ShedTA Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 I see 25% of the fee received for 4 players being not retained by the club as massive, you've essentially lost one of those players for nothing. Also the 500k banded about as fair enough, in relation to Dundee United's turnover seems high too. does the 25% figure not include all commisions / agents fees, and the £500k above? quick maths would put £500k out of 6.5 million as less than 10%. the only contentious bit really is the 500k as I would imagine the rest is standard stuff on players transfers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenfrewBlue Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 So is Mr Thompson a glib and shameless liar? Just wondering.. ... ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamntg Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 I see 25% of the fee received for 4 players being not retained by the club as massive, you've essentially lost one of those players for nothing. Also the 500k banded about as fair enough, in relation to Dundee United's turnover seems high too. The 25% includes players cuts, agents, money due to QP for Andy Robertson and so on. The £500k - we don't know what it is so no rush to judgment - is high in relation to United's turnover, but maybe not in relation to £7.85m worth of transfer revenue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamntg Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 So is Mr Thompson a glib and shameless liar? Just wondering.. ... See you in court. (The charge is Baseless Whataboutery) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenfrewBlue Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 See you in court. (The charge is Baseless Whataboutery) No need for the kangaroo court, I'll plead guilty and save time. ?A few others on here could try being as honest! I'll put my fishing gear away for now, m'lud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShedTA Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 So is Mr Thompson a glib and shameless liar? Just wondering.. ... Yes but apparently he is allowed to be a Director in South Africa so its all ok. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenfrewBlue Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Yes but apparently he is allowed to be a Director in South Africa so its all ok.Does he have business interests in South Africa then? Did he make his money during Apartheid? Are you sure he's fit to be a director? All of these questions need answers, or at least made up to sound sensible. I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamntg Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Quality reporting from the BBC though. Dundee United fans' groups say they are "shocked" that over 25% of £6.3 million in transfer fees have been paid out in commission to unnamed parties. Arabtrust and the Federation of Dundee United Supporters Clubs expressed concern at the payments "We were shocked to find out that a huge amount of 'commission' has been paid to unnamed parties," a joint statement said. "We believe this figure to be in excess of £500,000." So, is it 25% of £6.3 million that has been paid to "unnamed parties" - I make that £1.575m - or is it 25% of £6.3m that has been paid to the players, their agents, other clubs (QP) and only £500k to "unnamed parties"? People just like to complain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larky Masher Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Do you get some special pleasure from trolling the internet insulting random strangers? I don't insult random strangers just self important fannies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamntg Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 I don't insult random strangers just self important fannies. Thanks for your input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cove_Sheep Posted April 2, 2015 Author Share Posted April 2, 2015 I don't insult random strangers just self important fannies. You can probably find help for your problem here then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 "Firstly, we were shocked to find out that a huge amount of commission has been paid to unnamed parties from the sale of 4 players Gauld, Robertson, Armstrong and Mackay-Steven. We believe this figure to be in excess of £500k. This does not include payments to players, agents or other clubs. When all of these various payments are totalled, over 25% of the £6.3m in fees received has not been kept in the club." These are the figures in the statement, and I'd say that 25% of that £6.3m not going to the club is large, I'm well aware that will include agent fees etc. taking these figures that'd roughly £1.6m missing from a total of 4 transfers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShedTA Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 "Firstly, we were shocked to find out that a huge amount of commission has been paid to unnamed parties from the sale of 4 players Gauld, Robertson, Armstrong and Mackay-Steven. We believe this figure to be in excess of £500k. This does not include payments to players, agents or other clubs. When all of these various payments are totalled, over 25% of the £6.3m in fees received has not been kept in the club." These are the figures in the statement, and I'd say that 25% of that £6.3m not going to the club is large, I'm well aware that will include agent fees etc. taking these figures that'd roughly £1.6m missing from a total of 4 transfers. not sure its "missing". I think the only money not there that you would have expected to be there is the £500k. the rest is inherant costs of transfers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 not sure its "missing". I think the only money not there that you would have expected to be there is the £500k. the rest is inherant costs of transfers. I'm not disputing if it's missing or not, but I would say 25% of Transfer fees not being held by the club is massive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShedTA Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 I'm not disputing if it's missing or not, but I would say 25% of Transfer fees not being held by the club is massive. well surely you would expect say 15% of transfer fees to go on fees/ commision to agents etc. anyway. so the £500k is only around another 10%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenfrewBlue Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 well surely you would expect say 15% of transfer fees to go on fees/ commision to agents etc. anyway. so the £500k is only around another 10%.Isn't that the type of accounting if reported at Rangers would have the hand wringers out in full force?In my humble opinion 25% of the sales going on fees is ridiculous but then again I'm a tight fisted b@stard. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parklife Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 You can probably find help for your problem here then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamntg Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 I'm not disputing if it's missing or not, but I would say 25% of Transfer fees not being held by the club is massive. Based on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenAngus Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Saw Chris Harvey speculating that maybe bank got a certain percentage of fees. I know that part of Aberdeen's deal with the bank is that the bank gets a cut of fees. Allegedly it was for 2 windows, 1 of which has passed and applied to players not brought through the club's youth system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShedTA Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Saw Chris Harvey speculating that maybe bank got a certain percentage of fees.I know that part of Aberdeen's deal with the bank is that the bank gets a cut of fees. Allegedly it was for 2 windows, 1 of which has passed and applied to players not brought through the club's youth system.[/quote Well the bank was due a cut of all transfers but not sure when that deal finished. I am sure they were due a slice of the Robertson and Gauls fees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobydoo Posted April 3, 2015 Share Posted April 3, 2015 aye it all needs to be in context. If this is a way of incentivising the coaching and management staff to discover young players, develop them and allow them to be sold so that the club can control and erradicate its debt then possibly its a decent plan. The worry might be that it leads to players being sold purely for monetary purposes rather than balancing out team requirements and maintaining a challenge in competitions. Exactly. Which is why there needs to be some form of clarity as to why the two were sold to the team who united were playing in a cup final a few weeks later. Were they sold because the manager genuinely thought the team could cope against the top team in Scotland, in a cup final, in neutral stadium () without them ( and he would be a complete ####wit to think this) or were they sold to line his pockets. Was the manager one of the unnamed investors and is getting his money back. Both United's and Arabtrust/ Feds handling of this has been shambolic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Posted April 3, 2015 Share Posted April 3, 2015 Based on? My own opinion, I would say in almost any business, giving away 25% of your proceeds is huge. I seriously doubt that it's normal for that percentage to be as high in normal transfer dealings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamntg Posted April 3, 2015 Share Posted April 3, 2015 My own opinion, I would say in almost any business, giving away 25% of your proceeds is huge. I seriously doubt that it's normal for that percentage to be as high in normal transfer dealings. You're entitled to your opinion. I've been speaking to some ArabTrust guys and while I think their statement is badly written, inflammatory and very short on detail, it seems there is more they know that they don't want/can't say. Slightly more concerned than I was before I spoke to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenAngus Posted April 3, 2015 Share Posted April 3, 2015 My own opinion, I would say in almost any business, giving away 25% of your proceeds is huge. I seriously doubt that it's normal for that percentage to be as high in normal transfer dealings. It all depends on the context of why and if it will continue or is a short term arrangement. As I posted above Aberdeen have an arrangement with the bank that they get a percentage of transfer fees for non academy players for the last transfer window and this summer one only. They are also entitled to an unspecified percentage from the sale of Pittodrie - unsure if that is timebound too - that partly explains why Aberdeen were able to do a deal with the bank. Back on Utd - my observation is that the club and fans always seemed to have a good relationship and were on the same wavelength. I doubt the fans groups put that statement out if the were not seriously concerned. Not convinced that the subsequent club statements made things any clearer either. Thought it was quite concerning that a club who have reduced costs by lowering wages and clearing debt interest payments are apparently looking to increase prices of season tickets and match day tickets. This the same club who have regularly voiced concerned at prices set for semi finals and finals. As we have seen recently to greater and lesser degrees us fans have little insight or influence to what really goes on behind closed doors at our clubs and I'm not convinced that fan ownership models would greatly change that either. I include my own club in that as they introduced huge price increases last season for season tickets with zero interaction with fans and in my opinion got some aspects badly wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenfrewBlue Posted April 3, 2015 Share Posted April 3, 2015 You're entitled to your opinion. I've been speaking to some ArabTrust guys and while I think their statement is badly written, inflammatory and very short on detail, it seems there is more they know that they don't want/can't say. Slightly more concerned than I was before I spoke to them. Is the concern financial or around the people? Doubt your club can match Rangers for drama and nonsense but are they about to try? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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