Hertsscot

Well it is, for now but the will of people can change, that's why we have elections, that's democracy and democracy doesn't exclude trying to get people to change their mind. Daft statement by the Beeb

I think it would be quite easy but effective to get hold of quotes from many No politicians and juxtapose them with the reality and then just ask the question would you trust this man? e.g Brown's remarks about tranplants etc. Labour and Tory politicians cosying up to one another would look good as well!

Don't care if it's all SNP or a broad alliance, it's essential that the Yes vote is not split. The No campaigners can fight it out amongst themselves, there's a bigger stake at prize for us.

Great poster, very encouraging to see people doing something rather than just feeling sorry for themselves or just playing some sort of blame game

Just make sure she joins some trade union and not leave altogether, individual members contribute very little financially to Labour but obviously there's a lot of individual members and people opting out of the political fund would undoubtedly hurt Labour

Crazy thing is all this talk about "extra powers" which English MPs are kicking up such fuss about will, in all probability, fall a long way short of Devo Max but no-one asks whether the Scottish people actually want extra powers which may well turn out to be a huge great millstone massive ound their neck. I don't understand how WM based parties can put together these 'powers', whatever they might be, when they don't know which powers the people of Scotland actually want and when Scots voters can't really say whether they're happy to have them. Only logical conclusion surely is that despite the rhetoric they don't care about what Scotland wants, they got their No vote and that was the only thing they were ever interested in. I'd be particularly grateful if anyone who voted No (and I appreciate that might not be easy to say on this board at this time - except for the obvious trolls) could explain how they see this and whether this is what they wanted.

Anyone in a trade union actually emailed/written in to say they want to opt out of the poitical fund? I'd like to but my union doesn't give money to any political party, shame I would have enjoyed opting out and telling why.

Just as well, mine have nose dived but as Eddard said that's not the issue

Thanks for the replies, I now feel somewhat clearer on the issues and I'll promise to pay more attention next time.

Recycled material that has been proven to be a misinterpretation of the counters actions. There's two problems with conspiracy theories: 1) They are in most cases a complete load of nonsense 2) The fact that almost all of them are a complete load of tosh doesn't mean that they never happen For my part I think there are much more obvious reasons why there was a victory for the No campaign which can be explained without reference to such theories. Unless there is very unambiguous and solid evidence for vote rigging it just deflects from real analysis of why 55% of the vote went for No. If we are to win independece then we need to look at the real causes why the referendum was lost and not spurious rumours.

Even as a Rangers supporter, maybe especially as a Rangers supporter, I'd endorse that sentiment.

Precisely, one egg gets thrown and its headline news, near riot breaks out in the middle of Glasgow, saltires getting burned and not a peep. Doesn't suit the agenda of Scots nationalism bad, British nationalism good.

Friday felt ashamed, felt couldn't sing it given what had just happened. Come the Georgia game I'm going to be singing it, if others want to feel embarressed by the words so be it.

Also practically whose more likely to drag us into some dodgy war?

Thats why we need something that is based in Scotland. We need analysis on why people voted No but undoubtedly tv and newspaper views helped massively. Were Yes voters more in touch with new media whereas No voters simply more reliant on old media? I don't know but a less one-sided media would have helped. There would certainly appear to be a market for a popular paper that appeals to a broad church and challenges the No line. I don't know whether that could be in place for the next referedum but what what we do need is to hold Cameron, Clegg etc accountable for their vow and that process of holding them to account can't just be done or shared by preaching to the converted, we somehow need to get that message out ot the 55.

Okay I feel like the kid in class who was daydreaming at the important bit and wasn't really paying full attention. What are the key differences between the original proposals for Devo max and what was offered via the front page of the Record?

How widely has this been condemned in the media, certainly haven't seen much reporting of it in England. Would be nice to hear some Unionist politicians condemning this in public.

Don't know what to think on this one. Given the mess at the minute it looks like it wasn't thought through at all, on the other hand there was the video clip of an Alan Bissett speech where he pretty much predicted that an option that would be spun as Devo max would be back on the agenda..

More snouts round the trough seems to be pretty much the verdict of north east voters when Prescott suggested the idea of a regional assembly.

Can't you just see the Daily Mail headlines, Evil cybernats wish early death to old folk!

Good stuff Perth and would be great to see some photos. 45%, in the face of media bombardment and outright lies and scaremongering, voted for change. WM parties want nothing better than for us to walk away, ain't going to happen.

Absolutely. Friday was one of the worst days of my life minus bereavements. I've been committed to Scottish independence since I was a student (and thats a considerbale while back). I've seem a movement of hope for a better nation get battered and lied to, get swamped by an Establishment machine funded by the WM elite and their cronies and I feel joining the SNP is the very east I can do to stand with all of those who voted for change. If you believe in it just join.

Good stuff Fringo. If we had won by a vote, I would have been ecstatic but we still would have had a divided and hurting nation. We need to build bridges not ditches and also get some of our friends and family and workmates to leave their fears behind and walk across and join us.

Why?