The news thread

[Ally Bongo]

Suella Braverman is the new home secretary

A sort of undead Priti Patel

Be worried

[stocky]

43 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

not all landlords are rich.

No one needs more than 1 house.

Does this imaginary guy live  in a house,? has he paid it off! 

if so, regardless of the rent , he doesn't need the second house.

it's worth £100,000. If sold that's 20 years of £5000 income. Gets him nicely in to 88 without the need to worry about repairs, maintenance and tenants 

 

he's better off selling it 

 

your economics,like your logic is way off 

 

 

 

Edited September 6, 2022 by stocky

[stocky]

35 minutes ago, phart said:

Landlords are ticket scalpers but more cuntish.

That's just a general judgement not read the policy for a specific opinion on that.

Exactly.

Morally wrong to have more than one home.

If you have more, you are part of the problem

[TDYER63]

57 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

Shocker from Nicola freezing rents in the public AND private sector.  Absolutely not for her to decide what the market sets as the rent for a property.

besides, what about landlords facing interest rate rises on their buy to let’s with no facility to pass this on.  Discgraceful.

My sister has been given 2 months notice to leave her private rented house as the owner wants to sell to take advantage of the prices. At least that is what he says, I would not be the least surprised if he wants more money for rent. He has numerous homes. 
She has been renting for over 7 years and has astheically transformed the dump the house was  before she got it. However the kitchen is falling to bits and there is a leak in the bath which has rotted the floorboards , she was told by the joiner that the bath could fall through the floor at any time. The landlord knows too but has done fook all  about it.

She and her partner cannot afford the rent on another private rent at current levels so will need to get a council house. She has 2 kids under 9. She has to get evicted before she can be seen as priority so she has to refuse to leave the house then go  through courts.

Of course if all the council houses hadnt been sold off by the Tories with no reinvestment whatsover people would not have to be at the mercy of unscrupulous landlords taking advantage of ‘ the markets’ erratic and volatile movements. 

I really think you are at it for a reaction .

[thplinth]

I can only assume by the term landlords we are talking about millions of different people of all ages and backgrounds who have for whatever reason found themselves owning more that one property. Yes pure scum obviously. 😀

[Malcolm]

43 minutes ago, stocky said:

No one needs more than 1 house.

Does this imaginary guy live  in a house,? has he paid it off! 

if so, regardless of the rent , he doesn't need the second house.

it's worth £100,000. If sold that's 20 years of £5000 income. Gets him nicely in to 88 without the need to worry about repairs, maintenance and tenants 

 

he's better off selling it 

 

your economics,like your logic is way off 

 

 

 

he is not better off under your model in 20 years time he has enjoyed his 100,000 but has zero left for an asset.  By renting he has his £5k a year and also a house now worth £200,000 which he can then pass on to his kids.

[Malcolm]

33 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

My sister has been given 2 months notice to leave her private rented house as the owner wants to sell to take advantage of the prices. At least that is what he says, I would not be the least surprised if he wants more money for rent. He has numerous homes. 
She has been renting for over 7 years and has astheically transformed the dump the house was  before she got it. However the kitchen is falling to bits and there is a leak in the bath which has rotted the floorboards , she was told by the joiner that the bath could fall through the floor at any time. The landlord knows too but has done fook all  about it.

She and her partner cannot afford the rent on another private rent at current levels so will need to get a council house. She has 2 kids under 9. She has to get evicted before she can be seen as priority so she has to refuse to leave the house then go  through courts.

Of course if all the council houses hadnt been sold off by the Tories with no reinvestment whatsover people would not have to be at the mercy of unscrupulous landlords taking advantage of ‘ the markets’ erratic and volatile movements. 

I really think you are at it for a reaction .

 

im not at it at all.  I sympathise with your sisters position, but the issue here is lack of available housing stock, whether public or private to keep prices low.

 

[Malcolm]

46 minutes ago, stocky said:

Exactly.

Morally wrong to have more than one home.

If you have more, you are part of the problem

what about a holiday home that you air bnb?  Acceptable?

fundamentally disagree, you should have as many houses as you like.

[stocky]

3 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

he is not better off under your model in 20 years time he has enjoyed his 100,000 but has zero left for an asset.  By renting he has his £5k a year and also a house now worth £200,000 which he can then pass on to his kids.

So he has made £100000 off the backs of someone else's labour. He's done phukkall, and his tenants have paid for his children's inheritance .

 

That is morally wrong.

Earn your money by honest means , pass your rewards into others. 

Owning a second home is morally wrong.

 

You're at it ,and you know you are.

[stocky]

3 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

what about a holiday home that you air bnb?  Acceptable?

fundamentally disagree, you should have as many houses as you like.

Only if there are enough houses for everyone who wants one to have one . 

 

 

 

[thplinth]

12 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

he is not better off under your model in 20 years time he has enjoyed his 100,000 but has zero left for an asset.  By renting he has his £5k a year and also a house now worth £200,000 which he can then pass on to his kids.

No. They or their kids for sure will immediately sell it on the open market for maximum profit and then it and most of the other ex council houses are inevitably and eventually snapped up by some vulture private equity firm whose whole business model is to monopolize, squeeze and fuck their now private tenants.

I am a big believer in free markets (what else is there) but when you have huge predatory amounts of 'capital' able to swamp them and the actions of we (the average free market individual) it is a serious problem.

Anyone advocating neo-communism is no better than a neo-nazi so distance from both accordingly. 

Edited September 6, 2022 by thplinth

[stocky]

9 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

what about a holiday home that you air bnb?  Acceptable?

fundamentally disagree, you should have as many houses as you like.

Only if there are enough houses for everyone who wants one to have one . 

housing should be controlled

 

 

 

[phart]

Most landlords are social parasites

Both Adam Smith and Karl Marx agree on this. If nothing else.

 

[Landlords] are the only one of the three orders whose revenue costs them neither labour nor care, but comes to them, as it were, of its own accord, and independent of any plan or project of their own. That indolence, which is the natural effect of the ease and security of their situation, renders them too often, not only ignorant, but incapable of that application of mind"

-- ch 11, wealth of nations.

 

 

[aaid]

25 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

he is not better off under your model in 20 years time he has enjoyed his 100,000 but has zero left for an asset.  By renting he has his £5k a year and also a house now worth £200,000 which he can then pass on to his kids.

5% is a pretty crap yield on property. 

[Malcolm]

I disagree.  Really feels like a left wing government we have here.  No opportunity for wealth creation.  And to cap it all, no evictions for six month.  
 

mr Smith from our previous example finds his tenant stops paying his rent.  He can’t evict, or sell and loses a third of his income.  At a time when his personal energy bill is doubling.

I can’t see myself ever voting snp again.

[phart]

I don't vote SNP anyway.

Well why take out a mortgage on a property you aren't going to live in. If it's an investment then that has an inherent risk.

It's bad enough the banks can get cavalier with investments , and just get bailed out by government , now landlords are to be innoculated from investment risk as well? At the expense of the folk actually providing labour.

Sounds incoherent to me.

Edited September 6, 2022 by phart

[aaid]

6 minutes ago, phart said:

I don't vote SNP anyway.

Well why take out a mortgage on a property you aren't going to live in. If it's an investment then that has an inherent risk.

It's bad enough the banks can get cavalier with investments , and just get bailed out by government , now landlords are to be innoculated from investment risk as well? At the expense of the folk actually providing labour.

Sounds incoherent to me.

Particularly when it’s possible to insure against non-payment.  I mean that is how capitalism is supposed to work, isn’t it.  Put up your capital, invest it and accept the risk, the value of your investment may go up as well as down.

As an investment, rental properties don’t creat wealth for anyone other than the landlord. 

[thplinth]

In much of mainland Europe owning a holiday home is normal. This is deeply rooted. The Russian's have Dacha's I think they are spelled.

The greens were telling us not that long ago to holiday at home and not fly abroad. But now owning a second home at home makes you a cunt.

Ill thought through contradictory shite from morons.

 

[phart]

8 minutes ago, aaid said:

Particularly when it’s possible to insure against non-payment.  I mean that is how capitalism is supposed to work, isn’t it.  Put up your capital, invest it and accept the risk, the value of your investment may go up as well as down.

As an investment, rental properties don’t creat wealth for anyone other than the landlord. 

It's why you have folk from Adam Smith to Karl Marx the two grandfathers of modern economic theory thAt are in agreement on the subject. Fuck even Winston Churchill went on about it as well.

It's a scam use your capital to leverage a market then get someone with a family and nowhere esle to live to pay it off for you. Exploitation.

Edited September 6, 2022 by phart

[TDYER63]

35 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

 

im not at it at all.  I sympathise with your sisters position, but the issue here is lack of available housing stock, whether public or private to keep prices low.

 

 

7 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

I disagree.  Really feels like a left wing government we have here.  No opportunity for wealth creation.  And to cap it all, no evictions for six month.  
 

mr Smith from our previous example finds his tenant stops paying his rent.  He can’t evict, or sell and loses a third of his income.  At a time when his personal energy bill is doubling.

I can’t see myself ever voting snp again.

Who caused the shortage of public housing in their quest for free markets ? Thatcher. 

 I dont have a huge issue with free markets in general, i can see benefits, but not when it comes to a basic necessity in life like a home..

There will be loads of people in the same position as my sister, when people struggle to pay for fuel they will struggle with rent and get evicted. Or landlords will want more rent and kick out tenants who cant afford it. 

Everything  seems to been seen through a  prism of money in your eyes Malcolm . But free markets need people in order to exist, when   landlords push the boundaries too far they will price themselves out of the market as peoples cash will only go so far , by then  many tenants  will have lost their home. . I dont believe that people who own numerous properties will be anywhere close to financial difficulties if rents are capped, unless they have overstretched themselves through greed and if so I have  no sympathy.

I agree with a cap on rent , at least until this energy situation improves. I dont see it as being left wing I see it as being responsible to protect a fundamental necessity  . 

[Malcolm]

8 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

 

Who caused the shortage of public housing in their quest for free markets ? Thatcher. 

 I dont have a huge issue with free markets in general, i can see benefits, but not when it comes to a basic necessity in life like a home..

There will be loads of people in the same position as my sister, when people struggle to pay for fuel they will struggle with rent and get evicted. Or landlords will want more rent and kick out tenants who cant afford it. 

Everything  seems to been seen through a  prism of money in your eyes Malcolm . But free markets need people in order to exist, when   landlords push the boundaries too far they will price themselves out of the market as peoples cash will only go so far , by then  many tenants  will have lost their home. . I dont believe that people who own numerous properties will be anywhere close to financial difficulties if rents are capped, unless they have overstretched themselves through greed and if so I have  no sympathy.

I agree with a cap on rent , at least until this energy situation improves. I dont see it as being left wing I see it as being responsible to protect a fundamental necessity  . 

If the Scottish government wants to fix this, why doesn’t it build lots of homes and then rent them.  This will drive down the market price and landlords will have to match it.  They shouldn’t be sticking their beak in to private landlord business and effectively tying them in by no evictions. 

 

[TDYER63]

7 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

If the Scottish government wants to fix this, why doesn’t it build lots of homes and then rent them.  This will drive down the market price and landlords will have to match it.  They shouldn’t be sticking their beak in to private landlord business and effectively tying them in by no evictions. 

 

The SG have built tens of thousands of new homes. Where is the money coming from after the entire social housing stock was sold off ? 
Why should  people sympathise with landlords who have already made shitloads of cash from tenants and have benefitted  from massive increases in the value of their properties? 
Why do you find it such an injustice that caps be put on rent and a restriction placed on people being evicted during a Scottish winter when prices are spiralling out of control? 
Do you know any poor , multiple home owning,  land lords ? 

 

[aaid]

1 hour ago, phart said:

Most landlords are social parasites

Both Adam Smith and Karl Marx agree on this. If nothing else.

 

[Landlords] are the only one of the three orders whose revenue costs them neither labour nor care, but comes to them, as it were, of its own accord, and independent of any plan or project of their own. That indolence, which is the natural effect of the ease and security of their situation, renders them too often, not only ignorant, but incapable of that application of mind"

-- ch 11, wealth of nations.

 

 

Of course, both Marx and Smith lived before there was any social housing and the only options were ownership for the tiny minority and rent for the vast majority.

There is a requirement for a private rented sector as there are some people for who that suits their needs.   In the main they’ll be younger but not exclusively and will be people for who they don’t want to, or aren’t in a position to stay in the same place for an extended period, e.g., students, people on short term contracts, people working away from home, etc., etc.

The problem though is that the social renting sector is too small to meet demand and so people are forced into the private sector at excessive rents and are trapped into a position that it’s impossible to get out of, either by meeting the criteria for social housing or being able to build up a big enough deposit to buy.

[Malcolm]

29 minutes ago, TDYER63 said:

The SG have built tens of thousands of new homes. Where is the money coming from after the entire social housing stock was sold off ? 
Why should  people sympathise with landlords who have already made shitloads of cash from tenants and have benefitted  from massive increases in the value of their properties? 
Why do you find it such an injustice that caps be put on rent and a restriction placed on people being evicted during a Scottish winter when prices are spiralling out of control? 
Do you know any poor , multiple home owning,  land lords ? 

 

i fundamentally disagree with the government controlling what people do with their own personal property.  It’s outrageous that they can’t evict and can’t charge what they like.

I do however have sympathy for people that have to rent, but it’s not up to private landlords to sort that it’s up to the government.  The government are responsible for ensuring there is adequate housing.  It should be in competition with the private sector.  They are clearly not building houses quickly enough.

yes, I know a few landlords.  I also had multiple properties at one point. 
 

 

[Malcolm]

14 minutes ago, aaid said:

Of course, both Marx and Smith lived before there was any social housing and the only options were ownership for the tiny minority and rent for the vast majority.

There is a requirement for a private rented sector as there are some people for who that suits their needs.   In the main they’ll be younger but not exclusively and will be people for who they don’t want to, or aren’t in a position to stay in the same place for an extended period, e.g., students, people on short term contracts, people working away from home, etc., etc.

The problem though is that the social renting sector is too small to meet demand and so people are forced into the private sector at excessive rents and are trapped into a position that it’s impossible to get out of, either by meeting the criteria for social housing or being able to build up a big enough deposit to buy.

that’s the government’s fault for not replenishing housing stock.