Al1978 Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 I meant to say yes they will. But I also think they will rush it and it wont be the best plan. Sounds good! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biffer Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 2015: commission o future of UK constitution delays proposals for until after the General Election, as English MPs become far more assertive in their claims. No party wants proposals which will damage them and allow UKIP to make hay surfacing before the Westminster elections. But rumours continue to fly, and UKIP deliver fifteen MPs. Tories enter government as largest party but no majority, technically ruling as a minority government but only because a formal coalition with UKIP is too dangerous. It is coalition in all but name. 2016: further delays mean that no solid proposal is delivered prior to the Holyrood elections. Labour vote collapses, Greens and SNP dominate the Scottish parliament with yards of ninety MPs between them. Full blown co stitutional crisis. UK paralysed, economy blows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hessen Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 2015: commission o future of UK constitution delays proposals for until after the General Election, as English MPs become far more assertive in their claims. No party wants proposals which will damage them and allow UKIP to make hay surfacing before the Westminster elections. But rumours continue to fly, and UKIP deliver fifteen MPs. Tories enter government as largest party but no majority, technically ruling as a minority government but only because a formal coalition with UKIP is too dangerous. It is coalition in all but name. 2016: further delays mean that no solid proposal is delivered prior to the Holyrood elections. Labour vote collapses, Greens and SNP dominate the Scottish parliament with yards of ninety MPs between them. Full blown co stitutional crisis. UK paralysed, economy blows. then the posh rich boys club gets together, cuts welfare spending, blames the poor on benefits, and awards themselves a 10% pay rise.....same old same old Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armchair Bob Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 I just hope labour claim all the kudos going for yesterday's hatchet job. Because they richly deserve the blame if we are hit with extra waves of unnecessary austerity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stapes Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 I think they will, I think they know they have to. But I think it will be some cobbled together ninsense than when you scrape beneath the surface actually offers very little at all. And to be honest, we can't complain, or those who voted No can't complain. They were warned. Don't come running to me whining about bloody politicians at Westminster. You just gave them carte blanche to tear the heart out if Scotland. And they will tear it out, because they're never going to allow this to happen again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stapes Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 Cameron appears to now be saying that further powers will happen. However, they will also be given to England, Wales and NI. Isn't this simply diluting any powers we are given? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kps022000 Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 I need to know exactly what powers are going to be given, how we can use then, how long we will have them for and........... .....in fact it's just too much uncertainty. I don't want any new powers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exile Posted September 19, 2014 Author Share Posted September 19, 2014 (edited) The BBC news is now telling us very clearly how complex and uncertain the issue of 'more powers' is, and how the whole of UK will be affected so we need to think through the bigger picture... And they've just shown a graphic of all the possible powers 'you could have had' and which ones might actually be on offer... These things never so clear now, compared with what they told us before the vote Edited September 19, 2014 by exile Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
min Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 An extract from Robert Peston's blog: 'The big question about the Prime Minister's plan to hand more control over taxes, spending and welfare to the four nations is how far this would end the subsidy of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland by England, and especially by London and the South East. For all that it may sound attractive to the Scots, Welsh and Northern Irish to have greater influence over their respective economic destinies, presumably that would be less desirable if at a stroke they became poorer. The point is that as and when there is an English Parliament for English people - of the sort that the former Tory minister John Redwood has been demanding, and David Cameron seemed to concede today - the financial transfer from England to the rest of the UK may be harder to sustain.' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rossy Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 Cameron appears to now be saying that further powers will happen. However, they will also be given to England, Wales and NI. Isn't this simply diluting any powers we are given? I'm all for a far more federal UK...England should have devolved powers of its own. If anything it would help define 'Englishness' and break people away from the interchangeable British/English identity which many of them have. It would also strengthen the Scottish parliament, and highlight the differences between us (in a good way). The anachronism which is 'Britain' simply has to change....it's laughable that we're holding onto some fabled idea of sepia tinged days when Britain ruled the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE_fifer Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 (edited) An extract from Robert Peston's blog: the Prime Minister's plan to hand more control over taxes, spending and welfare to the four nations is how far this would end the subsidy of Scotland I though Peston had become a bit more balanced in his coverage of the referendum etc lately, but I see he's back to talking rubbish again with this "subsidy" nonsense! Edited September 19, 2014 by NE_fifer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UPROAR Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 the fundamental problem is not that people believed these promises, they probably didn't. The fundamental problem is that we needed to persuade around 190k+ No voters to vote Yes. They were probably going to be middle class scots who would have benefited most in the long run from the economic benefits of independence. In the end if we dont win the middle class hearts and minds we will never win any referendum.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShedTA Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 An extract from Robert Peston's blog: 'The big question about the Prime Minister's plan to hand more control over taxes, spending and welfare to the four nations is how far this would end the subsidy of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland by England, and especially by London and the South East. For all that it may sound attractive to the Scots, Welsh and Northern Irish to have greater influence over their respective economic destinies, presumably that would be less desirable if at a stroke they became poorer. The point is that as and when there is an English Parliament for English people - of the sort that the former Tory minister John Redwood has been demanding, and David Cameron seemed to concede today - the financial transfer from England to the rest of the UK may be harder to sustain.' Did they not also vow to retain the Barnett formula? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biffer Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 Cameron appears to now be saying that further powers will happen. However, they will also be given to England, Wales and NI. Isn't this simply diluting any powers we are given? No. Its not about having more powers than anyone else, its about having genuine control over our lives, communities and society. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE_fifer Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 Did they not also vow to retain the Barnett formula? Yeah, that appeared to be part of the "vow". They'd have to be very brave to overtly ditch it, £4bn dissapearing from Scotland's finances overnight would make a fair few no voters from last night reconsider imo! However I'm sure there's some underhand way it could be eroded over many years, with the hope that no one notices. As far as devolution for W, NI and Eng goes they of course should have it if they want it - although I suspect many are not that bothered and those that are want the right wing tabloid type "English votes for the English" kind of devo rather than the kind that many politicians in N English cities are hoping for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biffer Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 They vowed to retain the mechanism. In other words it applies on the money coming from westmimster but not to the entire budget. So in effect its a cut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auld_Reekie Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 Im all for Devo Max now. Has to be the next target. Biggest concern for me is how the SNP deal with this - only credible party in Scotland but don't see why they should have to take the hit trying to work within the devolved settlement. Labour et al should be made to step forward and deliver on their pledges on prescription charges, tuition fees, childcare and accept the consequences of those choices. But can't see how the SNP will opt for opposition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumnio Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 SNP will be in a terrible position, it's a no win situation for them. If they win the election then they have new mechanisms to raise taxes, that's a brilliant idea, make the people pay again. Sadly the people most affected by this will be the poor, so I can't even hope that Labour wins the election and f'cks everything up. If anyone thinks Scotland will improve, they're off their head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exile Posted September 19, 2014 Author Share Posted September 19, 2014 So Dave in Downing Street says: we have heard the voice of Scotland, now it is time to hear the voice of England... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIGHTOWER 1314 Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 Not a hope in hell will they honour they lies they told us before we went to the polls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jie Bie Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 The majority of No voters don't even care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faddyisyerdaddy Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 The majority of No voters don't even care. Agreed, it was a clever tactic. The quislings knew they were doing the selfish thing by voting no, the vow was a means by which they could justify to themselves that they were somehow helping Scotland. IIn fact most of them could not give a fcuk I whether we even have our own parliament. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jie Bie Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 Indeed. 2 million citizens who don't care if Scotland is a country or a region. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsheep Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 They've missed their first timetable pledge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exile Posted September 20, 2014 Author Share Posted September 20, 2014 They've missed their first timetable pledge. Can you remind us what it was? Was it to draw up a timetable or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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