Round of 16 and beyond.

[paper_lion]

10 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

Sorry Toepoke, what do you mean by 3rd placed teams in E and F know what to do ?

They'll be the last to play so they'll know how many points/goals they need to get through.

[exile]

21 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

Thanks. I hadn’t bothered looking beyond the group stages till now but am worryingly getting more optimistic. 

Sorry Toepoke, what do you mean by 3rd placed teams in E and F know what to do ? 
 

 

Presumably, they already know who is the 3rd placed team in Groups A-D and how many points they have etc, the targets to beat. In principle, they might already have more points than the third placed teams in A-D.

(For example, a group could end up with 9, 6, 1, 1 points, another on 7, 5, 2, 1. Then you could be in a group with 4, 4, 3, 0 after 2 games and you'd know 4 or 3 would be enough to go through)

Edited June 9, 2021 by exile

[Toepoke]

27 minutes ago, paper_lion said:

They'll be the last to play so they'll know how many points/goals they need to get through.

 

25 minutes ago, exile said:

Presumably, they already know who is the 3rd placed team in Groups A-D and how many points they have etc, the targets to beat. In principle, they might already have more points than the third placed teams in A-D.

(For example, a group could end up with 9, 6, 1, 1 points, another on 7, 5, 2, 1. Then you could be in a group with 4, 4, 3, 0 after 2 games and you'd know 4 or 3 would be enough to go through)

Exactly this. Last time round Albania had to stay in their base for a few extra days watching other teams overtake them, including eventual winners Portugal who sneaked through with a draw v Hungary, and the Rep of Ireland who somehow managed to beat Italy.

 

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by Toepoke

[TDYER63]

16 minutes ago, paper_lion said:

They'll be the last to play so they'll know how many points/goals they need to get through.

 

14 minutes ago, exile said:

Presumably, they already know who is the 3rd placed team in Groups A-D and how many points they have etc, the targets to beat. In principle, they might already have more points than the third placed teams in A-D.

(For example, a group could end up with 9, 6, 1, 1 points, another on 7, 5, 2, 1. Then you could be in a group with 4, 4, 3, 0 after 2 games and you'd know 4 or 3 would be enough to go through)

 

16 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

 

Exactly this. Last time round Albania had to stay in their base for a few extra days watching other teams overtake them, including eventual winners Portugal who sneaked through with a draw v Hungary, and the Rep of Ireland who somehow managed to beat Italy.

 

 

 

Thanks.
I can see how this would give a small advantage but am surprised that it regularly gives the upperhand. You would think that regularly there were stronger 3 rd placed teams in the A-D  sections that would secure one of the places regardless. 

[Toepoke]

26 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

Thanks.
I can see how this would give a small advantage but am surprised that it regularly gives the upperhand. You would think that regularly there were stronger 3 rd placed teams in the A-D  sections that would secure one of the places regardless. 

I suppose it's a small sample size but looking at the World Cups that use this format (86, 90 and 94) plus the last Euros, groups E and F have always contained 3rd place qualifiers.

 

[ceudmilefailte]

So what happens if England win all here games and the rest of us play out three draws?

Edited June 9, 2021 by ceudmilefailte

[Texas Pete]

5 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said:

So what happens if England win all here games and the rest of us play out three draws?

Most goals scored between the three drawing teams. Hopefully we’d have drawn our 2 games 3-3 and Croatia and the Czechs draw 0-0. 

Would possibly come down to who lost to England least heavily though.

3rd and 4th place would be eliminated.

 

[Toepoke]

7 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

3rd and 4th place would be eliminated.

3rd might get through, depends how other groups go.

 

[ceudmilefailte]

7 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

3rd might get through, depends how other groups go.

 

Doubt if you could be best 3rd placed with 2pt, mind you it is possible.

[ceudmilefailte]

17 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

Most goals scored between the three drawing teams. Hopefully we’d have drawn our 2 games 3-3 and Croatia and the Czechs draw 0-0. 

Would possibly come down to who lost to England least heavily though.

3rd and 4th place would be eliminated.

 

Penalty shoot out against Croatia it is then. Doubt if any one has got knocked out like that before.

[Texas Pete]

9 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

3rd might get through, depends how other groups go.

 

Highly unlikely but yeah as Ceudmilefailte says, possible . At least 2 other groups would need to have teams finishing third with 2 points and we’d need to have a better goal dIfference.

If we (or any team) get through with two points I’ll eat my hat. I’ll need to buy a hat first though. 

[Texas Pete]

7 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said:

Penalty shoot out against Croatia it is then. Doubt if any one has got knocked out like that before.

It certainly hasn’t happened in the Euros as I think they only introduced that rule in 2016 and it didn’t come into play. 

At least we know we’re quite good at penalty shootouts if it does happen. 

[Toepoke]

6 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

Highly unlikely but yeah as Ceudmilefailte says, possible . At least 2 other groups would need to have teams finishing third with 2 points and we’d need to have a better goal dIfference.

If we (or any team) get through with two points I’ll eat my hat. I’ll need to buy a hat first though. 

Uruguay did it at Mexico 86

Admittedly tougher to do now with 3pts for a win.

 

[Texas Pete]

2 minutes ago, Toepoke said:

Uruguay did it at Mexico 86

Admittedly tougher to do now with 3pts for a win.

 

Almost impossible now I’d say. There would need to be that many draws that the tournament would be unwatchable.

It would be pretty funny if we did get through with 2 points after being unlucky a few times with goal difference etc. 

[TDYER63]

10 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

Highly unlikely but yeah as Ceudmilefailte says, possible . At least 2 other groups would need to have teams finishing third with 2 points and we’d need to have a better goal dIfference.

If we (or any team) get through with two points I’ll eat my hat. I’ll need to buy a hat first though. 

A Texan without a hat. Shameful .

Just heard on the radio we have a 57% chance of making the last 16 , and we are no even in groups E and F 🙂 Thats better than I thought. Things are looking too positive. 

[ceudmilefailte]

It is possible to get through with one point, would be a very Scottish way of doing things.

[Texas Pete]

2 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

A Texan without a hat. Shameful .

Just heard on the radio we have a 57% chance of making the last 16 , and we are no even in groups E and F 🙂 Thats better than I thought. Things are looking too positive. 

😂 In my defence I haven’t lived in Texas for 6 years. 

This is the most positive about us getting out a group I can remember being and I’m not sure I like it. 

The last 3 tournaments we’ve been to we have opened our groups against Netherlands (twice) and Brazil so had no real chance of getting off to a good start. This time we are at home to the lowest ranked team (apart from us) in the group.

Third place might be enough to get out the group and we are actually playing pretty well at the moment.

Something makes me very uneasy about all this.

 

[TDYER63]

3 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

😂 In my defence I haven’t lived in Texas for 6 years. 

This is the most positive about us getting out a group I can remember being and I’m not sure I like it. 

The last 3 tournaments we’ve been to we have opened our groups against Netherlands (twice) and Brazil so had no real chance of getting off to a good start. This time we are at home to the lowest ranked team (apart from us) in the group.

Third place might be enough to get out the group and we are actually playing pretty well at the moment.

Something makes me very uneasy about all this.

 

Did JR Ewing run you out of town ? 

Yeah I am getting a bit unsettled myself about this new found optimism. I hope I am not crying into my corned beef sandwich and capri sun contraband come 4pm Monday. 

[Texas Pete]

15 minutes ago, ceudmilefailte said:

It is possible to get through with one point, would be a very Scottish way of doing things.

Since the European Championships changed to 3 points for a win in 1996 a team has only finished third in a group with one point once. That’s once in 26 groups. If it happens three times in this tournament I’ll eat my own scants as well as my hat. 

You’re right though it would be just like us. 

[Texas Pete]

8 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

Did JR Ewing run you out of town ? 

Yeah I am getting a bit unsettled myself about this new found optimism. I hope I am not crying into my corned beef sandwich and capri sun contraband come 4pm Monday. 

No I woke up back in Glasgow one day and Bobby got out the shower. 

The last time everyone thought we had a great chance of winning our first game it didn’t go well. Mind you we badly underestimated Costa Rica. There should be none of that against the Czechs. 

[gkm_vancouver]

30 minutes ago, Texas Pete said:

Since the European Championships changed to 3 points for a win in 1996 a team has only finished third in a group with one point once. That’s once in 26 groups. If it happens three times in this tournament I’ll eat my own scants as well as my hat. 

You’re right though it would be just like us. 

🤣 🤣 

[stirlish]

12 hours ago, TDYER63 said:

Thanks. I hadn’t bothered looking beyond the group stages till now but am worryingly getting more optimistic. 

Sorry Toepoke, what do you mean by 3rd placed teams in E and F know what to do ? 
 

 

They play their group matches last so would know what was required to beat the other goups' 3rd place.

[Toepoke]

Watching the game from Copenhagen earlier, were we to manage 2nd in the group I wouldn't fancy playing Sweden there. It'd be like a home game for them with a very intimidating atmosphere.