How Are Yessers Coping With No Voters

[Guest Extreme0]

I don't disagree that the SNP favours towards the left-center of politics the best they can without leaning towards either side or that they sometimes make suggestions which seems something a right-wing party would propose.

The SNP in itself is a party that will stick to the center while attending to the populist agenda they have always had...which to say isn't a bad thing as it means that they are more focused on listening to actual people rather then the ruling elite, just depends on what the subject is and how people view it that will make them go with the few things that the public would like to hear.

(This unfortunately gets exploited by the media a lot hence why UKIP are getting as much airtime as possible to fuel their agenda while proclaiming they are listening to the 'people' of England. The media companies behind it are the real issue)

Comparing the SNP to Tories isn't a great comparision because of how the latter is more rooted in traditional conservatism with hints of liberialness which is home to many right-winged policies and people while the former is made up of different people with different politcal agendas in the center spectrum weighing on either side or just the radical center.

In the end, they are trying to please every member & voter while retaining the populist formula of applying policies which is the hot shit of the moment. Which would explain why they are getting a surge of people from all of the two main parties (Liberial & Labour) because they are disconnected from their roots so much.

[Scunnered]

So that will be why we spend more on public services than they are south of the border then?

And if it had been true, then where the feck would that have put Labour FFS?

Not everything comes down to 'what Labour would do'.

Again.

1. The Scottish government are cutting £500m from public spending to provide £600m in tax relief for businesses.

2. The SNP are prioritising securing corporation tax powers to implement an economic plan which WILL cripple the public sector.

I'm going to keep repeating these two statements until people think "wait a minute, that's not on".

[Scunnered]

I don't disagree that the SNP favours towards the left-center of politics the best they can without leaning towards either side or that they sometimes make suggestions which seems something a right-wing party would propose.

The SNP in itself is a party that will stick to the center while attending to the populist agenda they have always had...which to say isn't a bad thing as it means that they are more focused on listening to actual people rather then the ruling elite, just depends on what the subject is and how people view it that will make them go with the few things that the public would like to hear.

(This unfortunately gets exploited by the media a lot hence why UKIP are getting as much airtime as possible to fuel their agenda while proclaiming they are listening to the 'people' of England. The media companies behind it are the real issue)

Comparing the SNP to Tories isn't a great comparision because of how the latter is more rooted in traditional conservatism with hints of liberialness which is home to many right-winged policies and people while the former is made up of different people with different politcal agendas in the center spectrum weighing on either side or just the radical center.

In the end, they are trying to please every member & voter while retaining the populist formula of applying policies which is the hot shit of the moment. Which would explain why they are getting a surge of people from all of the two main parties (Liberial & Labour) because they are disconnected from their roots so much.

Excellent post, and one that touches on the heat of my issue. IF the SNP will indeed listen to the people why are the membership not bringing up these two very important points that this humble socialist is banging on about? They are not acceptable and they sure as hell aren't to the peoples benefit.

[Guest Extreme0]

2. The SNP are prioritising securing corporation tax powers to implement an economic plan which WILL cripple the public sector.

You would think that the three main parties in the Smith Commision would of actually allowed that...especially the tories who love to cut corporation tax. (But then again...some other party might get in and *gasp* raise the coporation tax!)

[scotlad]

I'm not fishing

And I'm serious. Are we to believe that the SNP know the secret to making an economic theory work that has crippled the poor of every country that has tried it? Are we that naive?

If the economic policy is accompanied by social policy which is designed to support working people, e.g. a decent minimum wage and stronger TU representation, then perhaps it could work. Perhaps. Scotland needs more high value jobs rather than low pay/low skill service sector jobs; we have plenty of those already and look where it has got us. One of the reasons why I am sceptical about the SNP's corporation tax policy is I suspect it will mainly attract companies intent on creating precisely that kind of employment.

Labour had a great opportunity to test this theory in the '90s but they let big business off the hook by setting the minimum wage too low and introduced the tax credits system as a sop.

[Scunnered]

If the economic policy is accompanied by social policy which is designed to support working people, e.g. a decent minimum wage and stronger TU representation, then perhaps it could work. Perhaps. Scotland needs more high value jobs rather than low pay/low skill service sector jobs; we have plenty of those already and look where it has got us. One of the reasons why I am sceptical about the SNP's corporation tax policy is I suspect it will mainly attract companies intent on creating precisely that kind of employment.Labour had a great opportunity to test this theory in the '90s but they let big business off the hook by setting the minimum wage too low and introduced the tax credits system as a sop.

That's a wish list up there with my Socialist paradise that I get thrown at me on here

[weekevie04]

Excellent post, and one that touches on the heat of my issue. IF the SNP will indeed listen to the people why are the membership not bringing up these two very important points that this humble socialist is banging on about? They are not acceptable and they sure as hell aren't to the peoples benefit.

The membership is still very raw. And there is a lot of good will to the SNP after our loss. I am a new SNP member and will back/follow any 'left' leaning issues we do. I think much of the new membership although is from the left, will be broad and indepdnence supporters.

Nicola is shouting some great lines though. Land Reform Act is absolutley terrific and if the Tories are calling it ''terrifying'' then I think that's something we can all be proud of.

My SSP pal is voting SNP next year and I'll give them first vote in 2016.

Let' see what happens, but I bet Nicola takes us more left than anything nu Labour/Eck gave us.

Bide yer time.

[Lamia]

Apologies my dear, I was suffering from the post effects of Sunday dinner at my parents.

I'm not avoiding the question... Well I am in a way I guess because I've answered it before, in one of my many, many posts praising the SNP's governance of Holyrood.

Return of Your Maw. I've said it numerous times now, the SNP are being compared to the Tories (and rightly so) because they are determined to follow an economic plan that favours capital at the severe detriment of public services, the working class and the poor. You don't get much more Tory than that.

I think you're local to me? I'm speaking at a 'Yes event' on Tuesday where I'll tell a room full of SNP supporters that the 45 have lost touch with their priority, improving Scotland. Feel free to bring your own pitchfork

I think if you take ALL their policies together they are centre not right. And as I said the Labour Party cut corporation tax so don't think one policy makes you a Tory

Sadly I don't think I am local so will wave a virtual pitchfork instead

Edited December 1, 2014 by Lamia

[Flure]

I think if you take ALL their policies together they are centre not right. And as I said the Labour Party cut corporation tax so don't think one policy makes you a Tory

Sadly I don't think I am local so will wave a virtual pitchfork instead

What a stupid, stupid statement.

Everybody is local.

To somewhere.

[Lamia]

What a stupid, stupid statement.

Everybody is local.

To somewhere.

Local to George

[Scunnered]

I think if you take ALL their policies together they are centre not right. And as I said the Labour Party cut corporation tax so don't think one policy makes you a Tory

Sadly I don't think I am local so will wave a virtual pitchfork instead

Ok, we'll agree it doesn't make you a Tory... But it certainly doesn't make you centre. They aim to cut corp tax to Northern Ireland levels, poverty in N.I has increased as a direct consequence of the cut, and dependency on the state has increased dramatically, as it always does with corp tax cuts.

As one board member from N.I said, it's "brutal to be poor here".

That's the current vision for Scotland

[Flure]

poverty in N.I has increased as a direct consequence of the cut(

Hmmmm Edited December 1, 2014 by Flure

[Flure]

poverty in N.I has increased as a direct consequence of the cut(

Source?

[Scunnered]

Source?

I'm talking cos I've got my Ireland's mixed up

I was talking to a friend about N.I's proposed cut at the time so mixed them up here.

Sub all mentions of N.I in my last post to the republic, and no offence to my Ulster friends.

But yeah, the direct link between the Celtic Tiger period and the increase of poverty in Ireland is well documented. I've a report from the Irish TU's that I'll look out later.

The fella I'm discussing N.I is convinced a corp tax cut would be great for an independent Scotland for decreasing inequality... He asked me "has it ever been tried in an oil rich country?"

[Orraloon]

Ok, we'll agree it doesn't make you a Tory... But it certainly doesn't make you centre. They aim to cut corp tax to Northern Ireland levels, poverty in N.I has increased as a direct consequence of the cut, and dependency on the state has increased dramatically, as it always does with corp tax cuts.

As one board member from N.I said, it's "brutal to be poor here".

That's the current vision for Scotland

Can you tell me what the current rate of Corporation Tax is in NI.

[Orraloon]

Can you tell me what the current rate of Corporation Tax is in NI.

Oops, forget that.

[Scunnered]

Can you tell me what the current rate of Corporation Tax is in NI.

21%

[Orraloon]

21%

I must learn to read to the end of threads before posting.

[Scunnered]

I must learn to read to the end of threads before posting.

I must learn not to mix conversations

[Scunnered]

I'm going to submit a poll request to gauge the board opinion on whether you support the SNP's plan for 'economic growth'. Surely you's all can't be off your nut?

Edited December 1, 2014 by Scunnered

[Orraloon]

I'm going to submit a poll request to gauge the board opinion on whether you support the SNP's plan for 'economic growth'. Surely you's all can't be off your nut? .

Put me doon for YES, YES.

[Scunnered]

Put me doon for YES, YES.

Just had a thought. Remember Noam Chomsky's intervention?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7UtwZD4c-A

Listen to the answer he gives on the very first question. I would like to see the uncut version, as I reckon it would have been pretty damning on this very subject.

[Orraloon]

Just had a thought. Remember Noam Chomsky's intervention?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7UtwZD4c-A

Listen to the answer he gives on the very first question. I would like to see the uncut version, as I reckon it would have been pretty damning on this very subject.

But you are trying to tell us that if she had the power (which she doesn't), Nicola would be more right wing than Thatcher. Why would "International Capitalism" not like that?

[Scunnered]

But you are trying to tell us that if she had the power (which she doesn't), Nicola would be more right wing than Thatcher. Why would "International Capitalism" not like that?

I don't think I've mentioned Thatcher? Chomsky says in the video "International capitalism would like it" in regards to independence, I reckon he was referring to the SNP's plan.

[Orraloon]

I don't think I've mentioned Thatcher? Chomsky says in the video "International capitalism would like it" in regards to independence, I reckon he was referring to the SNP's plan.

I thought he said "International Capitalism ain't gonna like it". He needs to learn to speak proper.