fans in questions behaviour. The 2 who have been handed bans could also be forking out around ten grand and costs. That would be funny. They wouldn't think it was so clever then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenfrewBlue Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I see that Celtic are considering a civil action against certain fans to pay any fines imposed by uefa over the fans in questions behaviour. The 2 who have been handed bans could also be forking out around ten grand and costs. That would be funny. They wouldn't think it was so clever then. Well done Celtic then. Although if the law was tight enough they wouldn't have to pursue a civil action. It'd be better if the Police were the ones taking action but at least this way the idiots will be properly punished. I think it will only take a few of these to get the nonsense stopped. I don't understand the "it creates atmosphere" pish. It doesn't. Atmosphere is created by the crowd noise. A bit of smoke just pisses folk off as they find it difficult to see the event they've paid a fortune to go and watch. If you want flares and smoke bombs then bog off to Greece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbcmfc Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 It does work,kinda.tHe system they use is knowledge of who is on the banned list and cctv in the grounds.I suppose if you wanted to go dressed in a blonde wig and false tits then you might get away with it,and possibly pumped in the bogs at half time. I think it depends. If they've banned you because you're a real bad bassard they might make some effort to identify you and keep you out. If they ban you just to make an example of someone to pacify some authority (SFA, police or whatever), then they don't really care whether the ban is effective or not. As long as they are seen to be doing something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirk Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 It canny be that hard to wade into the croud and pick up the idiot with the flare/smoke bomb, arrest the knob and then fine him £2000 for his troubles. will soon stop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil r Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Aye but its pyoor atmosphere an' that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jagtag Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I don't understand the "it creates atmosphere" pish. Aye, it does for people with such a low brain cell count that they get amused by simple things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mox Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I would suggest that most of the people who don't like pyro, smoke bombs, ultras, singing sections etc are all the old khunts who had their fun in the 60's 70's and 80's when it was a free for all. You could get a carry out, take it to the game, you could buy fags and smoke them in the ground, you could stand for 90 minutes in stadiums that were full and you would pay almost all for the enjoyment. My Generation (born 1985) and after have been going to a diluted version of the football that you guys enjoyed 20/30 years ago. The atmosphere in scottish football has been tragic since I really started going to games regularly 15 years ago, aye there is odd game here and there thats great but in reality people go, sit for 90 minutes and go home. The stadiums are empty which is as a result of high ticket prices, terrible kick off times and over the top policing. As a result of this, a lot of the young working class football fans that go to games now are interested in pyro's, smoke bombs and singing sections because they want the game to be an experience. You can't even go to an away game without the fear of the police jumping on the bus and taking away your carry out, every aspect of your journey is monitored and frankly it's unfair. The movement towards a european style of supporting is nothing but a positive as far as I'm concerned. More Pyro, less old old codgers greeting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil r Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 (edited) Ooooooh yeah. You da man Mox. Pwopa naughty. Edited January 20, 2016 by neil r Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toll Bridge TA Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 To argue that smoke grenades don't add to the atmosphere is very debatable. In the area they are set off they do seem to get everyone going, add a bit of colour and improve the visual spectacle. Especially when you see games on the continent in the ultras sections and tifo etc. You only have to youtube some of the games in Sweden which look amazing. Night and day compared to the atmosphere on these shores. The show on the pitch is obviously the most important thing. But fans experience shouldn't be ignored. Football is tribal FFS. Otherwise nobody would shout or sing, and we would all sit there like we were at the cinema. Obviously they aren't for everyone though so having designated areas for the "ultras" or pyro merchants should be the way forward. Then the boring farts who want to sit on their arses the whole game and get annoyed at a Wee bit of smoke for 30secs won't be calling for £1000's worth of fines. Just adds to another long list of things that are deemed too dangerous for the football in this country. Safe standing- too dangerous apparently. Even though it's perfectly fine in Germany etc. (Look forward to seeing how it goes at Celtic Park and if other clubs will follow suit). No drink allowed in the concourse. Even though in England, which has had worse hooligans problems than us, it's completely fine. No swearing- you'll hurt the kids' ears. No smoke grenades- it may cause a mass panic in an outdoor arena and cause multiple respiratory attacks. Even though at much more crowded concerts and festivals like TITP they haven't done so. (Can I also add that I think these smoke grenades use cold burning technology and cause no external flame. So unlike flares they will not cause burns). Other countries in Europe have embraced the whole ultras and tifos thing. Gave them designated areas. Allowed them to let off their smokes grenades, shout and make noise for the whole game. Allow folk to have a beer at the game. Have fan experience in mind. Stadiums are full. The game is thriving. The game is dying in this country. However, all the authorities & police seem to have in mind is to bring in facial recognition equipment to arrest and ban a bunch of young lads for letting of some smoke grenades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toll Bridge TA Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I would suggest that most of the people who don't like pyro, smoke bombs, ultras, singing sections etc are all the old khunts who had their fun in the 60's 70's and 80's when it was a free for all. You could get a carry out, take it to the game, you could buy fags and smoke them in the ground, you could stand for 90 minutes in stadiums that were full and you would pay almost ###### all for the enjoyment. My Generation (born 1985) and after have been going to a diluted version of the football that you guys enjoyed 20/30 years ago. The atmosphere in scottish football has been tragic since I really started going to games regularly 15 years ago, aye there is odd game here and there thats great but in reality people go, sit for 90 minutes and go home. The stadiums are empty which is as a result of high ticket prices, terrible kick off times and over the top policing. As a result of this, a lot of the young working class football fans that go to games now are interested in pyro's, smoke bombs and singing sections because they want the game to be an experience. You can't even go to an away game without the fear of the police jumping on the bus and taking away your carry out, every aspect of your journey is monitored and frankly it's unfair. The movement towards a european style of supporting is nothing but a positive as far as I'm concerned. More Pyro, less old old codgers greeting. Good post lad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wembley67lisbon Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Good post mox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mox Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Ooooooh yeah. You da man Mox. Pwopa naughty. haha, right on time to reinforce my point. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rossy Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I would suggest that most of the people who don't like pyro, smoke bombs, ultras, singing sections etc are all the old khunts who had their fun in the 60's 70's and 80's when it was a free for all. You could get a carry out, take it to the game, you could buy fags and smoke them in the ground, you could stand for 90 minutes in stadiums that were full and you would pay almost ###### all for the enjoyment. My Generation (born 1985) and after have been going to a diluted version of the football that you guys enjoyed 20/30 years ago. The atmosphere in scottish football has been tragic since I really started going to games regularly 15 years ago, aye there is odd game here and there thats great but in reality people go, sit for 90 minutes and go home. The stadiums are empty which is as a result of high ticket prices, terrible kick off times and over the top policing. As a result of this, a lot of the young working class football fans that go to games now are interested in pyro's, smoke bombs and singing sections because they want the game to be an experience. You can't even go to an away game without the fear of the police jumping on the bus and taking away your carry out, every aspect of your journey is monitored and frankly it's unfair. The movement towards a european style of supporting is nothing but a positive as far as I'm concerned. More Pyro, less old old codgers greeting. Utter guff. A few kids are influenced by European football on TV, and they think they're special because they set off a smoke bomb or two. No surprise that it involves Celtic fans, who love to copy 'trends' and love to be victims when they're told that they're actually ####in idiots. Football is generally shite in this country because it's been killed by financial inequality and live TV. Setting off a flare and trying to be a martyr doesn't make the slightest bit of difference. I can't wait for the next European trend to arrive so Celtic fans can copy it. Let's hope it involves sticking your heads up each others arses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringo Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Utter guff. A few kids are influenced by European football on TV, and they think they're special because they set off a smoke bomb or two. No surprise that it involves Celtic fans, who love to copy 'trends' and love to be victims when they're told that they're actually ####in idiots. Football is generally shite in this country because it's been killed by financial inequality and live TV. Setting off a flare and trying to be a martyr doesn't make the slightest bit of difference. I can't wait for the next European trend to arrive so Celtic fans can copy it. Let's hope it involves sticking your heads up each others arses. Not often I say this, but I agree with Rossy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rossy Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 (edited) Not often I say this, but I agree with Rossy. I feel the love brother. Edit : I mean, I feel the love...brother. That's better... Edited January 20, 2016 by Rossy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TartanJon Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I would suggest that most of the people who don't like pyro, smoke bombs, ultras, singing sections etc are all the old khunts who had their fun in the 60's 70's and 80's when it was a free for all. You could get a carry out, take it to the game, you could buy fags and smoke them in the ground, you could stand for 90 minutes in stadiums that were full and you would pay almost ###### all for the enjoyment. My Generation (born 1985) and after have been going to a diluted version of the football that you guys enjoyed 20/30 years ago. The atmosphere in scottish football has been tragic since I really started going to games regularly 15 years ago, aye there is odd game here and there thats great but in reality people go, sit for 90 minutes and go home. The stadiums are empty which is as a result of high ticket prices, terrible kick off times and over the top policing. As a result of this, a lot of the young working class football fans that go to games now are interested in pyro's, smoke bombs and singing sections because they want the game to be an experience. You can't even go to an away game without the fear of the police jumping on the bus and taking away your carry out, every aspect of your journey is monitored and frankly it's unfair. The movement towards a european style of supporting is nothing but a positive as far as I'm concerned. More Pyro, less old old codgers greeting. We never had our buses searched or dry trains on our way to the game.The police just let us fight all day and never lifted you or even took your name.You could sing what you want as well.Magic days the 80s and 90s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil r Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 (edited) Man um pyoor gonnae take smokebombs un flares un that tae the fitba coz ah cannae get a drink or a fag it the ground like in the sevunties or eighties n that. Thatull show thum. Edited January 20, 2016 by neil r Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringo Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I feel the love brother. Edit : I mean, I feel the love...brother. That's better... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TartanJon Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I love how these s think they are the only ####ers to get a bit of grief going to the football. In the 80s every time you went to a game you were scared that if you turned the wrong corner you were going to get done in by 50 bams with nice trainers or the police. Imagine these ####ers on Easter Road in the 80s after game when it's was dark ? 1000 folk running about throwing bottles & punches while trying to dodge the Lothian Calvary whacking you with a truncheon. Coming out the Broomloan and the whole feckin Rangers support is waiting outside to kick your head in wasn't a lot of fun. What's happening to you boys happened to Aberdeen fans for 20 years,tenfold.Cove Sheep,Baby Cove are ages with you will tell you what it was like getting pulled out of bars 40minutes to kick off and marched to the ground,kept in for an hour after the game etc etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbcmfc Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Man um pyoor gonnae take smokebombs un flares un that tae the fitba coz ah cannae get a drink or a fag it the ground like in the sevunties or eighties n that. Thatull show thum. You're really engaging in the debate here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fringo Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Different flares in the '70s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macy37 Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I love how these ######s think they are the only ####ers to get a bit of grief going to the football. In the 80s every time you went to a game you were scared that if you turned the wrong corner you were going to get done in by 50 bams with nice trainers or the police. Imagine these ####ers on Easter Road in the 80s after game when it's was dark ? 1000 folk running about throwing bottles & punches while trying to dodge the Lothian Calvary whacking you with a truncheon. Coming out the Broomloan and the whole feckin Rangers support is waiting outside to kick your head in wasn't a lot of fun. What's happening to you boys happened to Aberdeen fans for 20 years,tenfold.Cove Sheep,Baby Cove are ages with you will tell you what it was like getting pulled out of bars 40minutes to kick off and marched to the ground,kept in for an hour after the game etc etc Hardcore Sheep, proper hardcore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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