Euros squad current situations

[BryanBlessed]

4 hours ago, theabsentee said:

My baring injuries automatic choices would be

 GK. Gunn, Clark, Gordon

FB. Robbo, Hickey , Patterson

CD.  Tierney, Souttar, McKenna

MID. McGinn, McTominay, Gilmour, Christie , McGregor , Ferguson, McLean

ATTACK. Adams , Shankland, Dykes, Fraser, Barnes.

That's 21 & a bit defensively light so 1 from Hanley, Hendry, Porteous & in my dreamy head the last place goes to Livramento or Archie Gray😊

I agree on Souttar being automatic but Hanley is a big favourite of Clark's as is Porteous. I saw somewhere that Hickey, barring setbacks, should be back in early May so that could be positive. His replacement, Patterson, isn't showing any signs of becoming the player we hoped and it's even slimmer pickings after him.

 

I doubt Clarke is going to take five forwards. I'm still unsure how Barnes will fit into our team as we don't play with wingers and  it looks like he's rarely played as a centre forward. I suppose he's so good that you can't leave him out but I don't think Clarke would take Barnes and Fraser. I don't really want him to play for us but he's more Scottish than Adams. I'm not sure he'd make our first XI, though.

 

Dykes is either not being played as a forward or only getting a few minutes at the end of the game for a struggling championship teal. I thought he was poor in the second half of the campaign so his place may be at risk if Barnes declares and is counted as a forward and not an attacking midfielder.

[syecosse]

2 hours ago, BryanBlessed said:

I agree on Souttar being automatic but Hanley is a big favourite of Clark's as is Porteous. I saw somewhere that Hickey, barring setbacks, should be back in early May so that could be positive. His replacement, Patterson, isn't showing any signs of becoming the player we hoped and it's even slimmer pickings after him.

 

I doubt Clarke is going to take five forwards. I'm still unsure how Barnes will fit into our team as we don't play with wingers and  it looks like he's rarely played as a centre forward. I suppose he's so good that you can't leave him out but I don't think Clarke would take Barnes and Fraser. I don't really want him to play for us but he's more Scottish than Adams. I'm not sure he'd make our first XI, though.

 

Dykes is either not being played as a forward or only getting a few minutes at the end of the game for a struggling championship teal. I thought he was poor in the second half of the campaign so his place may be at risk if Barnes declares and is counted as a forward and not an attacking midfielder.

Regarding Patterson, was speaking to a massive Everton fan the fans seem to think that i there is 2 reasons he does not play, if he plays so many games he triggers a payment to Rangers or he does not fit the type of Football Dyche plays,  defensive and boring is what he said and Patterson is not his type of player but they would much rather Patterson plays than Coleman or Young. 

[The Black Bra]

I’d like to see, barring injuries obviously:

GK: Gunn, Clark, Gordon

Defenders: Hickey, Patterson, Robertson, Tierney, McKenna, Souttar, Hendry, Porteous.

Midfield: McGinn, McTominay, Gilmour, Christie, McGregor, Ferguson, McLean, Armstrong.

Forwards: Dykes, Adams, Shankland, Fraser.

Only doubts for me are Hanley possibly coming in for Porteous and Fraser missing out if the previous issues between him and Clarke can’t be sorted out. If not Fraser, I’d have Duhan Van Der Merwe 😉

Has Barnes definitely committed to us? If he has, I think I’d still leave him out until after the Euros, see how commuted he really is. I’d be happier to stick with the players who’ve got us there.

 

[Tartan blood]

8 hours ago, theabsentee said:

My baring injuries automatic choices would be

 GK. Gunn, Clark, Gordon

FB. Robbo, Hickey , Patterson

CD.  Tierney, Souttar, McKenna

MID. McGinn, McTominay, Gilmour, Christie , McGregor , Ferguson, McLean

ATTACK. Adams , Shankland, Dykes, Fraser, Barnes.

That's 21 & a bit defensively light so 1 from Hanley, Hendry, Porteous & in my dreamy head the last place goes to Livramento or Archie Gray😊

Interesting that you and many others see Souttar as a dead cert to be included. Only a month ago I'd have said he had no chance of making the squad.

I know he has been playing regularly for Rangers lately, but has he been playing that well that he has leapfrogged Hanley, Hendry, Cooper and Porteous in the pecking order?

[DesiScotsman]

54 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

Interesting that you and many others see Souttar as a dead cert to be included. Only a month ago I'd have said he had no chance of making the squad.

I know he has been playing regularly for Rangers lately, but has he been playing that well that he has leapfrogged Hanley, Hendry, Cooper and Porteous in the pecking order?

Souttar has been excellent since getting an opportunity to stake that CB role next to Goldson. Played a big part in this winning run that has seen Rangers catch and leapfrog Celtic into first. On this form, he’d be impossible to ignore given our lack of depth and quality options in that position. His assist for the opening goal against Hearts was absolutely exquisite.

Hanley has just returned from a long term nasty injury and his game time at Norwich has been getting managed closely. Seems to be performing well when called upon.

Unsure about Hendry as I don’t watch/follow the Saudi league.

Porteous was not long ago struggling for game time having lost his place in the starting lineup due to poor performances and there were even reports that Udinese were trying to sign him recently in the January window - would have been a great move for him. Got back into the Watford team this month but seems like he loves to pick up a booking every game which has resulted in him missing the last two games through suspension. Reading some of the reviews from Watford fans on his performances this season, underwhelming is pretty much what they unanimously think of his performances this season.

Cooper has been warming the bench for Leeds and I can’t see him making it due to the lack of game time at his club for the final 23-man squad unless we get a gigantic injury crisis at CB.

Edited February 27 by DesiScotsman

[BryanBlessed]

8 hours ago, Tartan blood said:

Interesting that you and many others see Souttar as a dead cert to be included. Only a month ago I'd have said he had no chance of making the squad.

I know he has been playing regularly for Rangers lately, but has he been playing that well that he has leapfrogged Hanley, Hendry, Cooper and Porteous in the pecking order?

It wasn't looking good for him up until recently (but who was under Beale?) but he always was a better player than Porteous and Hendry and he only stayed in Scotland because his brother was terminally ill. I think it would be showing too much loyalty to stick with Porteous and Hendry and not drop one of them for Souttar. It might be the case that both get dropped and he puts Hanley and Souttar in.   The question is whether, like Tierney, he'll stay injury free.

[BryanBlessed]

9 hours ago, syecosse said:

Regarding Patterson, was speaking to a massive Everton fan the fans seem to think that i there is 2 reasons he does not play, if he plays so many games he triggers a payment to Rangers or he does not fit the type of Football Dyche plays,  defensive and boring is what he said and Patterson is not his type of player but they would much rather Patterson plays than Coleman or Young. 

That's really unlucky for him and, given Everton's financial problems, I can imagine it's true. You'd think they maybe would have sold him in January, though.

[N4Footsoldier]

22 hours ago, theabsentee said:

Totally agree with nearly everything you've written apart from the re-emergence of Fraser being a potential threat to Christie's inclusion. What Christie's emergence as a deeper midfielder may have done is end Ryan Jacks international career unless he plays a pivotal role for Rangers from now until the seasons end.

   I'd go as far as to say Christie deserves to start next to Gilmour against Netherlands in the friendly & if they pairing works well against Germany also. 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿💪

 

Yeah don't get me wrong I would put Christie with at least a 75% chance of being included, with or without Fraser. It's just overall a pretty interesting development with Fraser knuckling down and showing a bit of character/humility to drop to the Championship and find form, as well as Christie dropping back, which I don't think anyone would have seen coming, possibly even Clarke.

[Caledonian Craig]

1 hour ago, N4Footsoldier said:

Yeah don't get me wrong I would put Christie with at least a 75% chance of being included, with or without Fraser. It's just overall a pretty interesting development with Fraser knuckling down and showing a bit of character/humility to drop to the Championship and find form, as well as Christie dropping back, which I don't think anyone would have seen coming, possibly even Clarke.

It would make sense to drop Christie back into the pool of midfielders for the squad leaving a space for Fraser's inclusion as a striker. I say this as Fraser has scored far more goals than Christie this season. If that were to happen though the question would become which midfielder gets left out?

[The Black Bra]

Said this in a previous post:

Midfield: McGinn, McTominay, Gilmour, Christie, McGregor, Ferguson, McLean,Armstrong.
 

If these are the midfielders in the squad, they only one you could argue has been left out is Ryan Jack, not sure he would make it anyway.

[Diamond Scot]

There are a few who were already on the edges of the squad that will now be left out. 

Ryan Jack. If he was playing reguarly may have been included as he is our only real defensive midfielder but he has had practically no game time and thats unlikely to change. Personally id drop Christie back into midfield and leave one of the attacking mid slots free.

Liam Cooper. We probably have 1 stand out centre back in Tierney (ironic given he isnt actually a CB). The rest who have played for us are pretty interchangeable. Coopers lack of game time means he wont go over others playing more often.

The other one who I can see dropping out is Greg Taylor. He was only ever a backup anyway and his form hasnt been great. Assuming Robertson, Hickey and Patterson are fit then Clarke will likely take 1 more full back. Now would be an ideal time to transition to Doig.

GK x 3 (Gunn, Gordon, Clark)

Full back x 4 (Robertson, Doig, Hickey, Patterson)

CB x 5 (Tierney, McKenna, Hanley, Porteous, Hendry / Souttar)

Centre mid x 4 (McGreggor, Gimlour, McLean, Christie)

Attacking mid x 4 (McGinn, McTomminay, Ferguson, Armstrong)

Forwards x 3 (Adams, Dykes, Shankland)

Having McLean as a centre mid may allow Clarke to just take 4 CBs. 

If Barnes declares id be tempted to take 4 CBs and not Doig. That frees up 2 spaces where id take Fraser and Barnes. Allows us to switch to a 433 but you would have to try it in the upcoming games to see if it works.

[N4Footsoldier]

25 minutes ago, Diamond Scot said:

There are a few who were already on the edges of the squad that will now be left out. 

Ryan Jack. If he was playing reguarly may have been included as he is our only real defensive midfielder but he has had practically no game time and thats unlikely to change. Personally id drop Christie back into midfield and leave one of the attacking mid slots free.

Liam Cooper. We probably have 1 stand out centre back in Tierney (ironic given he isnt actually a CB). The rest who have played for us are pretty interchangeable. Coopers lack of game time means he wont go over others playing more often.

The other one who I can see dropping out is Greg Taylor. He was only ever a backup anyway and his form hasnt been great. Assuming Robertson, Hickey and Patterson are fit then Clarke will likely take 1 more full back. Now would be an ideal time to transition to Doig.

GK x 3 (Gunn, Gordon, Clark)

Full back x 4 (Robertson, Doig, Hickey, Patterson)

CB x 5 (Tierney, McKenna, Hanley, Porteous, Hendry / Souttar)

Centre mid x 4 (McGreggor, Gimlour, McLean, Christie)

Attacking mid x 4 (McGinn, McTomminay, Ferguson, Armstrong)

Forwards x 3 (Adams, Dykes, Shankland)

Having McLean as a centre mid may allow Clarke to just take 4 CBs. 

If Barnes declares id be tempted to take 4 CBs and not Doig. That frees up 2 spaces where id take Fraser and Barnes. Allows us to switch to a 433 but you would have to try it in the upcoming games to see if it works.

All fair but I'd be very surprised to see Doig come in at this point over a Patterson, regardless of his game time, especially as that would leave us with 4 left backs and zero natural right backs in the squad.

[Diamond Scot]

32 minutes ago, N4Footsoldier said:

All fair but I'd be very surprised to see Doig come in at this point over a Patterson, regardless of his game time, especially as that would leave us with 4 left backs and zero natural right backs in the squad.

Not over Patterson. Over Taylor.

I think for 3 games minimum you need 2 full back for each side. I dont include Tierney as a full back as we should be keeping him at LCB unless of an absoulute emergency.

With Fraser / Barnes in the squad you could probably get away with taking 3 full backs, Robertson, Hickey and Patterson and in an emergency using Barnes or Fraser as wing back.

[N4Footsoldier]

6 minutes ago, Diamond Scot said:

Not over Patterson. Over Taylor.

I think for 3 games minimum you need 2 full back for each side. I dont include Tierney as a full back as we should be keeping him at LCB unless of an absoulute emergency.

With Fraser / Barnes in the squad you could probably get away with taking 3 full backs, Robertson, Hickey and Patterson and in an emergency using Barnes or Fraser as wing back.

Ah ok, I always assumed you would apply Tierney as one of the full back quota, who helpfully plays LCB. That way you free a space up either way to get someone else in like an extra forward for example.

So in my mind in a 23 man squad your full back options are for example: Tierney, Hickey, Robbo, Patterson

[Diamond Scot]

6 minutes ago, N4Footsoldier said:

Ah ok, I always assumed you would apply Tierney as one of the full back quota, who helpfully plays LCB. That way you free a space up either way to get someone else in like an extra forward for example.

So in my mind in a 23 man squad your full back options are for example: Tierney, Hickey, Robbo, Patterson

The problem with that is Tierney shouldnt be playing LB even though he clearly can. Ie if Robertson gets injured during the 1st game. You dont want to move Tierney to LB and replace Tierney at LCB as nobody can play that role like he can. Likewise you wouldnt want to start the next game that way.

Tierney should be a CB and a CB only unless we decide to try 433 in which case you have more flexibility to have Robertson / Tierney. Hickey / Patterson as its unlikely Tierney would be played centre back in a 2.

[The Black Bra]

Has Tierney ever played as a centre back in a 2? 
Just wondering if he’s fit and plays on the left of a 3, what if we’re chasing a game, could we sacrifice a CB to bring on an attacking player? Meaning go to a back 4 with Tierney as the left CB.

[Diamond Scot]

54 minutes ago, The Black Bra said:

Has Tierney ever played as a centre back in a 2? 
Just wondering if he’s fit and plays on the left of a 3, what if we’re chasing a game, could we sacrifice a CB to bring on an attacking player? Meaning go to a back 4 with Tierney as the left CB.

Im pretty sure he has at some point in at least a game but cant recall him ever starting in a 2 with a back 4. 

Did he play CB in a friendly at Aberdeen or is my mind playing tricks on me?

[Tartan blood]

4 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

 

Tierney should be a CB and a CB only 

Why? If Robertson suddenly gets injured then I'd rather see McKenna take over at LCB and give Tierney the freedom that goes with left wing back. Why subdue him anymore than he needs to be?

Let's not forget why Tierney plays at LCB in the first place, to accommodate Robertson.

I think Tierney makes a great CB, but if the choice is LCB or LWB (assuming Robertson isn't available) I know where I'd be putting him.

[Diamond Scot]

1 hour ago, Tartan blood said:

Why? If Robertson suddenly gets injured then I'd rather see McKenna take over at LCB and give Tierney the freedom that goes with left wing back. Why subdue him anymore than he needs to be?

Let's not forget why Tierney plays at LCB in the first place, to accommodate Robertson.

I think Tierney makes a great CB, but if the choice is LCB or LWB (assuming Robertson isn't available) I know where I'd be putting him.

Because Tierney playing LCB is key to our formation and also its such a unique role, the way he plays it that other teams find it hard to defend against.

Anybody else we have tried to play LCB hasnt been a patch on Tierney and affects our entire team.

Tierney would play LB just aswell as Robertson. Its losing him at LCB thats the issue.

If Tierney isnt playing LCB for whatever reason then we could look at 433 with Barnes and Fraser as wingers. Leaving McGreggor, McTomminay and McGinn as the midfield 3 however this is pretty much untried and might have a negative impact on McGinn and McTomminays performances.

One this is certain. Playing 451 results in a bombscare and shouldnt be tried again unless we get a dedicated holding midfielder.

 

[BryanBlessed]

If Tierney is out he'll still play five at the back but the last time Robertson was out, and Tierney was playing, he played four at the back. I'd be surprised if, God forbid, Robertson being out leads to Greg Taylor or Josh Doig coming in and playing LWB with Tierney at LCB. In that scenarion, Clarke would probably revert to 4 at the back as he did in the UNL. The other option would be to play Hickey at LWB and have Patterson at RWB. I think the chances of Robertson being out are far smaller than the chances of Tierney being out, though.

 

 

[theabsentee]

On 2/26/2024 at 4:27 PM, DesiScotsman said:

I think you have it spot on there baring injuries of course as stated. I would go for the same selection with the two remaining places going to ideally two centre backs.

Hickey and Tierney are the two major doubts. Hickey has been injured since Oct and I don't think even his club manager knows when he is due to return. Tierney is massively injury prone and who knows if he can stay well clear of injuries between now and this summer.

What position is Archie Gray? I know he's English but qualifies to play for us through his dad & heard good positive reviews about him.

Archie plays right back but he switched to left back late on in Leeds last game assisted in a goal. Actually think the lads naturally a midfield player so he can play a few positions, as can Livramento so for us would be a huge coup to get either of them committed. Highly unlikely to happen sadly even though I'm sure Clarke & Co are trying.

[scotlad]

20 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

Im pretty sure he has at some point in at least a game but cant recall him ever starting in a 2 with a back 4. 

Did he play CB in a friendly at Aberdeen or is my mind playing tricks on me?

He did, aye, against the Netherlands. The game where Malky MacKay was in charge.

[Tartan blood]

17 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

Because Tierney playing LCB is key to our formation and also its such a unique role, the way he plays it that other teams find it hard to defend against.

Anybody else we have tried to play LCB hasnt been a patch on Tierney and affects our entire team.

Tierney would play LB just aswell as Robertson. Its losing him at LCB thats the issue.

If Tierney isnt playing LCB for whatever reason then we could look at 433 with Barnes and Fraser as wingers. Leaving McGreggor, McTomminay and McGinn as the midfield 3 however this is pretty much untried and might have a negative impact on McGinn and McTomminays performances.

One this is certain. Playing 451 results in a bombscare and shouldnt be tried again unless we get a dedicated holding midfielder.

 

All valid points and I can see where you are coming from. 

As BryanBlessed said, what if keeping Tierney at LCB means Taylor starts at LWB? I think I'd rather McKenna slotted in than Taylor, in that scenario at least.

 

[Diamond Scot]

46 minutes ago, Tartan blood said:

All valid points and I can see where you are coming from. 

As BryanBlessed said, what if keeping Tierney at LCB means Taylor starts at LWB? I think I'd rather McKenna slotted in than Taylor, in that scenario at least.

 

I dont think Taylor would start at LB. It would either be Hickey or Doig.

Personally I really like Tierney at LCB. I just feel it gives us something unique thats so hard to play against. How does a team setup to defend against a centre back overlapping the LB. 

McKenna just wouldnt play LCB the same way. Similar to how Copper couldnt. They are centre backs. I think Clarke will have learned this from past games and im sure he will have a plan in place if Tierney isnt available.

[Tartan blood]

14 hours ago, Diamond Scot said:

I dont think Taylor would start at LB. It would either be Hickey or Doig.

Personally I really like Tierney at LCB. I just feel it gives us something unique thats so hard to play against. How does a team setup to defend against a centre back overlapping the LB. 

McKenna just wouldnt play LCB the same way. Similar to how Copper couldnt. They are centre backs. I think Clarke will have learned this from past games and im sure he will have a plan in place if Tierney isnt available.

I see what you are saying. Plan B would ideally be having Tierney, Hickey and Patterson on the pitch. And may well be the long term outlook as Robbo is older than all of them.

Plan C is the problem. If Robertson and Hickey are unavailable. That's when you have to make unavoidable compromises that will weaken us. 

Robertson, Hickey and Tierney will all be fit for the Euros! I'm willing it! It's going to happen...