Plane Crash In French Alps

[Replay]

Mystery solved.

The Sun, once again, has cracked it. It was those pesky gay demons who were to blame...

How do they know his demons were gays? Were they well groomed? Big fans of Erasure?

[ParisInAKilt]

ex gf claims he said he would do something that would be 'remembered'

Sun headline is predictably ridiculous.

We'll never know what was going through the guys mind. The blaming depression angle isn't good.

No idea how the families get over something like this. I think an accident would be 'easier' to deal with.

[Tartan Monkey]

TM; really interesting reading this. If you have time I have a question about a pilot's approach & attitude to turbulence. I've been on a few flights, especially over the Pyrenees where the captain has advised that there was clear air turbulence & it might be bumpy. I know that it isn't going to bring the plane down but do you have official or unofficial thresholds around avoiding it? Would you ever ask for anything (increased altitude/different route for example) for the comfort of passengers or do you just take a view that you're going to get bounced around a bit & go straight into it?

On a more facetious note, when are they going to do something about the flight deck public address systems? I can hear perfectly well when they are trying to flog me the latest must have from Christian Dior but can never hear the really interesting stuff about the flight.

We tend to avoid anything predicting severe turbulence. It's difficult to define a threshold as such, partly in that some forms of turbulence are difficult to forecast. Some is associated with strong winds such as a jet stream over high terrain, as in the Pyrenees or the Alps. As its "clear air" turbulence we can't see it either on our weather radar or out the window. This obviously makes it much more tricky to avoid. In this case we rely on the weather forecasts en route, experience and our knowledge of met phenomena and on a measure on our flight plan called the shear rate. This is a ratio of changing temperature over a given altitude. So a 2 on the flight plan is faily benign, a 10 is probably moderate to severe turbulence. Sometimes we have a 3 predicted and encounter moderate turbulence, sometimes with a 10 we get nothing. Weather is hard to predict and is a dynamic thing, so really it's a best guess. As for what we do about it. Well if it's associated with precipitation such as a thunderstorm we will fly around it and avoid. Sometimes that means being 100 miles off track (as was the case last night) to avoid the storm.

As you suggest we can change level by climbing or descending. Climbing can send us into clear air above any clouds, however it also reduces our aerodynamic margin. At high levels and high weights there is very little margin between stall speed and overspeed. This margin narrows as we climb and is, rather ominously known in aerodynamic terms as "coffin corner". So in unstable, turbulent air, climbing isn't always the best option. Sometimes we have to just sit with the turbulence and plough on through, but we certainly do all we can to avoid it. It's no fun for us either I can assure you.

So on the whole we will avoid turbulence if we can, however it may not always be possible. We will always avoid thunder storms as they can seriously impact the performance of the aeroplane, and can in fact cause structural damage and even break up of the aeroplane. So when we make that PA welcoming you all on board and suggest you keep your seatbelt fastened even when the sign is off........ We really do mean it!

As for the PA volume, it really depends on who is speaking on it. Sometimes the pilots are using their headset and the mic might not be picking everything up. A hand mic tends to work better and that's what the cabin crew use which is why you always hear the duty free goodies.

TM.

[Flora MaDonald]

The ex-girlfriend is allegedly having his child.

[Flure]

David Alexander ‏@dakeay

Daily Mail says no-one with depression should be allowed to pilot. Makes a change from it saying that everyone with depression is fit for work

[scoobydoo]

As you suggest we can change level by climbing or descending. Climbing can send us into clear air above any clouds, however it also reduces our aerodynamic margin. At high levels and high weights there is very little margin between stall speed and overspeed. This margin narrows as we climb and is, rather ominously known in aerodynamic terms as "coffin corner". So in unstable, turbulent air, climbing isn't always the best option. Sometimes we have to just sit with the turbulence and plough on through, but we certainly do all we can to avoid it. It's no fun for us either I can assure you.

KInda wish I hadn't read this.

[DonnyMac]

it's being reported now that he also had a detached retina as well.

[Flora MaDonald]

it's being reported now that he also had a detached retina as well.

Aye, saw that. He thought he was going blind. Unbelievable. WTF were Lüfthansa playing at?

[scoobydoo]

They didn't know, he hid it from them.

[Tartan Monkey]

KInda wish I hadn't read this.

?

Edited March 30, 2015 by Tartan Monkey

[tartandon]

The ex-girlfriend is allegedly having his child.

were the gay demons involved in this immaculate conception?

[tartandon]

Aye, saw that. He thought he was going blind. Unbelievable. WTF were Lüfthansa playing at?

clearly possessed by gay demons.

[tartandon]

[Flora MaDonald]

They didn't know, he hid it from them.

Surely they have mandatory regular eye tests?

[Charlie Endell]

I've never had my eyes checked.

They've always been plain brown.

[scoobydoo]

I think mandatory breath tests would be better.

[DonnyMac]

Wit, check that they are breathing?

I suppose it makes sense as some of those stewardesses look like plastic dolls

[Flora MaDonald]

Wit, check that they are breathing?

I suppose it makes sense as some of those stewardesses look like plastic dolls

So do the stewards.

[Huddersfield]

We tend to avoid anything predicting severe turbulence. It's difficult to define a threshold as such, partly in that some forms of turbulence are difficult to forecast. Some is associated with strong winds such as a jet stream over high terrain, as in the Pyrenees or the Alps. As its "clear air" turbulence we can't see it either on our weather radar or out the window. This obviously makes it much more tricky to avoid. In this case we rely on the weather forecasts en route, experience and our knowledge of met phenomena and on a measure on our flight plan called the shear rate. This is a ratio of changing temperature over a given altitude. So a 2 on the flight plan is faily benign, a 10 is probably moderate to severe turbulence. Sometimes we have a 3 predicted and encounter moderate turbulence, sometimes with a 10 we get nothing. Weather is hard to predict and is a dynamic thing, so really it's a best guess. As for what we do about it. Well if it's associated with precipitation such as a thunderstorm we will fly around it and avoid. Sometimes that means being 100 miles off track (as was the case last night) to avoid the storm.

As you suggest we can change level by climbing or descending. Climbing can send us into clear air above any clouds, however it also reduces our aerodynamic margin. At high levels and high weights there is very little margin between stall speed and overspeed. This margin narrows as we climb and is, rather ominously known in aerodynamic terms as "coffin corner". So in unstable, turbulent air, climbing isn't always the best option. Sometimes we have to just sit with the turbulence and plough on through, but we certainly do all we can to avoid it. It's no fun for us either I can assure you.

So on the whole we will avoid turbulence if we can, however it may not always be possible. We will always avoid thunder storms as they can seriously impact the performance of the aeroplane, and can in fact cause structural damage and even break up of the aeroplane. So when we make that PA welcoming you all on board and suggest you keep your seatbelt fastened even when the sign is off........ We really do mean it!

As for the PA volume, it really depends on who is speaking on it. Sometimes the pilots are using their headset and the mic might not be picking everything up. A hand mic tends to work better and that's what the cabin crew use which is why you always hear the duty free goodies.

TM.

Thanks for the reply; really interesting reading. I love the'coffin corner' bit; the next time my terrified of flying wife is clinging on to my hand in a cold sweat I might just mention it in passing

[Tartan Monkey]

Surely they have mandatory regular eye tests?

Eye tests every year under 60 during medical. Over 60 the eye tests and medical are every 6 months.

[Tartan Monkey]

I think mandatory breath tests would be better.

All Middle Eastern airlines, and several worldwide airports and airlines employ random breath and drug testing.

[scoobydoo]

Interesting. When I go to work away from home I get tested every day. Normally at 5.30 am

[Toepoke]

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/567196/Video-Germanwings-co-pilot-training

[Kirk]

I am serious. Aircraft flying is already unmanned but 'supervised' - it is not a requirement for a successful flight to have a pilot in there. The only real value is to calm irrational passengers who think he does something useful.

The pilot can't actually do more than a flight computer can (actually usually less) and the whole thing could be controlled remotely anyway.

If the pilot becomes ill or insane his role as supervisor is a threat to the safety of passengers. Why not lock the flight deck and then neither terrorists nor mad pilots can control the plane and we will all be a little safer.

You may think its bonkers but in 15-20 years we'll all be getting in autonomous cars, trains and planes and you wont think twice about it. Car safety protocols and ECUs are not yet developed to the same safety standards as planes and trains but they will be there in about 3-5 years.

Ill have some of what you are having. Make it a double in fact, its been hard day.

[Toepoke]

Key evidence found but something I certainly wouldn't want to watch....

http://metro.co.uk/2015/03/31/germanwings-flight-9525-cabin-video-shows-final-moments-before-crash-5129842/